Cherokee Purple Issues

audrey17 · April 21, 2018

Hi All!

I purchased a CP plant from Home D last month & it seemed ok. I’ve never grown a CP, but fully expected “normal” tomato growth.
The leaves were pretty normal looking (except for an interesting faintly purple tint to the veins) I transplanted it to a bigger cow pot & all seemed well...except a leaf or 2 had a little “roll” to it. I had read somewhere that CP may have that happen, so no worries.
Unfortunately, since it was planted outside (in a 10 gal grow bag) it has become really twisted, with purple veins & gnarly looking!

The weather here in SE La., has been a bit inconsistent—60/75/80 degree days, with nights ranging from 40’s to 60’s w/some serious rain once or twice to boot! This doesn’t seem to be bothering my Yellow Pear tomato plant which has the same growing mix, environment, etc. as the mutant plant from HD!

Does anyone have ANY idea about what this is? I noticed that even though the leaves are rolled & twisted—it’s putting out new ones (that seem to be in odd places along the stem), that thus far haven’t twisted/curled...yet.

Thanks for any input you can offer!

Audrey

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Ed of Somis · May 3, 2018

Rolled leaves like that are caused by physical problems...usually uneven watering. Keep your soil moist but not waterlogged

kurt · May 3, 2018

I hate them,they are the ugliest tomato plant,they will settle in eventually,it takes a while for me to get them just to sit still.But the taste is one the top of my lists,all of them.They will fall through your fingers if left too long in the heat,the water swells the mater in direct sun here in 10b.Any of those big fat heirlooms are greenhouse grown,select harvest,no marks,can’t put more than three deep in a box.I stick to cherrys for that heat pressure on open field.

SueCT · May 3, 2018

Just a thought, but could there be any Round up type contamination? My mother had similar problems when she used from dirt from the town compost pile that comes from yard waste.

jtjmartin · May 3, 2018

There are a lot better experts here than me. But when I see that curl, it says herbicide exposure or drift to me. A number of my plants got hit last year.

Jeff

barbamWY · May 4, 2018

My plants started looking like that and just kept getting worse, then bronzing. I hung up a sticky trap and it was tiny thrips. Eventually my plants had TSWV. You might hang up a sticky trap to see if you catch anything.
Barb

jillian · May 4, 2018

A couple of years ago I lost nearly all of my tomatoes due to herbicide drift . That doesn't look like herbicide damage to me. At first glance I thought physiological leaf roll, however I would certainly take Barbam's advice to rule out thrips. I now have the sticky traps hanging all over the place thanks to learning about them from Marsha; it's very helpful to know what type bugs you have around.

zipcode · May 4, 2018

Is it me or does that plant not have a growing tip? That would explain also the tendency to make new suckers from the leaves.
The gnarled leaves are already old, the reason they became like that happened quite a while ago and it's related to fertilization. Excessive growth will make this, now the exact cause I don't know, and there isn't much info out there but it's probably due to some element or the other not being able to keep up with the growth (according to grodan that element is Ca, but I really think Cu to be more likely involved).

I would also check that pH. Water well but slowly until some excess comes from the bottom, measure pH with pH paper or meter if you have.

kurt · May 4, 2018

Overcompensation,trying to correct one with another has killed more plant than I want to admit.In open field the roots can absorb only what they need and will only take what they need.In a CONTAINER ,everything is contained jammed into a space.Suffocation,overkill happened,that’s why we are networking about it.My conditions in a jungle basically,we just went from sub. to tropical in some parts of The Redlands Agricultural District.

ContainerTed · May 4, 2018

Audrey, that is not a normal plant. Home Depot gets most of its veggie plants from Bonnie Plants. I agree with Zipcode that the plant does not seem to have a top. That means you didn't get what you thought you were buying. I'd go and get another plant or my money back. I you want to start seeds and grow Cherokee purple, we can make that happen. That plant will probably not flower and set fruit. It appears to be a cross that is still segregating.

Let me know if I can help with getting you some proper materials to grow this great variety that Tomatoville member Craig Lehoullier found and so graciously gave to the world.

