Wanna take a shot at IDing this?? Spreading fast...

[Tomatovator]

So far this is just on one of my Ramapo plants but it seems to be moving fast. What is it? Can I cure it? I've been spraying Daconil since before it showed up. No help. I really don't want to loose this plant. I got my first one pounder off of it today and it is loaded with fruit. Thanks in advance.

[hasshoes]

The leaf with the yellow blotches looks like powdery mildew. Both in the first pic and on the very bottom poking up in the third.

Can't say about the other spots, my powdery mildew doesn't look like that :0) though it is spreading crazy fast. I'm assuming PA has had similar weather as MA? Perfect conditions for PM, alas. If anyone confirms it is PM you should try Exel LG that is what worked for Ray. :0) Good luck.

[rnewste]

In my view, if Daconil is having no effect, then I would conclude it is insect related. Looks like the similar pattern I am seeing in California with guys called Psyllids. You probably do not have the same insects at your location, but is does look like something is eating into the leaves.

Time to try a spray or dusting of Sevin.

Raybo

[Tomatovator]

Raybo, Initially I thought it was flea Beetles but I sprayed for them several times and -- no effect. I will try some Copper Sulfide tonight. Thanks guys.

[Tomatovator]

Heather, The first pic and the third are of the same leaves. I think copper works on PM so I'll try it tonight. thanks.

[carolyn137]

Originally Posted by Tomatovator

Heather, The first pic and the third are of the same leaves. I think copper works on PM so I'll try it tonight. thanks.

Daconil also works on PM but I'm not so sure that's it.

I see puddling of Daconil and at the bottom of the one picture I see a bug with four white dots in its back. What's that and if so which specific lesions are being talked about b'c I don't see anything very specific.

Yes, both cataract surgeries are scheduled in a couple of months but I'm seeing this up close and the left eye is still pretty good.

[Tomatovator]

Carolyn, That's not a bug. Its just the chair under the leaf (it does look like a bug but it is just an empty spot in the leaf with the chair in the background). The lesions I'm concerned about are the little spots that look like the leaves have been speckled with something. What do you think I should try?? Ain't no bugs on me.

[carolyn137]

Originally Posted by Tomatovator

Carolyn, That's not a bug. Its just the chair under the leaf (it does look like a bug but it is just an empty spot in the leaf with the chair in the background). The lesions I'm concerned about are the little spots that look like the leaves have been speckled with something. What do you think I should try?? Ain't no bugs on me.

OK, a chair, not a bug.

Yes, the leaves look like they have "stuff" on them, I agree, but the magnification is so great that I can't help thinking it's just "stuff" that blew in. I can't see anything that reminds me of any disease in terms of distinct lesions.

As for the thrips, there are many genera and species of them and the two that are most associated with TSWD are the Western Thrip and the Onion thrip and they aren't found in the north.

You haven't spoken of any other symptoms such as wilting, change in leaf color, lack of blossoms, no fruit set, indeed everything seems to be progressing OK as far as I can see.

There are two forms of Powdery Mildew and I don't see any evidence of either one. In all the years I've grown tomatoes not once in my zone 5 area have I ever seen powdery mildew on tomato plants.

Yes, on zinnia's and Monarda and Roses and phlox, etc., but the pathogens that cause PM on those ornamentals are completely different from the ones that can cause problems with tomatoes, etc.

So if you could say anything more about this plant that I asked about, that might help, but right now I don't have any other good suggestions.

[svalli]

Looks same as thrip damage on my indoor peppers. If you look closely you can see the thrip larvae on the leaves. There are two clearly visible on the last picture.

Sari

[kdoble]

Yikes -- I didn't think thrips lived in the northern states. I was under the impression they were primarily a southern problem. Just out of curiosity Tomatovator, is there any damage on your tomatoes or just the leaves?

[hasshoes]

Yeah, I looked again my powdery mildew covers the whole leaf, not just the edges. I thought flea beetles at first too until I remembered they make much "cleaner" holes.

