Can you save seeds from a partially ripe tomato?

lakelady · July 11, 2012

This morning I went out to spend an hour watering as usual. I happened to glance at one of my dwarves and lo and behold, hidden under the dense foliage was a pink something! Got closer and sure enough, a ripening tomato was on the bottom of Yukon Quest. Unfortunately, something else noticed too and took a bite. Looks like fang bite actually and I do get snakes. Anyhow, I pulled it off the plant terribly disappointed. Considered letting it continue to ripen and eat the good part anyway in a few days, but then, not knowing what bit this tomato, I seriously reconsidered!

Anyhow, it is pink, has a few days to go. Can I let it continue to ripen and at the very least, save the seeds if I can't eat it? I really hate to throw a nice tomato away!! But, I don't want to save seeds if they will not be viable. With other veggies I know they need to get good and ripe for the seeds to be good. What about the tomato?

Sun City Linda · July 11, 2012

I dont like to use any raw toms that have bite marks from "unknown origin." I am not opposed to throwing the uneaten part in the pot however. I seriously doubt processing companies are even as careful as I am. I think you are fine for seed saving.

lakelady · July 11, 2012

Thanks Linda. At this point, I'm not planning to eat it, I just want to be sure that if I do save seeds, they are viable .

JamesL · July 11, 2012

Antoinette,
I am no expert but I was under the impression that saving seed is one instance where you need to leave them on the vine longer.
Randall mentions that in this thread in post #16.
http://www.tomatoville.com/showthread.php?t=23427

lakelady · July 11, 2012

ah, that thread did not come up in my search. Interesting. So here is what I will do. Since the tomato is quite pink, I'm going to let it sit a few days and then harvest the seeds. Then I'm going to plant some and see if they sprout. That should tell me, yes?

JamesL · July 11, 2012

Viability test, sure.
The worst that can happen anyway is you save them and they don't grow.

Iva · July 12, 2012

Antoniette, the tomato ripens from inside out, which means it only starts changing color from green to red (or which ever other color) when it wants to indicate it is ready for harvesting. The ripe fruit color invites critters to eat it and with eating it, dispersing seeds. So in order for the tomato to start ripening, the seeds must be ripe first.

In other words, the seeds ripen first, then the flesh starts coloring up. So the seeds will definitely be viable if you save them now. I've saved seeds many times from tomatoes that barely had a hint of the ripe color (a blush) and they always germinated great!

Knowing this can come in handy if you have a disaster strike your tomatoes (hail, disease, storms, pets destroying your plants,...) and you want to save seeds from them. Of course, if you want to let them ripen on the counter for eating them, that's fine also, but in your case I'd just save the seeds...

ContainerTed · July 12, 2012

Lakelady, your plan in post #5 is the only way to go. That way you'll know for sure one way or the other.

**carolyn137** · July 12, 2012

Agree with Iva.

For many many years I was SSE listing hundreds of varieties so was doing a LOT of seed saving for that purpose and also for the seed offers I was doing, initially at AOL, then GW, then here.

I'd often pick a half bushel of ONE variety at a time and pick ones that barely had a blush to fully ripe ones. THen start the fermentations with the ripe ones, then as the others ripened up, set them up for fermentation as well.

And there is no need to even use fully ripe fruits to process for seeds as Iva explained. I know one person who breeds tomatoes who saves seeds from totally green ones that are just on the verge of turning that greenish whitish color but he does it and it works for him, even has his method online, or used to, but I prefer to process seeds when it's an ASAP situation from fruits that have at least some lbush.

To give you an example of those very rare occasions, Craig and I had received seeds from the USDA for the variety called Magnus, which was on the 1900 cover of the Livingston catalog. He couldn't get any to germinate, he sent me the seeds and I was able to get ONE plant going. Now it's VERY late when that plant went out and as first frost approached, and now I'm back at work teaching, there were a few fruits that reached the size they should be, so I picked them, they only had a wee blush on them, and left them on the counter of the kitchen at the old farmhouse where my mother was still living and told her I'd be there on the weekend to get them.

I guess she didn't pay attention b'c when I got there they had ripened a bit and she had used them in a salad.

There were a few more fruits on that plant and I was stopping by on my way to work and back covering and uncovering that one plant AM and PM.

I finally was forced to attempt to save seeds from those partially ripe fruits still on the plant and ALL seeds out there now, for Magnus, came from those few fruits on that one plant.

It's hard to save seeds from fruits that are mostly green b'c little juice and the exteriors are hard as are the walls that seperate the locules and don't break open easily which is what I do to fruits when saving seeds.

