Herbicide (2-4-d) Damage - Page 2

Heritage · May 31, 2015

Quote:

Originally Posted by tnkrer

Sorry to hear that James. Like you, I also keep waiting and hoping that I wont get hit by herbicide drift and every year I get hit. Today was the day for me

tnkrer,

Your photos are examples of physiological leaf roll, and not herbicide damage.
Here is a link showing the difference.

Steve

tnkrer · May 31, 2015

Thanks Steve,
It seemed less severe form of what I had thought of as herbicide damage last year (and on the starts this year). However, today, those leaves seem to have recovered for most part. So it must be physiological leaf roll. Though, they have been out there for two weeks, weather has not changed drastically, Have not added any new fertilizer to them .. so don't know what could have caused it.

JamesL · June 1, 2015

I assume people are getting hit with drift all the time, many probably don't even realize what the damage is.

As we will clearly never change others behavior -

Any thoughts as to prevention? For me it would appear to be a May issue only, I have yet to get hit after that.

Would Row cover work?

Anyone think this stuff - Surround WP (kaolin clay) would help?
http://www.groworganic.com/surround-25-lb.html
Supposed to help prevent sunburn.
It does allow gas exchange though (or plants would die) so maybe not.

10 months to ponder the issue......

JamesL · June 1, 2015

Quote:

Originally Posted by TightenUp

Sorry james

Got hit hard last year. Replaced garden 4th of july weekend and it never caught up.

Memorial Day wknd used to be my fathers plant out date so you should be ok if you replace now, asap.

I remember that. Hope you avoid this year!

Quote:

Originally Posted by tnkrer

Thanks Steve,
It seemed less severe form of what I had thought of as herbicide damage last year (and on the starts this year). However, today, those leaves seem to have recovered for most part. So it must be physiological leaf roll. Though, they have been out there for two weeks, weather has not changed drastically, Have not added any new fertilizer to them .. so don't know what could have caused it.

Tnkrer - That has to be a big relief!

sdambr · June 5, 2015

James, how are you holding up. The GGWT still not looking too good, I figure I will wait for one warm week to see new growth. It's been so cool here that everything is growing so slowly, hard to tell the extent of the damage but there are several more. Tightly curling new growth, sigh.

Hope yours are a bit better.

I do have some not affected at all, that is the good news.

The only solution that could work would probably be to plant out in June. Still I would have to harden off outside first, but I guess they can go inside for the day the landscapers are in the area.

So start seeds in April, plant out June, whom I kidding, I would be crazy (crazier) by then. I am itching to get planted in Feb and do my best to hold off.

JamesL · June 5, 2015

Sue,
So GGWT is not the only one?

(For others - Sue got Girl Girl's Weird Thing from me which was fine when I gave it to her but also got hit while still at my house. She then had a run-in of her own with Landscapers spraying that same week.)

Cool and rainy.... I hadn't checked since Monday. Sprayed tonight with Fish Milk and some aspirin tossed in.
Definite growth in height and lots of new suckers. A few have shrugged it off almost completely and a few look just terrible.
Some of the lower suckers on a few of the worst plants look very healthy and might become my main stems depending on the haircut.
I am pruning tomorrow / Sunday for sure but you could easily wait another week.
Will have to remember to take some before and after pix.

sdzejachok · June 6, 2015

At a seminar this week I learned 2-4-D can drift 1-1.5 miles and is responsible for lots of damage. Good to know the plants can recover. At the same seminar I learned RoundUp can linger in a perennial for years and finally kill it.

greyghost · June 6, 2015

James, If you do take before and after photos of your affected plants, it'll
be extremely interesting. When I had an overspray incident (neighbor's backpack
sprayer), I removed the most severely affected. I left some that had less curling; they were pruned back to more normal foliage and they did go on to
produce some fruit. I had grown extra give away plants so did have some
replacements.

At the time you initially posted, I had wondered if a flyer with photos of your
plants and an explanation would educate your neighbors so that they'd address
the issue with their landscapers. When it happened to my garden, I was amazed
by the number of people who said they never gave a thought to the hazards of
2,4d or realized the product "traveled" or volatilized. When my husband mentioned to the neighbor who sprayed weed-be-gone that we lost a lot of
plants to 2,4d exposure, he said he never used anything with it. He must have
checked his label as he started using a drop spreader the next year.

I've also thought 1 or 2 layers of row cover over the plants may help, a tall
privacy fence if it suited the layout of your garden. I use crw cages; I had thought maybe wrapping them in plastic (a few inches off the ground for ventilation) with a row cover top. I came close to relocating the garden;
it's deer-fenced so that would have been inconvenient. If we could have
figured out an easy way for the horses to get to their pastures, we would have
used their paddock as the new garden. We would have had a barn protecting the plants. We live in a rural area, I can't imagine having to worry each spring about this type of situation in a neighborhood.

It breaks my heart to see posts like this each spring-there seems to be
a definite need for the education of lawn service employees and consumers
of this hazard. Do you have a homeowners association that could help
educate your neighbors? Perhaps they could put out a flyer each spring.

JamesL · June 24, 2015

I opted for cautious pruning and slowly removed all of the distorted growth over the last few weeks.

All of the new growth appears healthy on the tomatoes.

Cucumbers were untouched.

Peppers and basil - meh.

sdambr · June 24, 2015

James, those tomatoes and cukes are looking great. Have the opposite thing going on here. Peppers are looking really nice, tomatoes and basil ok, but the cukes not worth a picture.
The GGWT getting much better, not pruning anymore and I cut in half. It actually has flowers which I can't say for all the rest. Most have recouped but are not flourishing.

