why do my datil peppers look so small and yellow?

tjg911 · April 7, 2012

peppers from seed are a mystery to me. this is the 1st year i have done it.

i have 3 plants each of datil, tabasco, long red slim cayenne and corno di toro red. all seeded 2/29 in pro mix and transplanted 3/21. all 3 varieties are doing fine but the 3 datil are small, stunted, maybe an 1" tall and more yellow than green, that's about 1/2 the size of the other 3 varieties. i fertilized the datil with diluted neptune's harvest fish and sea weed emulsion 2-3-1 on 3/26 and 4/2. all are under shop lights 1" from the tubes. all go outside on days warm enough and stay out all day.

i think the datil need more N due to the lack of green in the leaves and poor growth but i'm afraid to overdo the fertilizing. do datil require a lot more fertilizer than other peppers? i got the impression that datil are not easy to grow but not sure where i read it.

HELP!

tom

Boutique Tomatoes · April 7, 2012

Datil are a chinense species, they are very slow growing long season peppers, tabasco is a frutescens and the other two are annums, which are all much quicker growing.

They spend the first several weeks on root development, then start putting on leaves. They also need to be warmer than others IMO, I typically don't put mine outside if it's less that 65-70. They do best in my office which due to the servers in there stays 70+ all the time.

tjg911 · April 13, 2012

thanks mark. after i read your reply the other day i started to recall how these datil peppers were treated. outside in cool weather a couple of days when it did not warm up as much as expected, one day was very windy and a little cloudy. add to that i watered them so the roots were colder due to being wet while outside or in the basement. probably too much water since it doesn't evaporate as fast in the cooler basement or cloudy days as it was doing upstairs before they went into the basement.

i gave them another shot of diluted nh 4/6 or 4/8 and stopped putting them outside. if it is sunny i put them in a window sill upstairs as it is a lot warmer than the basement. i NEVER water them if they will be in the cooler basement wet, watering is done only when they are upstairs. when the sun is getting low like 6 pm i move them back to the basement under lights until 8 or 9 pm then take them back upstairs for the night putting them on top of the dvr where it is 82 degrees. they are not getting 16 hours of sun/lights cuz they stay on the dvr until 8:30 or 9 am until the sun is in the south windows.

what a difference! the 2 larger ones have grown a good 50% and are green not yellowish at all. the runt grew too but is still small but more green than yellow. so 2 are doing much better and i'm sure will survive, they look great. the runt may make it.

chinenese are a pita! the fatalii peppers i started on 9/25 and grew all fall and thru winter were not hard at all but it was warmer in here then and i was very careful with watering them. the other 2 hot peppers and the 1 sweet pepper were no harder than any other vegetable but the datil have been a real challenge. i refused to fail and fought back and it appears it is working. gotta go bring them up and put them on the dvr, almost forgot!

tom

Boutique Tomatoes · April 13, 2012

Glad they are recovering!

Mikedog · August 20, 2012

Datils aren't really Chinese. They were mistakenly named that way long ago by a taxonomist. The Minorcan people of East Florida preserved the seed for generations before they became better known. There is debate whether they were brought directly from the Caribean by Spanish in the 1600s or spread around the trade routes & introduced during the later colonial period. It is not known in Minorca or mainland Spain today so it is a mystery of history. They over-winter well in containers & are even more productive & perhaps hotter the 2nd year. I found them to be trouble-free house plants if you spray them down with a pesticide before coming in. I have had friends call me up late at night with tears running down their cheeks after chomping down on "that cute little yellow pepper"! The U of Fla has a nifty bk called "The Handbook of Minor Vegetables" that give what little is known about Datil & other little known veggies- a cheap buy too.

tjg911 · August 30, 2012

here's a datil update.

i have a fair amount of peppers and they are sizing up. i picked the 1st fully ripe datil 8/27 or 8/28. it is not yellow or orange, more of an orangy yellow and could be mistaken for the fatalii's except the datil are a bit darker (fatalii really yellow) and they are about 1/3 smaller than the fatalii. i liked the heat - i'd describe this 1st pepper as hotter than cayenne and tabasco but not as hot as fatalii. it had that chinense taste near the top where the seeds and pith are but not at the point. it is fairly hot for those not used to say cayenne but if you like super hots this is mild. i ate it by biting off pieces and at the point end it was ok but as i got some pith it was a lot hotter.

