BER on several plants and other diseases

newgardener_tx · May 17, 2009

Growing tomato is never easy. Today I picked a lot of fruits with black spots on the bottom-end of the tomatoes. One is Jubilee growing in pot, the others are cherokee green, ARGG and black Krim in the same raised bed. Other plants such as cherokee purple, cherokee chocolate and black cherry in the same bed are OK. I planted them and water them always the same. Those three plants with BER look very healthy but with very few fruits and they all with BER. I will throw some bone meal to them to see any help.

A very healthy black cherry (my biggest plant, ~ 8 feet tall) in a different plot just wilted with hundreds of tomatoes on it. It just died with green leaf! Then a cherokee Chocolate next to it died in the same way in two days. Other plants around them are OK so far.

Two brandywine plants so far set me one fruit. I will give it up next year no matter how good it taste.

The big beef and celebrity are loaded with nice sized fruits. Maybe I should cut back all these heirlooms and give more cresits to hybrids.
newgardener_TX

newatthiskat · May 17, 2009

Don't give up on the heirlooms just yet. I have only a few fruitset on my hybrids but my white queen has about 42 fruit set on it with no BER. I have noticed that my black krim and and now brad's black heart are the most prone to BER in my garden. It will take a few seasond to figure out what does best in your garden
Kat

dice · May 18, 2009

Well, you have probably read about all of the possible BER
causes. Having enough calcium (lime and/or gypsum, depending
on your soil pH, provide calcium; rock phosphate and bone meal
have a fair amount of calcium, too; all of these take some time
to break down in the soil, figure 6 weeks minimum) is the first
prerequisite for avoiding BER. Second, the soil needs to be
moist for the plants to be able to absorb calcium from it (has
to be in solution). Third, the more even the soil moisture levels,
the less prone to BER they are. Big swings from saturated to
bone dry and back again during fruit set and development tend
to make BER more common.

Finally, excess nitrogen tends to make it worse. That makes the
plant put on vegetative growth faster, and what calcium it does
take up tends to end up in new leaves, starving the fruit for it.

I just assume that some plant or other is going to show some
BER every year (my Black Krim never did have it last year,
but I did have it on a few Gregori's Altai and County Agent
fruits, and an occasional New Yorker, Sophie's Choice, etc).

The sudden wilt sounds like one of the following: a disease
attacking the roots (like verticillium or fusarium, more likely
fusarium at your temperatures); bacterial wilt (look for
a discolored area down low on the stems; you put a piece
of cut stem from a wilted section in a glass of water, and
if a milky discharge comes out of it, that is a sign of
bacterial wilt; I don't think there is a cure); a stem borer in
the main stem below any of the branches (look for a hole);
or a gopher or vole eating the roots. I would expect roots
restricted by root knot nematodes to develop wilting symptoms
a little more gradually, where the plant simply eventually
outgrows the root system. (It usually does not go from perfectly
healthy to wilting in the middle of the day overnight.)

Suze · May 18, 2009

In the general area, the weather has been extremely conducive to BER lately. Early onset of 90's heat (late Apr or early May) stresses the young plants right when they are setting and developing a lot of their first flush of fruit, ugh! + no rain of note since the downpour (I got 5" here) about 3 weeks or so ago. Less than 1/2 inch the other day.

Putting down bone meal isn't going to help. It takes a while to break down, and I figure your main problem is what I mentioned above anyway - uneven water + early heat stress.

Good deep root structure is key in limiting or preventing it, especially in a hot climate. Water deeply and infrequently, especially early on - to force transplants to drive their roots deep. Mulch heavily as soon as you plant out to limit evaporation and keep the roots cool. Set transplants very deep - when planting, strip off most of the lower leaves. Soak planting area well - apply enough water so that the transplants are not only watered in, but there are also several inches of water below the root zone (for the roots to grow down into.)

A common mistake is to overlove the transplants after they are planted out, watering them several times a week and/or overfertilizing. This can cause problems down the road - because plants end up with a shallow root structure that won't take stress well here once any sort of heat or dry weather kicks in. Then one might end up with a lot of BER, weak, disease susceptible plants, and so on. Dunno if this was your problem, but I thought I would mention it anyway just in case.

Hang in there, and don't give up. We've got some cooler weather now, and that will help the plants set some more before it gets hot again (I hope!)

Suze · May 18, 2009

Oh, about the wilt - forgot that. We really don't have probs in the area with fusarium or verticillium (systemic fungal wilts) at all. Also, bacterial wilts are rather rare.

Root knot nematodes (which can be a problem in the area) can cause wilting, but it would be gradual, and you would likely see some stunting or yellowing of the plants first.

I would tend to think an insect or critter damaged the roots or stem, or (maybe) the plants were allowed to get too dry in the root zone and and couldn't recover. Quick wilting can also be caused by extreme overwatering or very poor drainage, but that would be less likely considering our recent weather unless you were just watering a whole lot - like maybe every or every other day.

newgardener_tx · May 19, 2009

Thank you Suze, Dice and Kat. That makes me feel better. Thank you to spend time to analyze the issue and give me all the possible explanation and suggestion. Learning something everyday. Most likely my BER is from extra nitrogen since my plants look so healthy, 6-8 feet tall but very few fruits. Then those few ones get BER. The wilted one is a myth. Never showed any sign, just wilted, not even yellow leaves. Probably some bugs got into the stem and killed it like SVB.