It is really worth getting the real deal. This variety is one of the world standards for great tasting heirloom tomatoes. I have plenty of seed that I can share and only need you to PM a mailing address.

**carolyn137** · May 4, 2018

I have never had any problems growing Cherokee Purple and Craig sent me seeds for it from his source, J.D.Green, this history said something like 100 years old but that's shown to be a false claim.

If CP has you in a dither I highly suggest growing

http://t.tatianastomatobase.com:88/wiki/Indian_Stripe

Per the history when Donna Nelson sent me the seeds I sent some of the seeds she sent me, or maybe I grew it out and saved seeds to send to Craig, this happened back in 2004 I think,a long time to remember,ASAP to Craig,he grew it out and agreed that it was a variant of Cherokee Purple with just minor differences which Tania pointed out and Tania grew it herself as I recall. The info is all in the link above.

Carolyn

audrey17 · May 6, 2018

Hi All!

Thank you SO much for your responses. I thought about roundup exposure, over fertilizing, etc—but as it was in between 2 perfectly healthy tomato plants & given the exact same care, I pretty much can’t see how that plant got zapped/attacked or whatever while the others were fine.

I finally just got SOOOO weirded-out by this twisted, creepy, vine-like thing that I yanked it out & took it back to HD! (The look on the garden dept sales person’s face was priceless! He actually recoiled once he looked into the bag!😂.)

I’m expecting some CP seeds from Baker Creek this week (hopefully I’ll get some CP toms before thanksgiving)!

Audrey

BigVanVader · May 6, 2018

Plants from big box stores are typically fraught with issues. You will have much better luck buying from a real grower.

Togo77 · May 14, 2018

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigVanVader

Plants from big box stores are typically fraught with issues. You will have much better luck buying from a real grower.

I’d just as soon not grow rather than buy plants at a big box. Those plants have so many strange issues.

Togo77 · May 23, 2018

I had an Amelia plant just like this last year. That poor plant just wasn’t right. Sort of a freak plant.
Strange thing is I rooted a sucker off of it and it grew out really well.

May 3, 2018	#3
kurt Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Homestead,Everglades City Fl. Posts: 2,501	I hate them,they are the ugliest tomato plant,they will settle in eventually,it takes a while for me to get them just to sit still.But the taste is one the top of my lists,all of them.They will fall through your fingers if left too long in the heat,the water swells the mater in direct sun here in 10b.Any of those big fat heirlooms are greenhouse grown,select harvest,no marks,can’t put more than three deep in a box.I stick to cherrys for that heat pressure on open field. __________________ KURT

May 4, 2018	#7
jillian Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jul 2015 Location: North Carolina Posts: 880	A couple of years ago I lost nearly all of my tomatoes due to herbicide drift . That doesn't look like herbicide damage to me. At first glance I thought physiological leaf roll, however I would certainly take Barbam's advice to rule out thrips. I now have the sticky traps hanging all over the place thanks to learning about them from Marsha; it's very helpful to know what type bugs you have around. Last edited by jillian; May 4, 2018 at 02:26 AM. Reason: Punctuation

May 4, 2018	#8
zipcode Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Romania/Germany , z 4-6 Posts: 1,582	Is it me or does that plant not have a growing tip? That would explain also the tendency to make new suckers from the leaves. The gnarled leaves are already old, the reason they became like that happened quite a while ago and it's related to fertilization. Excessive growth will make this, now the exact cause I don't know, and there isn't much info out there but it's probably due to some element or the other not being able to keep up with the growth (according to grodan that element is Ca, but I really think Cu to be more likely involved). I would also check that pH. Water well but slowly until some excess comes from the bottom, measure pH with pH paper or meter if you have. Last edited by zipcode; May 4, 2018 at 08:06 AM.