i never grew datil so i assume it is true to type based upon the size of the plant, fruit shape and color. but i don't know for sure and here's why. i got this seed from the same source along with corno di toro red which is definitely crossed and not at all like corno di toro and tabasco. 1st year growing tabasco so i'm not sure if it is crossed, the fruits are pointing straight up, correct shape and size but of the ones i have eaten some red and green some have that chinense taste and some don't! so i don't know what to make of it. can anyone tell me if tabasco sometimes have that chinense taste or never have it ie long red slim cayenne never have it and are just a little less hot. so with the datil i can't be sure the seed was not crossed. is there any way anyone can tell me how to know if it is crossed short of you tasting it or doing a side by side comparison of a non crossed datil?

i have a good amount of fruits and would like to offer seed come october. this is such a rare pepper with almost no info other than it's popular in st. augustine flordia but i don't want to distribute seed if it is crossed. it grew 6' east of a fatalii and between a tabasco and long red slim cayenne.

tom

Mikedog · August 31, 2012

I'm glad to see you dedicated to preserving & sharing the Datils. Let us know if that comes to pass! Previously I had to drive to St. Augustine & purchase them from a local nursury, Leonardi's I think. It's at the beach though so there could be worse drives!
In my experience they were subjectively hotter than Cayene & Tobasco. The fruity flavor clashes with some food (collards & turnips) where as (to me) the more neutral Cayene & Tobasco add just plain heat. I have turned to New Mex hot varieties as a favored alternative to either. Chile Pepper Inst. has a good reliable stock of Datils as well as all the scorching hot New Mex varities.
In St. Augustine they hold a chowder contest that features clam chowder seasoned with Datils. It is commonly added to catsup & pickled veggie condiments ("bottled Hell"). It also makes a very good pepper jelly that is good on smoked meats. Enjoy!

April 7, 2012	#1
tjg911 Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: zone 5b northwest connecticut Posts: 2,570	why do my datil peppers look so small and yellow? peppers from seed are a mystery to me. this is the 1st year i have done it. i have 3 plants each of datil, tabasco, long red slim cayenne and corno di toro red. all seeded 2/29 in pro mix and transplanted 3/21. all 3 varieties are doing fine but the 3 datil are small, stunted, maybe an 1" tall and more yellow than green, that's about 1/2 the size of the other 3 varieties. i fertilized the datil with diluted neptune's harvest fish and sea weed emulsion 2-3-1 on 3/26 and 4/2. all are under shop lights 1" from the tubes. all go outside on days warm enough and stay out all day. i think the datil need more N due to the lack of green in the leaves and poor growth but i'm afraid to overdo the fertilizing. do datil require a lot more fertilizer than other peppers? i got the impression that datil are not easy to grow but not sure where i read it. HELP! tom __________________ I need a hero I’m holding out for a hero ‘til the end of the night He’s gotta be strong And he’s gotta be fast And he’s gotta be fresh from the fight I need a hero I’m holding out for a hero ‘til the morning light He’s gotta be sure And it’s gotta be soon And he’s gotta be larger than life

April 13, 2012	#3
tjg911 Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: zone 5b northwest connecticut Posts: 2,570	thanks mark. after i read your reply the other day i started to recall how these datil peppers were treated. outside in cool weather a couple of days when it did not warm up as much as expected, one day was very windy and a little cloudy. add to that i watered them so the roots were colder due to being wet while outside or in the basement. probably too much water since it doesn't evaporate as fast in the cooler basement or cloudy days as it was doing upstairs before they went into the basement. i gave them another shot of diluted nh 4/6 or 4/8 and stopped putting them outside. if it is sunny i put them in a window sill upstairs as it is a lot warmer than the basement. i NEVER water them if they will be in the cooler basement wet, watering is done only when they are upstairs. when the sun is getting low like 6 pm i move them back to the basement under lights until 8 or 9 pm then take them back upstairs for the night putting them on top of the dvr where it is 82 degrees. they are not getting 16 hours of sun/lights cuz they stay on the dvr until 8:30 or 9 am until the sun is in the south windows. what a difference! the 2 larger ones have grown a good 50% and are green not yellowish at all. the runt grew too but is still small but more green than yellow. so 2 are doing much better and i'm sure will survive, they look great. the runt may make it. chinenese are a pita! the fatalii peppers i started on 9/25 and grew all fall and thru winter were not hard at all but it was warmer in here then and i was very careful with watering them. the other 2 hot peppers and the 1 sweet pepper were no harder than any other vegetable but the datil have been a real challenge. i refused to fail and fought back and it appears it is working. gotta go bring them up and put them on the dvr, almost forgot! tom __________________ I need a hero I’m holding out for a hero ‘til the end of the night He’s gotta be strong And he’s gotta be fast And he’s gotta be fresh from the fight I need a hero I’m holding out for a hero ‘til the morning light He’s gotta be sure And it’s gotta be soon And he’s gotta be larger than life