Edited to add that there was never time for me to do germination tests on varieties that I planned to offer for the next year, couldn't do it and meet the SSE Deadline for sending in info. But off hand I can't remember one instance where the seeds weren't fine and germinated well for others as well as myself when I needed to regrow certin varieties to maintain seed stocks.

JamesL · July 12, 2012

Iva and Carolyn,
Thanks. I learn something every time I open a thread.

lakelady · July 12, 2012

Iva and Carolyn, THANK YOU SO MUCH!! The tomato was much darker today on the counter, so I squished the contents into a glass for seed saving. BUT...it is excellent to know the seeds ripen first, then the flesh. I agree Carolyn, especially if something is late planted out, and frost threatens, at least now I know those seeds can indeed be saved and viable for future grow outs! I just wanted to be sure I'd have mature seed for next year.

guruofgardens · August 9, 2012

Thanks to Iva and carolyn for giving us hope when the frost sets in.

Another question. Many of my plants have septoria spot starting at the bottom of the plant and will hopefully stay there. Will the seeds that I save have any of the disease? The tomatoes look fine and are delicious. Just don't want to share or plant any seed knowing I've 'empowered' this disease.

Worth1 · August 9, 2012

From the mind of a tomato, "My seeds are ready, now I can turn red so a critter will come along and eat me so my babies will spread throughout the land".

Worth

**carolyn137** · August 10, 2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by guruofgardens

Thanks to Iva and carolyn for giving us hope when the frost sets in.

Another question. Many of my plants have septoria spot starting at the bottom of the plant and will hopefully stay there. Will the seeds that I save have any of the disease? The tomatoes look fine and are delicious. Just don't want to share or plant any seed knowing I've 'empowered' this disease.

The fungal foliage diseases such as Early Blight ( A. solani) and Septoria can adhere to the seed coat so it's best to ferment the seeds which removes most of them. There's no method that removes ALL of them but since infection is a quantitative process it lessens the chance of seedborne disease.

For many years I've fermented seed from EB and Septoria infected plants and to date have never had anyone, and I'm someone as well, ahem, see seedborne transmission.

I can't speak to the efficacy of any of the oxidative methods, and this has been discussed here before, b'c there is no data available.

guruofgardens · August 10, 2012

Carolyn - thank you so much for giving me hope that I can save a few seeds. I usually ferment my tomato seeds, but have tried the Oxi- Clean route, too. This year I'll only do the fermentation - as a precaution for everyone I share seeds with.

Thank you for sharing your weath of knowledge!

July 11, 2012	#3
lakelady Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: northern NJ zone 6b Posts: 1,862	Thanks Linda. At this point, I'm not planning to eat it, I just want to be sure that if I do save seeds, they are viable . __________________ Antoniette

July 12, 2012	#8
ContainerTed Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: 6a - NE Tennessee Posts: 4,538	Lakelady, your plan in post #5 is the only way to go. That way you'll know for sure one way or the other. __________________ Ted ________________________ Owner & Sole Operator Of The Muddy Bucket Farm and Tomato Ranch

July 12, 2012	#9
carolyn137 Moderator Emeritus Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Upstate NY, zone 4b/5a Posts: 21,169	Agree with Iva. For many many years I was SSE listing hundreds of varieties so was doing a LOT of seed saving for that purpose and also for the seed offers I was doing, initially at AOL, then GW, then here. I'd often pick a half bushel of ONE variety at a time and pick ones that barely had a blush to fully ripe ones. THen start the fermentations with the ripe ones, then as the others ripened up, set them up for fermentation as well. And there is no need to even use fully ripe fruits to process for seeds as Iva explained. I know one person who breeds tomatoes who saves seeds from totally green ones that are just on the verge of turning that greenish whitish color but he does it and it works for him, even has his method online, or used to, but I prefer to process seeds when it's an ASAP situation from fruits that have at least some lbush. To give you an example of those very rare occasions, Craig and I had received seeds from the USDA for the variety called Magnus, which was on the 1900 cover of the Livingston catalog. He couldn't get any to germinate, he sent me the seeds and I was able to get ONE plant going. Now it's VERY late when that plant went out and as first frost approached, and now I'm back at work teaching, there were a few fruits that reached the size they should be, so I picked them, they only had a wee blush on them, and left them on the counter of the kitchen at the old farmhouse where my mother was still living and told her I'd be there on the weekend to get them. I guess she didn't pay attention b'c when I got there they had ripened a bit and she had used them in a salad. There were a few more fruits on that plant and I was stopping by on my way to work and back covering and uncovering that one plant AM and PM. I finally was forced to attempt to save seeds from those partially ripe fruits still on the plant and ALL seeds out there now, for Magnus, came from those few fruits on that one plant. It's hard to save seeds from fruits that are mostly green b'c little juice and the exteriors are hard as are the walls that seperate the locules and don't break open easily which is what I do to fruits when saving seeds. Edited to add that there was never time for me to do germination tests on varieties that I planned to offer for the next year, couldn't do it and meet the SSE Deadline for sending in info. But off hand I can't remember one instance where the seeds weren't fine and germinated well for others as well as myself when I needed to regrow certin varieties to maintain seed stocks. __________________ Carolyn