Thrips in the north? Just what we need- tomato spotted wilt to stress over too. :0P

Good luck with them. I seem to remember that reflective silver mulch helps deter them. Depending on the size of your plants, extra alluminum baking pans might work. I used pie tins for aphids one year and it worked great, only problem was the tins damaged the stem in the wind- so stake with a toothpick etc if you go that route. Of course, being that it's a warm season, your plants are probably already huge and you'd probably be better off spraying things like crazy. :0)

I've also seen sticky "thrip traps" but I don't know if they work. Good luck :0)

[hasshoes]

Google "thrip damage" the look on images. LOL- now I think I have them too! Which means that neem hasn't been super effective and I need to fish out the DE.

[Tomatovator]

The fruits are great looking and the plant is growing well. This is the third year in a row I got these little spots on the leaves. Last year I thought it was from my neighbor power washing his patio but he didn't do it this year. They start at the back end of the patch that is closely bordered on by Crown Vetch and assorted weeds. As the summer progresses so do the speckles. I just keep cutting the affected leaves off the best I can. I still get a very good yield from the plants. Now I'm thinking it is environmental as we live pretty close to some steel mills that spew out who knows what from time to time.

[RandyG]

The damage to the leaves is from feeding by western flower thrips, which also transmit TSWV. This species of thrips is becoming an increasing problem in many areas and was spread several years ago through shipments of greenhouse grown potted plants and bedding plants throughout the country. The small black spots on the leaves around the feed areas is frass from the thrips. Western flower thrips feed on fruit in addition to the foliage and get inside the flowers. If you hold a white piece of paper under a flower cluster and tap the cluster, you will dislodge the thrips and can see the larvae crawling around on the paper. Feeding on fruits results in a light area (hard to see) on the skin on green fruit. When the fruit ripen, the flesh beneath the thrips feeding area remains white and the white showing through the yellow skin color produces small areas of gold fleck on the fruit shoulders. Where one fruit rests against another, the thrips hide in that area and feed in a circle to produce a gold ring pattern on the fruit.The also hide under the sepals and sometimes you see a gold area at the stem when you remove the stem from the fruit. Transmission of TSWV depends on the immature thrips picking up th virus from an infected host plant and transmitting it to the tomato plant when the adult thrips first land on the tomato plant and starts feeding. Incidence in northern areas may come from the plants becoming infested in the greenhouse when grown along side other plants already infested.

[carolyn137]

Originally Posted by RandyG

The damage to the leaves is from feeding by western flower thrips, which also transmit TSWV. This species of thrips is becoming an increasing problem in many areas and was spread several years ago through shipments of greenhouse grown potted plants and bedding plants throughout the country. The small black spots on the leaves around the feed areas is frass from the thrips. Western flower thrips feed on fruit in addition to the foliage and get inside the flowers. If you hold a white piece of paper under a flower cluster and tap the cluster, you will dislodge the thrips and can see the larvae crawling around on the paper. Feeding on fruits results in a light area (hard to see) on the skin on green fruit. When the fruit ripen, the flesh beneath the thrips feeding area remains white and the white showing through the yellow skin color produces small areas of gold fleck on the fruit shoulders. Where one fruit rests against another, the thrips hide in that area and feed in a circle to produce a gold ring pattern on the fruit.The also hide under the sepals and sometimes you see a gold area at the stem when you remove the stem from the fruit. Transmission of TSWV depends on the immature thrips picking up th virus from an infected host plant and transmitting it to the tomato plant when the adult thrips first land on the tomato plant and starts feeding. Incidence in northern areas may come from the plants becoming infested in the greenhouse when grown along side other plants already infested.

Thanks so much for your expertise.

I knew the two main thrips associated with TSWV but it looks like you're suggesting that the area of possible TSWV has now moved north, at least to PA in this case.

In all my years of growing tomatoes in upstate NY I've never had a thrip problem, but perhaps your post also suggests that if shipped in plants carried the Western Thrip that it could be almost anywhere now.I know I could look it up but you're so handy, , is it possible for the thrips to overwinter or is it usually new infections each season?

From hearing Craig in Raleigh and Lee and others in NC it seems that some years TSWV is bad and other years none at all.