Seed germination and growing suggestions?

[ezzrider]

I am new to this forum and it is great to seed a tomato specific forum that is actually read and posted. I am in the Tampa Bay region or Zone 9a. I want to start growing some tomato seeds this week. I built a simple small greenhouse using clear plastic sheeting for a cover. The front is slit to open but can be closed. I built a table to put the greenhouse top on and that table top is made out of chicken wire. Hopefully this way there should be sufficient air flow. Since the weather has turned nice here I want to start the seeds outdoors but inside the small greenhouse. I have numerous 9 cell planter trays as well as larger pots. I intend on starting the seeds in the 9 cell planter trays and then later transferring to larger pots. I grow the tomatoes in 10 gallon squat posts with composted horse manure. What is the preferred method to germinate the seeds. Should I simply start them in the trays? Also what growing medium should I use? I do have some Perlite, sphagnum peat moss, composted horse manure and Scott's Potting soil. I tried a Perlite and sphagnum peat moss combination last season and the seeds started OK but died out. Any suggestions on how to best get these seeds germinate and growing? Thanks.



Read more: http://thetomatogarden.★★★★★★★★★.com...#ixzz1Cd04ptKc

[b54red]

You better get started. I'm quite a bit north of you and will be starting my second batch of seed next week; my first is already sprouting.
I use Jiffy seed starting mix. I would recommend you use a seed starting mix because it is more sterile and less likely to have fungus or wilt problems with your new seedlings. After they get a few true leaves you can then move them to larger containers with a regular potting mix. As soon as you possibly can move the plants outside so they can get more light and toughen up. If the greenhouse gets too hot the small plants will get to tall and spindly. Good Luck.

[ezzrider]

Originally Posted by b54red

You better get started. I'm quite a bit north of you and will be starting my second batch of seed next week; my first is already sprouting.
I use Jiffy seed starting mix. I would recommend you use a seed starting mix because it is more sterile and less likely to have fungus or wilt problems with your new seedlings. After they get a few true leaves you can then move them to larger containers with a regular potting mix. As soon as you possibly can move the plants outside so they can get more light and toughen up. If the greenhouse gets too hot the small plants will get to tall and spindly. Good Luck.

Since I already have perlite and sphagnum peat moss on hand do you think a 50/50 ratio of each would suffice as a seed starting mix? I believe most seed starting mixes you buy have some ratio of these. I may be a little late but not much.

[oc tony]

Here's a thread you might find useful. Florida Growers Thread - Tomatoville® Gardening Forums

[ezzrider]

Originally Posted by oc tony

Here's a thread you might find useful. Florida Growers Thread - Tomatoville® Gardening Forums

I took a look at the Florida Growers Thread. I really like the concept but the thread is 25 pages long. A little cumbersom to ask questions. Wish it was broken up somehow.

[dice]

Think of Peat Pellets. What are they? All peat moss.

You might try using the sphagnum peat moss with about 10%
perlite for starting the seeds, and water them the first time
with 1 part hydrogen peroxide to 10 parts water (kills the fungi
that cause damping off disease). Then just keep them from
drying out completely until they get the first set of true leaves.

Once you see those true leaves, they are ready to pot up into
4" pots (or equivalent; some people use 3.5" tall pots; some use
16oz plastic beer cups with holes drilled in them; some use
12-16 oz styrofoam coffee cups with holes poked around the
sides at the bottom; some use newspaper pots; some use yogurt
cups or plastic margarine containers or cottage cheese
containers; and so on). You can increase the perlite to maybe
1/3 of the mix when potting up from seed-starting cells into 4"
pots (at half and half, they probably dry out faster than is
convenient).

At that point you can add some mild fertilizer, maybe manure
tea made from your composted horse manure. (Put a shovel
full in a 5-gallon bucket, fill with water, agitate it, let it sit
overnight. Should be just right for seedlings.)

Bottom watering them at that stage is usually a good idea,
because it does not compress the container mix, allowing the
seedlings to root out into the pot more easily.