July 12, 2012	#11
lakelady Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: northern NJ zone 6b Posts: 1,862	Iva and Carolyn, THANK YOU SO MUCH!! The tomato was much darker today on the counter, so I squished the contents into a glass for seed saving. BUT...it is excellent to know the seeds ripen first, then the flesh. I agree Carolyn, especially if something is late planted out, and frost threatens, at least now I know those seeds can indeed be saved and viable for future grow outs! I just wanted to be sure I'd have mature seed for next year. __________________ Antoniette

July 11, 2012	#1
lakelady Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: northern NJ zone 6b Posts: 1,862	Can you save seeds from a partially ripe tomato? This morning I went out to spend an hour watering as usual. I happened to glance at one of my dwarves and lo and behold, hidden under the dense foliage was a pink something! Got closer and sure enough, a ripening tomato was on the bottom of Yukon Quest. Unfortunately, something else noticed too and took a bite. Looks like fang bite actually and I do get snakes. Anyhow, I pulled it off the plant terribly disappointed. Considered letting it continue to ripen and eat the good part anyway in a few days, but then, not knowing what bit this tomato, I seriously reconsidered! Anyhow, it is pink, has a few days to go. Can I let it continue to ripen and at the very least, save the seeds if I can't eat it? I really hate to throw a nice tomato away!! But, I don't want to save seeds if they will not be viable. With other veggies I know they need to get good and ripe for the seeds to be good. What about the tomato? __________________ Antoniette

July 11, 2012	#2
Sun City Linda Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: SoCal Inland Posts: 2,705	I dont like to use any raw toms that have bite marks from "unknown origin." I am not opposed to throwing the uneaten part in the pot however. I seriously doubt processing companies are even as careful as I am. I think you are fine for seed saving.

July 11, 2012	#4
JamesL Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: Long Island NY Posts: 1,992	Antoinette, I am no expert but I was under the impression that saving seed is one instance where you need to leave them on the vine longer. Randall mentions that in this thread in post #16. http://www.tomatoville.com/showthread.php?t=23427

July 12, 2012	#7
Iva Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Slovenia, EU Posts: 249	Antoniette, the tomato ripens from inside out, which means it only starts changing color from green to red (or which ever other color) when it wants to indicate it is ready for harvesting. The ripe fruit color invites critters to eat it and with eating it, dispersing seeds. So in order for the tomato to start ripening, the seeds must be ripe first. In other words, the seeds ripen first, then the flesh starts coloring up. So the seeds will definitely be viable if you save them now. I've saved seeds many times from tomatoes that barely had a hint of the ripe color (a blush) and they always germinated great! Knowing this can come in handy if you have a disaster strike your tomatoes (hail, disease, storms, pets destroying your plants,...) and you want to save seeds from them. Of course, if you want to let them ripen on the counter for eating them, that's fine also, but in your case I'd just save the seeds...

August 9, 2012	#12
guruofgardens Tomatovillian™ Join Date: May 2008 Location: zone 5 Colorado Posts: 942	Thanks to Iva and carolyn for giving us hope when the frost sets in. Another question. Many of my plants have septoria spot starting at the bottom of the plant and will hopefully stay there. Will the seeds that I save have any of the disease? The tomatoes look fine and are delicious. Just don't want to share or plant any seed knowing I've 'empowered' this disease.

August 9, 2012	#13
Worth1 Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Den of Drunken Fools Posts: 38,539	From the mind of a tomato, "My seeds are ready, now I can turn red so a critter will come along and eat me so my babies will spread throughout the land". Worth

August 10, 2012	#15
guruofgardens Tomatovillian™ Join Date: May 2008 Location: zone 5 Colorado Posts: 942	Carolyn - thank you so much for giving me hope that I can save a few seeds. I usually ferment my tomato seeds, but have tried the Oxi- Clean route, too. This year I'll only do the fermentation - as a precaution for everyone I share seeds with. Thank you for sharing your weath of knowledge!