Anyway some good signs too. I am starting to harvest sungold, sweet million, sweet gold (taste vert sweet, maybe better than sungold with thinner skin), juliet, sweet chelssa and lemon boy. Saw one Cherokee Purple changing color. Can't wait.

May 17, 2009	#1
newgardener_tx Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: austin, tx Posts: 249	BER on several plants and other diseases Growing tomato is never easy. Today I picked a lot of fruits with black spots on the bottom-end of the tomatoes. One is Jubilee growing in pot, the others are cherokee green, ARGG and black Krim in the same raised bed. Other plants such as cherokee purple, cherokee chocolate and black cherry in the same bed are OK. I planted them and water them always the same. Those three plants with BER look very healthy but with very few fruits and they all with BER. I will throw some bone meal to them to see any help. A very healthy black cherry (my biggest plant, ~ 8 feet tall) in a different plot just wilted with hundreds of tomatoes on it. It just died with green leaf! Then a cherokee Chocolate next to it died in the same way in two days. Other plants around them are OK so far. Two brandywine plants so far set me one fruit. I will give it up next year no matter how good it taste. The big beef and celebrity are loaded with nice sized fruits. Maybe I should cut back all these heirlooms and give more cresits to hybrids. newgardener_TX

May 17, 2009	#2
newatthiskat Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: texas Posts: 1,451	Reply Don't give up on the heirlooms just yet. I have only a few fruitset on my hybrids but my white queen has about 42 fruit set on it with no BER. I have noticed that my black krim and and now brad's black heart are the most prone to BER in my garden. It will take a few seasond to figure out what does best in your garden Kat

May 18, 2009	#3
dice Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: PNW Posts: 4,743	Well, you have probably read about all of the possible BER causes. Having enough calcium (lime and/or gypsum, depending on your soil pH, provide calcium; rock phosphate and bone meal have a fair amount of calcium, too; all of these take some time to break down in the soil, figure 6 weeks minimum) is the first prerequisite for avoiding BER. Second, the soil needs to be moist for the plants to be able to absorb calcium from it (has to be in solution). Third, the more even the soil moisture levels, the less prone to BER they are. Big swings from saturated to bone dry and back again during fruit set and development tend to make BER more common. Finally, excess nitrogen tends to make it worse. That makes the plant put on vegetative growth faster, and what calcium it does take up tends to end up in new leaves, starving the fruit for it. I just assume that some plant or other is going to show some BER every year (my Black Krim never did have it last year, but I did have it on a few Gregori's Altai and County Agent fruits, and an occasional New Yorker, Sophie's Choice, etc). The sudden wilt sounds like one of the following: a disease attacking the roots (like verticillium or fusarium, more likely fusarium at your temperatures); bacterial wilt (look for a discolored area down low on the stems; you put a piece of cut stem from a wilted section in a glass of water, and if a milky discharge comes out of it, that is a sign of bacterial wilt; I don't think there is a cure); a stem borer in the main stem below any of the branches (look for a hole); or a gopher or vole eating the roots. I would expect roots restricted by root knot nematodes to develop wilting symptoms a little more gradually, where the plant simply eventually outgrows the root system. (It usually does not go from perfectly healthy to wilting in the middle of the day overnight.) __________________ -- alias Last edited by dice; May 18, 2009 at 12:50 AM. Reason: clarity

May 18, 2009	#4
Suze Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Texas Posts: 3,027	In the general area, the weather has been extremely conducive to BER lately. Early onset of 90's heat (late Apr or early May) stresses the young plants right when they are setting and developing a lot of their first flush of fruit, ugh! + no rain of note since the downpour (I got 5" here) about 3 weeks or so ago. Less than 1/2 inch the other day. Putting down bone meal isn't going to help. It takes a while to break down, and I figure your main problem is what I mentioned above anyway - uneven water + early heat stress. Good deep root structure is key in limiting or preventing it, especially in a hot climate. Water deeply and infrequently, especially early on - to force transplants to drive their roots deep. Mulch heavily as soon as you plant out to limit evaporation and keep the roots cool. Set transplants very deep - when planting, strip off most of the lower leaves. Soak planting area well - apply enough water so that the transplants are not only watered in, but there are also several inches of water below the root zone (for the roots to grow down into.) A common mistake is to overlove the transplants after they are planted out, watering them several times a week and/or overfertilizing. This can cause problems down the road - because plants end up with a shallow root structure that won't take stress well here once any sort of heat or dry weather kicks in. Then one might end up with a lot of BER, weak, disease susceptible plants, and so on. Dunno if this was your problem, but I thought I would mention it anyway just in case. Hang in there, and don't give up. We've got some cooler weather now, and that will help the plants set some more before it gets hot again (I hope!)

May 19, 2009	#6
newgardener_tx Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: austin, tx Posts: 249	Thank you Suze, Dice and Kat. That makes me feel better. Thank you to spend time to analyze the issue and give me all the possible explanation and suggestion. Learning something everyday. Most likely my BER is from extra nitrogen since my plants look so healthy, 6-8 feet tall but very few fruits. Then those few ones get BER. The wilted one is a myth. Never showed any sign, just wilted, not even yellow leaves. Probably some bugs got into the stem and killed it like SVB. Anyway some good signs too. I am starting to harvest sungold, sweet million, sweet gold (taste vert sweet, maybe better than sungold with thinner skin), juliet, sweet chelssa and lemon boy. Saw one Cherokee Purple changing color. Can't wait.