A good document on the physical structure, pH, etc of container
mix:
http://edis.ifas.ufl.edu/cn004

Composted horse manure warning (aminopyralid,
a broadleaf herbicide marketed to hay farmers that
horses fail to digest):
http://www.tomatoville.com/showthrea...lid#post172040

[BSue54]

This is my first time to start from seed. I used Jiffy pellet thingies... Put the seeds in on Feb 1... and I see signs of life in at least 2 of the 3 varieties I put in them. Brandywine and Early Girl both have little tiny sprigs - and I do mean TINY - starting to think about uncurling LOL... Rutgers and the 2 kinds of peppers are still being stubborn.

Bobbie in Cut-N-Shoot, Texas - where our water finally thawed today... so it's been a very good day, all in all!

[ezzrider]

Originally Posted by dice

Think of Peat Pellets. What are they? All peat moss.

You might try using the sphagnum peat moss with about 10%
perlite for starting the seeds, and water them the first time
with 1 part hydrogen peroxide to 10 parts water (kills the fungi
that cause damping off disease). Then just keep them from
drying out completely until they get the first set of true leaves.

Once you see those true leaves, they are ready to pot up into
4" pots (or equivalent; some people use 3.5" tall pots; some use
16oz plastic beer cups with holes drilled in them; some use
12-16 oz styrofoam coffee cups with holes poked around the
sides at the bottom; some use newspaper pots; some use yogurt
cups or plastic margarine containers or cottage cheese
containers; and so on). You can increase the perlite to maybe
1/3 of the mix when potting up from seed-starting cells into 4"
pots (at half and half, they probably dry out faster than is
convenient).

At that point you can add some mild fertilizer, maybe manure
tea made from your composted horse manure. (Put a shovel
full in a 5-gallon bucket, fill with water, agitate it, let it sit
overnight. Should be just right for seedlings.)

Bottom watering them at that stage is usually a good idea,
because it does not compress the container mix, allowing the
seedlings to root out into the pot more easily.

A good document on the physical structure, pH, etc of container
mix:
http://edis.ifas.ufl.edu/cn004

Composted horse manure warning (aminopyralid,
a broadleaf herbicide marketed to hay farmers that
horses fail to digest):
http://www.tomatoville.com/showthrea...lid#post172040

Thanks for the info. I settled on a seed starting mix of 10 parts peat moss, 1 part perlite, 1 part vermiculite and a little garden lime. I am told that is the basic mix for Pro-Mix seed starting mix. I mixed the seed starting mix by hand with water until the mix was clumping but not real wet. I also planted some egg plant and summer squash seeds at the same time in other seed trays. Thanks for the tips on what to do next.

[dice]

Sounds good. That is pretty close to a "plug mix", used for
starting seeds in plug inserts with tiny little cells, like the 128 cell
inserts, 200 cell inserts, and so on. Those mixes usually contain
finely milled peat, plus a little perlite, gypsum, lime, vermiculite,
a wetting agent, etc.

Small pots that wick water away from the container mix, like
newspaper pots, compressed peat pots, and clay pots, dry out
a lot faster than plastic pots. I have a mix of 5 parts coir, 1 part
earthworm castings, and 1 part perlite in some newspaper pots,
and they are drying out in 3-4 days indoors (I could probably get
10 days from plastic pots the same size using the same
container mix at the same temperatures before they needed
water again).

[ezzrider]

Originally Posted by dice

Sounds good. That is pretty close to a "plug mix", used for
starting seeds in plug inserts with tiny little cells, like the 128 cell
inserts, 200 cell inserts, and so on. Those mixes usually contain
finally milled peat, plus a little perlite, gypsum, lime, vermiculite,
a wetting agent, etc.

Small pots that wick water away from the container mix, like
newspaper pots, compressed peat pots, and clay pots, dry out
a lot faster than plastic pots. I have a mix of 5 parts coir, 1 part
earthworm castings, and 1 part perlite in some newspaper pots,
and they are drying out in 3-4 days indoors (I could probably get
10 days from plastic pots the same size using the same
container mix at the same temperatures before they needed
water again).

I looked at my plastic seeding trays this morning and they do not look completely dry. I have not watered since planting. I may go ahead and water later today. I am wondering if it is better to water from the top or put them in the watering trays and let them water from the bottom up and then remove the watering trays (metal rectangle cooking trays). I put a temperature and humidity gauge inside the greenhouse top. It is little cold this morning and the temperature was 60 with a 80% humidity inside the greenhouse top. It was 73 degrees with an 80% humidity yesterday.