GGWT

struggling Portugese

JamesL · June 24, 2015

Your peppers do look good! I guess they are loving the sunny deck.

What a mess eh?

TightenUp · June 24, 2015

James

Plants look solid. Think you got lucky this year

JamesL · June 24, 2015

Quote:

Originally Posted by TightenUp

James

Plants look solid. Think you got lucky this year

I think so too.
Starting to set fruit, but most of the early flowers burnt out. Cautiously optimistic.
Going to be a late season but it beats the alternative.....

greyghost · June 25, 2015

Your plants look great now, both of you, I think you both are track for a very
good harvest! At least I hope so.

sdambr · June 25, 2015

Quote:

Originally Posted by JamesL

Your peppers do look good! I guess they are loving the sunny deck.

Thanks James

Quote:

Originally Posted by greyghost

Your plants look great now, both of you, I think you both are track for a very good harvest! At least I hope so.

Thanks Greyghost, I hope so, as you can see some are really struggling and should be much further along.
some plants don't even have blooms yet. But most have come back and will just be a later harvest.

June 1, 2015	#18
JamesL Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: Long Island NY Posts: 1,992	Herbicide Damage Prevention I assume people are getting hit with drift all the time, many probably don't even realize what the damage is. As we will clearly never change others behavior - Any thoughts as to prevention? For me it would appear to be a May issue only, I have yet to get hit after that. Would Row cover work? Anyone think this stuff - Surround WP (kaolin clay) would help? http://www.groworganic.com/surround-25-lb.html Supposed to help prevent sunburn. It does allow gas exchange though (or plants would die) so maybe not. 10 months to ponder the issue......

June 24, 2015	#27
TightenUp Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Jersey Posts: 1,183	James Plants look solid. Think you got lucky this year __________________

May 31, 2015	#17
tnkrer Tomatovillian™ Join Date: May 2013 Location: MA 6a/b Posts: 352	Thanks Steve, It seemed less severe form of what I had thought of as herbicide damage last year (and on the starts this year). However, today, those leaves seem to have recovered for most part. So it must be physiological leaf roll. Though, they have been out there for two weeks, weather has not changed drastically, Have not added any new fertilizer to them .. so don't know what could have caused it.

June 5, 2015	#20
sdambr Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jun 2014 Location: Long Island, NY Posts: 421	James, how are you holding up. The GGWT still not looking too good, I figure I will wait for one warm week to see new growth. It's been so cool here that everything is growing so slowly, hard to tell the extent of the damage but there are several more. Tightly curling new growth, sigh. Hope yours are a bit better. I do have some not affected at all, that is the good news. The only solution that could work would probably be to plant out in June. Still I would have to harden off outside first, but I guess they can go inside for the day the landscapers are in the area. So start seeds in April, plant out June, whom I kidding, I would be crazy (crazier) by then. I am itching to get planted in Feb and do my best to hold off.

June 5, 2015	#21
JamesL Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: Long Island NY Posts: 1,992	Sue, So GGWT is not the only one? (For others - Sue got Girl Girl's Weird Thing from me which was fine when I gave it to her but also got hit while still at my house. She then had a run-in of her own with Landscapers spraying that same week.) Cool and rainy.... I hadn't checked since Monday. Sprayed tonight with Fish Milk and some aspirin tossed in. Definite growth in height and lots of new suckers. A few have shrugged it off almost completely and a few look just terrible. Some of the lower suckers on a few of the worst plants look very healthy and might become my main stems depending on the haircut. I am pruning tomorrow / Sunday for sure but you could easily wait another week. Will have to remember to take some before and after pix.

June 6, 2015	#22
sdzejachok Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Ohio Posts: 98	At a seminar this week I learned 2-4-D can drift 1-1.5 miles and is responsible for lots of damage. Good to know the plants can recover. At the same seminar I learned RoundUp can linger in a perennial for years and finally kill it.

June 6, 2015	#23
greyghost Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: southeastern PA Posts: 760	James, If you do take before and after photos of your affected plants, it'll be extremely interesting. When I had an overspray incident (neighbor's backpack sprayer), I removed the most severely affected. I left some that had less curling; they were pruned back to more normal foliage and they did go on to produce some fruit. I had grown extra give away plants so did have some replacements. At the time you initially posted, I had wondered if a flyer with photos of your plants and an explanation would educate your neighbors so that they'd address the issue with their landscapers. When it happened to my garden, I was amazed by the number of people who said they never gave a thought to the hazards of 2,4d or realized the product "traveled" or volatilized. When my husband mentioned to the neighbor who sprayed weed-be-gone that we lost a lot of plants to 2,4d exposure, he said he never used anything with it. He must have checked his label as he started using a drop spreader the next year. I've also thought 1 or 2 layers of row cover over the plants may help, a tall privacy fence if it suited the layout of your garden. I use crw cages; I had thought maybe wrapping them in plastic (a few inches off the ground for ventilation) with a row cover top. I came close to relocating the garden; it's deer-fenced so that would have been inconvenient. If we could have figured out an easy way for the horses to get to their pastures, we would have used their paddock as the new garden. We would have had a barn protecting the plants. We live in a rural area, I can't imagine having to worry each spring about this type of situation in a neighborhood. It breaks my heart to see posts like this each spring-there seems to be a definite need for the education of lawn service employees and consumers of this hazard. Do you have a homeowners association that could help educate your neighbors? Perhaps they could put out a flyer each spring.

June 25, 2015	#29
greyghost Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: southeastern PA Posts: 760	Your plants look great now, both of you, I think you both are track for a very good harvest! At least I hope so.