August 20, 2012	#5
Mikedog Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: Macon, GA Posts: 49	Datils aren't really Chinese. They were mistakenly named that way long ago by a taxonomist. The Minorcan people of East Florida preserved the seed for generations before they became better known. There is debate whether they were brought directly from the Caribean by Spanish in the 1600s or spread around the trade routes & introduced during the later colonial period. It is not known in Minorca or mainland Spain today so it is a mystery of history. They over-winter well in containers & are even more productive & perhaps hotter the 2nd year. I found them to be trouble-free house plants if you spray them down with a pesticide before coming in. I have had friends call me up late at night with tears running down their cheeks after chomping down on "that cute little yellow pepper"! The U of Fla has a nifty bk called "The Handbook of Minor Vegetables" that give what little is known about Datil & other little known veggies- a cheap buy too. Last edited by Mikedog; August 20, 2012 at 10:27 AM. Reason: spelling

August 30, 2012	#6
tjg911 Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: zone 5b northwest connecticut Posts: 2,570	here's a datil update. i have a fair amount of peppers and they are sizing up. i picked the 1st fully ripe datil 8/27 or 8/28. it is not yellow or orange, more of an orangy yellow and could be mistaken for the fatalii's except the datil are a bit darker (fatalii really yellow) and they are about 1/3 smaller than the fatalii. i liked the heat - i'd describe this 1st pepper as hotter than cayenne and tabasco but not as hot as fatalii. it had that chinense taste near the top where the seeds and pith are but not at the point. it is fairly hot for those not used to say cayenne but if you like super hots this is mild. i ate it by biting off pieces and at the point end it was ok but as i got some pith it was a lot hotter. i never grew datil so i assume it is true to type based upon the size of the plant, fruit shape and color. but i don't know for sure and here's why. i got this seed from the same source along with corno di toro red which is definitely crossed and not at all like corno di toro and tabasco. 1st year growing tabasco so i'm not sure if it is crossed, the fruits are pointing straight up, correct shape and size but of the ones i have eaten some red and green some have that chinense taste and some don't! so i don't know what to make of it. can anyone tell me if tabasco sometimes have that chinense taste or never have it ie long red slim cayenne never have it and are just a little less hot. so with the datil i can't be sure the seed was not crossed. is there any way anyone can tell me how to know if it is crossed short of you tasting it or doing a side by side comparison of a non crossed datil? i have a good amount of fruits and would like to offer seed come october. this is such a rare pepper with almost no info other than it's popular in st. augustine flordia but i don't want to distribute seed if it is crossed. it grew 6' east of a fatalii and between a tabasco and long red slim cayenne. tom __________________ I need a hero I’m holding out for a hero ‘til the end of the night He’s gotta be strong And he’s gotta be fast And he’s gotta be fresh from the fight I need a hero I’m holding out for a hero ‘til the morning light He’s gotta be sure And it’s gotta be soon And he’s gotta be larger than life Last edited by tjg911; August 31, 2012 at 05:16 PM. Reason: bolded questions i'm asking for advice

April 7, 2012	#2
Boutique Tomatoes Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: Northeast Wisconsin, Zone 5a Posts: 1,109	Datil are a chinense species, they are very slow growing long season peppers, tabasco is a frutescens and the other two are annums, which are all much quicker growing. They spend the first several weeks on root development, then start putting on leaves. They also need to be warmer than others IMO, I typically don't put mine outside if it's less that 65-70. They do best in my office which due to the servers in there stays 70+ all the time.

August 31, 2012	#7
Mikedog Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: Macon, GA Posts: 49	I'm glad to see you dedicated to preserving & sharing the Datils. Let us know if that comes to pass! Previously I had to drive to St. Augustine & purchase them from a local nursury, Leonardi's I think. It's at the beach though so there could be worse drives! In my experience they were subjectively hotter than Cayene & Tobasco. The fruity flavor clashes with some food (collards & turnips) where as (to me) the more neutral Cayene & Tobasco add just plain heat. I have turned to New Mex hot varieties as a favored alternative to either. Chile Pepper Inst. has a good reliable stock of Datils as well as all the scorching hot New Mex varities. In St. Augustine they hold a chowder contest that features clam chowder seasoned with Datils. It is commonly added to catsup & pickled veggie condiments ("bottled Hell"). It also makes a very good pepper jelly that is good on smoked meats. Enjoy!