May 4, 2018	#9
kurt Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Homestead,Everglades City Fl. Posts: 2,501	Overcompensation,trying to correct one with another has killed more plant than I want to admit.In open field the roots can absorb only what they need and will only take what they need.In a CONTAINER ,everything is contained jammed into a space.Suffocation,overkill happened,that’s why we are networking about it.My conditions in a jungle basically,we just went from sub. to tropical in some parts of The Redlands Agricultural District. __________________ KURT

May 4, 2018	#10
ContainerTed Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: 6a - NE Tennessee Posts: 4,538	Audrey, that is not a normal plant. Home Depot gets most of its veggie plants from Bonnie Plants. I agree with Zipcode that the plant does not seem to have a top. That means you didn't get what you thought you were buying. I'd go and get another plant or my money back. I you want to start seeds and grow Cherokee purple, we can make that happen. That plant will probably not flower and set fruit. It appears to be a cross that is still segregating. Let me know if I can help with getting you some proper materials to grow this great variety that Tomatoville member Craig Lehoullier found and so graciously gave to the world. It is really worth getting the real deal. This variety is one of the world standards for great tasting heirloom tomatoes. I have plenty of seed that I can share and only need you to PM a mailing address. __________________ Ted ________________________ Owner & Sole Operator Of The Muddy Bucket Farm and Tomato Ranch Last edited by ContainerTed; May 4, 2018 at 05:08 PM.

May 3, 2018	#2
Ed of Somis Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: Somis, Ca Posts: 649	Rolled leaves like that are caused by physical problems...usually uneven watering. Keep your soil moist but not waterlogged

May 3, 2018	#4
SueCT Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Connecticut Posts: 1,460	Just a thought, but could there be any Round up type contamination? My mother had similar problems when she used from dirt from the town compost pile that comes from yard waste.

May 3, 2018	#5
jtjmartin Tomatovillian™ Join Date: May 2016 Location: Williamsburg VA Zone 7b Posts: 1,110	There are a lot better experts here than me. But when I see that curl, it says herbicide exposure or drift to me. A number of my plants got hit last year. Jeff

May 4, 2018	#6
barbamWY Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: North West Wyoming Posts: 466	My plants started looking like that and just kept getting worse, then bronzing. I hung up a sticky trap and it was tiny thrips. Eventually my plants had TSWV. You might hang up a sticky trap to see if you catch anything. Barb

May 4, 2018	#11
carolyn137 Moderator Emeritus Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Upstate NY, zone 4b/5a Posts: 21,169	I have never had any problems growing Cherokee Purple and Craig sent me seeds for it from his source, J.D.Green, this history said something like 100 years old but that's shown to be a false claim. If CP has you in a dither I highly suggest growing http://t.tatianastomatobase.com:88/wiki/Indian_Stripe Per the history when Donna Nelson sent me the seeds I sent some of the seeds she sent me, or maybe I grew it out and saved seeds to send to Craig, this happened back in 2004 I think,a long time to remember,ASAP to Craig,he grew it out and agreed that it was a variant of Cherokee Purple with just minor differences which Tania pointed out and Tania grew it herself as I recall. The info is all in the link above. Carolyn __________________ Carolyn

May 6, 2018	#12
audrey17 Tomatovillian™ Join Date: May 2011 Location: SE Louisiana Posts: 19	Hi All! Thank you SO much for your responses. I thought about roundup exposure, over fertilizing, etc—but as it was in between 2 perfectly healthy tomato plants & given the exact same care, I pretty much can’t see how that plant got zapped/attacked or whatever while the others were fine. I finally just got SOOOO weirded-out by this twisted, creepy, vine-like thing that I yanked it out & took it back to HD! (The look on the garden dept sales person’s face was priceless! He actually recoiled once he looked into the bag!😂.) I’m expecting some CP seeds from Baker Creek this week (hopefully I’ll get some CP toms before thanksgiving)! Audrey

May 6, 2018	#13
BigVanVader Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Mar 2014 Location: Greenville, South Carolina Posts: 3,099	Plants from big box stores are typically fraught with issues. You will have much better luck buying from a real grower.

May 23, 2018	#15
Togo77 Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Mar 2017 Location: SE Louisiana Posts: 27	I had an Amelia plant just like this last year. That poor plant just wasn’t right. Sort of a freak plant. Strange thing is I rooted a sucker off of it and it grew out really well.