[patty_b]

dice, What is the wetting agent used in the pre mixed seed starters?? Patty
ps.. do you use any peroxide in watering after the seedling pop up??

[dice]

dice, What is the wetting agent used in the pre mixed seed starters?? Patty
ps.. do you use any peroxide in watering after the seedling pop up??

If the seed-starting mix is labelled "Organic", the wetting agent
is probably yucca extract. It coats the peat (and everything else
in there) and allows water to stick to it more easily until the peat
itself can absorb the water. If it is not organic, then it is likely
some commercial chemical preparation custom designed for
soils and container mix. Wetting agents are basically surfactants.
For container mix, you want one that will break down slowly but
surely. It should not permanently pollute the environment, but
you want it to last a season at least.

http://www.global-garden.com.au/burn...02jan03dte.htm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Surfactant

Once the seeds sprout, I do not use hydrogen peroxide unless
I see fungi growing on the surface of the seed-starting mix
(it has been too wet). If the seedlings have already been potted
up once, I do not use it at all in the soil. One can also spray it for
foliar disease control of some foliage diseases, similar to
b54red's use of clorox solutions for the same problem.
Hydrogen peroxide does not last long on the plant or in the
container mix. It reacts quickly with organic matter in the
environment.

One thing I do is cover seed starting cells loosely with plastic
wrap until the seeds start to sprout. As long as they are still
in the initial seed-starting cells, I will continue to use the hydrogen peroxide solution to water with until they actually
sprout (fungi spores can drift in on the air).

At 60F in ezzrider's mini-greenhouse, tomato seeds are going
to be reluctant to sprout. On days when it gets up into the 70s
in there, they should sprout fine.

[ezzrider]

Originally Posted by dice

If the seed-starting mix is labelled "Organic", the wetting agent
is probably yucca extract. It coats the peat (and everything else
in there) and allows water to stick to it more easily until the peat
itself can absorb the water. If it is not organic, then it is likely
some commercial chemical preparation custom designed for
soils and container mix. Wetting agents are basically surfactants.
For container mix, you want one that will break down slowly but
surely. It should not permanently pollute the environment, but
you want it to last a season at least.

http://www.global-garden.com.au/burn...02jan03dte.htm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Surfactant

Once the seeds sprout, I do not use hydrogen peroxide unless
I see fungi growing on the surface of the seed-starting mix
(it has been too wet). If the seedlings have already been potted
up once, I do not use it at all in the soil. One can also spray it for
foliar disease control of some foliage diseases, similar to
b54red's use of clorox solutions for the same problem.
Hydrogen peroxide does not last long on the plant or in the
container mix. It reacts quickly with organic matter in the
environment.

One thing I do is cover seed starting cells loosely with plastic
wrap until the seeds start to sprout. As long as they are still
in the initial seed-starting cells, I will continue to use the hydrogen peroxide solution to water with until they actually
sprout (fungi spores can drift in on the air).

At 60F in ezzrider's mini-greenhouse, tomato seeds are going
to be reluctant to sprout. On days when it gets up into the 70s
in there, they should sprout fine.

Actually the temperatures have been back up into the 70 to 80s again. I bought a temperature gauge with a probe and my seed starting mix is 74 degrees.

[dice]

You asked about bottom watering. That is not always convenient
(small pots or inserts or whatever in an oversize tray, for
example, or huge numbers of seedlings with no water collection
tray at all, sitting on a mesh bench in a greenhouse), but with
your trays it sounds like you are set up for it. That avoids
compressing the seed starting mix, and it induces the roots
to grow downward toward the bottom of the pot.

[ezzrider]

Originally Posted by dice

You asked about bottom watering. That is not always convenient
(small pots or inserts or whatever in an oversize tray, for
example, or huge numbers of seedlings with no water collection
tray at all, sitting on a mesh bench in a greenhouse), but with
your trays it sounds like you are set up for it. That avoids
compressing the seed starting mix, and it induces the roots
to grow downward toward the bottom of the pot.

I actually watered from the top yesterday. I will do the bottom tray watering next time then remove the watering trays. I did not like the compressing of the seed mix (dang it!).