Weak seeds = weak Plants?

Tomatovator · February 19, 2007

I bought several varieties of seeds from commercial sellers and one of the seed packets contained 60 seeds instead of 30 seeds and is labeled that it is because of below average germination for the seeds. I planted 12 seeds just to see how many would germinate and only one did. The seedling is growing very slowly. If the seeds are below average as to germination will the resulting plants be below average as to yield, taste, etc. or will the ones that grow be the same as those grown from any other seeds?

blatanna · February 19, 2007

Personally, i would not accept them and would look for a refund.
I don't necessarily think the seed that germinates will produce weak plants but you are not going to get many plants if the germination rate is so low.
If you are planning to keep some seed for next year i don't think you will have any hope of getting them to germinate at all.
They are obviously old seed. You did not ask for 60 old seed but 30 fresh seed.

**carolyn137** · February 19, 2007

THere are very few seed sources that double the amount of seeds sent, but I know of one, won't name that place publicly, but if you want to PM me about it, that would be fine.

I've had a lot of experience with old seeds that I've saved in past years so I know the seed age quite well, and offered over 300 varieties of those in two large seed offers at GW, and got feedback on the germination rates.

The oldest seed I offered about three years ago was Red Brandywine froim 1991 and many folks got germination in xs of 50%.

But your question was do old seeds give less than optimal plants, and in my experience no they don't. If a seed germinates it may grow a bit slowly at first, but then does just fine.

When you purchase seeds here in the US you don't know the seed age, and the packed by date is just that, when they were packed, not when the seeds were produced.

Several of the companies that most folks deal with, re tomato seed, do germination tests but many don't.

Sandhill Preservation stands out in this regard b'c Glenn will not sell any tomato seed over two years old, and that's outstanding since he lists more than 400 varieties and that means huge rotating growouts every year.

So at this point grow out what you can, steer clear of the place where you got the low germinating seed, and PM me if you wish, b'c there's one seed company in particular that I really am concerned about.

Tomatovator · February 19, 2007

I really don't want to name the seed seller as I am happy with their service and other seeds I got from them. I don't think the seeds are necessarily old but they are very dark (blackish) in color. I know discussions about dark seeds have come up before. As long as I get one or two plants to grow normally I will be fine as it is an OP variety and I will save seeds for it this Summer if I then feel it is worth growing again.

garnetmoth · February 19, 2007

a large mailorder and online retailer often has 2 pages in the middle of the catalogue of discount seed- I bought some last year and was moderately satisfied for the low price of the seed.

1 lb of peas was a great price, even if the variety isnt super. the eggplant seeds said on the package that they send extra seed due to low germination. Never mentioned that in the catalog.

I just wont buy again unless I dont mind a crapshoot.

Tomatovator · February 20, 2007

I just took out 6 more seeds from the pack and I am going to soak them for a day or two in a weak N solution. Maybe this will wake some of them up. A lot of the seeds look like they started to sprout before they were saved. They look like some pics I saw a while back of seeds starting to sprout inside a ripe tomato. I'll find out if these grow or not.

**carolyn137** · February 20, 2007

I really don't want to name the seed seller

****

I do understand which is why I asked if you would PM me about the seller b/c I try to keep track of where problems might exist.

One other person reading but not posting in this thread did PM me about a similar problem and did name the seed source.

Of course I would keep such information confidential, although back at GW I did start a new thread each Spring for three years titled Wrong Varieties and in that thread folks did mention germination problems and most of the time they were not taken as being that serious unless several others had the same problem with the same seeds from the same seed source.

Tomatovator · February 20, 2007

As I have mentioned several times before, I am very new at this. This will be the first year I will start my plants from seed. Even the ones I'm growing now will more that likely be sacrificed or sent to someone who can use them as I won't be starting plants for my garden till the first of April. A more experienced gardener may very well get a higher germination rate than I am. The seeds may not be totally at fault. I am gaining knowledge however and by April should have a pretty good handle on what I am doing. I did not complain about the seeds to the seller as I felt something could be learned from these seeds and that is what I am doing at this point.

February 19, 2007	#1
Tomatovator Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Pennsylvania Zone 6 Posts: 461	Weak seeds = weak Plants? I bought several varieties of seeds from commercial sellers and one of the seed packets contained 60 seeds instead of 30 seeds and is labeled that it is because of below average germination for the seeds. I planted 12 seeds just to see how many would germinate and only one did. The seedling is growing very slowly. If the seeds are below average as to germination will the resulting plants be below average as to yield, taste, etc. or will the ones that grow be the same as those grown from any other seeds?

February 19, 2007	#2
blatanna Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Ireland Posts: 150	weak seed Personally, i would not accept them and would look for a refund. I don't necessarily think the seed that germinates will produce weak plants but you are not going to get many plants if the germination rate is so low. If you are planning to keep some seed for next year i don't think you will have any hope of getting them to germinate at all. They are obviously old seed. You did not ask for 60 old seed but 30 fresh seed. __________________ Blatanna

February 19, 2007	#3
carolyn137 Moderator Emeritus Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Upstate NY, zone 4b/5a Posts: 21,169	THere are very few seed sources that double the amount of seeds sent, but I know of one, won't name that place publicly, but if you want to PM me about it, that would be fine. I've had a lot of experience with old seeds that I've saved in past years so I know the seed age quite well, and offered over 300 varieties of those in two large seed offers at GW, and got feedback on the germination rates. The oldest seed I offered about three years ago was Red Brandywine froim 1991 and many folks got germination in xs of 50%. But your question was do old seeds give less than optimal plants, and in my experience no they don't. If a seed germinates it may grow a bit slowly at first, but then does just fine. When you purchase seeds here in the US you don't know the seed age, and the packed by date is just that, when they were packed, not when the seeds were produced. Several of the companies that most folks deal with, re tomato seed, do germination tests but many don't. Sandhill Preservation stands out in this regard b'c Glenn will not sell any tomato seed over two years old, and that's outstanding since he lists more than 400 varieties and that means huge rotating growouts every year. So at this point grow out what you can, steer clear of the place where you got the low germinating seed, and PM me if you wish, b'c there's one seed company in particular that I really am concerned about. __________________ Carolyn

February 20, 2007	#7
carolyn137 Moderator Emeritus Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Upstate NY, zone 4b/5a Posts: 21,169	I really don't want to name the seed seller **** I do understand which is why I asked if you would PM me about the seller b/c I try to keep track of where problems might exist. One other person reading but not posting in this thread did PM me about a similar problem and did name the seed source. Of course I would keep such information confidential, although back at GW I did start a new thread each Spring for three years titled Wrong Varieties and in that thread folks did mention germination problems and most of the time they were not taken as being that serious unless several others had the same problem with the same seeds from the same seed source. __________________ Carolyn

February 19, 2007	#5
garnetmoth Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: cincinnati, oh Posts: 492	a large mailorder and online retailer often has 2 pages in the middle of the catalogue of discount seed- I bought some last year and was moderately satisfied for the low price of the seed. 1 lb of peas was a great price, even if the variety isnt super. the eggplant seeds said on the package that they send extra seed due to low germination. Never mentioned that in the catalog. I just wont buy again unless I dont mind a crapshoot.