Help! Slow growth and curling cotyledons

[Kazedwards]

So I started almost all of my tomatoes and peppers using the baggy Method late February potting them at fist sign of germination into solo cups. A lot of them were up out of the soil by 3-6. So far very few are just now starting to get true leaves and the cotyledons are curling. I have a small light set up in a second story furnace room that gets down in the lower 60s and up to the 70s. The lights that I am are 2 2 bulb T8 6500k lights and also a plant light that I got when I first started growing from seed. At first I thought that the lights were the problem so I raised them to about 4-5” above. They were 2-3” before. They are not at all leggy but leaning a bit perhaps. They are on for about 18 hours with 6-8 hours between but that isn’t always consistent. They are in seed starting Mix. I don’t really know what going on. Previous years I have started them under lights in the garage with lower temps. The only thing different is the brand of starting Mix and also I got a new light fixture. It just seem weird and I’m out of ideas as to what is going on. I also have a small container of mint under the same lights that is going bonkers by now. I don’t know if that matters. Any help is greatly appreciated!





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[bower]

The purple leaf undersides and stems are a classic sign of phosphorus deficiency.
That can be caused by several things:
1) Cold prevents normal P uptake

2) Soil deficient or pH imbalanced - too acid or too alkaline

3) Waterlogged soil also prevents normal P uptake


I have often seen seedlings like this - purple leafed is common in my starting conditions and I consider it a good sign that cold-resistance genes are being activated.
The curling leaves are not so common but I have seen it too. Combination of cold and wet can produce that. But tomatoes classically curl their leaves in response to various stresses:
- not enough light
- roots touched something they didn't like (usually cold/wet combo here)


So the first thing I would suggest is to hold off watering a bit.


I have seen lots of toms and peppers that curled their cots and went on to be big healthy plants.

[slugworth]

cold soil temp and waterlogged
I had one interesting seedling that was anemic/yellow right off the bat when it popped.
It didn't even start nice and green

[Rajun Gardener]

When did you first notice the curled leaves? Was it after turning the lights back on? My plants in the greenhouse will do that at night especially with cooler temps. Even pepper plants will react that way.



From the looks of the moisture I'd say you won't have to water those again till they have 4 true leaves unless you have a fan blowing across them which is a good idea to harden the stalks.

[oakley]

Looks too cold and too damp. I'd get a fan on them. Let them dry out. Also the soil
looks heavy. Not a nice fluffy clean seed starting mix.
They should recover fine if you let them dry out.

[Nan_PA_6b]

1. Let them dry out.

2. You say your lights were 2-3 ft. away from the plants and now you've got them 3-4 ft. away? Not enough light. How close can you put the lights without burning the plants? That's how close they need to be. It's hard to get enough artificial light to seedlings.

[brownrexx]

I have my lights 2-3 INCHES above my seedlings, not 2-3 feet.

[Kazedwards]

The lights re 3-4 inches not feet. I repotted a few last night thinking it might be the starting mix I used. The root systems seemed very healthy. Over a foot long once I knocked the starting mix loose. I also rotated them between the 2 lights. I plan on repotting more tonight. I also found the the bottom third of the soil was quite soggy so I’m cutting back on water. I can’t do much as far as temperature. Hopefully they will pull out of it in the next month. Thank you all for the help!


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[Kazedwards]

Here is a picture of my light set up. I have lowered back down to about 2-3 inches. This is my 5th year starting from seed and haven’t had this issue before. Actually last year I started them in our garage which stays much cooler. Life happened but the garden didn’t and they didn’t make it to planting but way better start than this year. Also our water is really hard could that be part of the issue?




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[Kazedwards]

I just realized that I didn’t post the close up pictures of the worst plants. I also switched a bulb from each light fixture tonight. Each fixture has a new bulb and a bulb a few years old.



The root system of one I repotted



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[clkeiper]

personally I wouldn't worry about that but do put something under the plant trays to raise them up. they are leaning and stretching because they need more light. they look too cold too. their color is a bit off in the photos but that isn't always an accurate representation of the true color they are. the cup on the left looks yellowy green and the one one the right looks normal.

[bower]

Finding the soil soggy in the bottom is enough to explain the curling and purpling.

There is so much variation in starter soil water retention. I found peaty mixes to be way too good at holding the moisture in my cold seed starting environment. Seedlings were unhappy all the time, because the peaty stuff didn't dry out nicely and there was always more moisture than they needed to transpire or use.
OTOH you may help it a bit by making bigger drainage holes in your cups. Pooling at the bottom is a sign it is just not draining out as it should.


Hard water can have effects, but I wouldn't expect to see that at seedling stage, only in pots that have been watered for a whole season or more. And your seedlings were okay last year so it is probably not a factor.

[zipcode]

Some of those seedlings are definitely yellowish, which is a really bad sign for that age (low nitrogen besides the low P). So it's nutrient/root problem, not just cold. Too much water is of course possible, or wrong pH as said etc. Possibly complete lack of nutrients but somewhat unlikely.
A good mix in those cups should not be soggy at the bottom when dry at the surface, that is the number one sign of a poor mix. I use these party cups and I'm always surprised how evenly it dries out.

[Kazedwards]

The reason some of them are bending is bc they are growing towards the new light. Hopefully that problem is solved now that I switched bulbs around. It sounds like the consensus is too much water and poor quality mix. So do I just cut back on water or repot into better quality mix?


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[SueCT]

Honestly, I would repot if they aren't growing. Up to you how much time you want to potentially waste waiting for them to grow. I would do at least a few. That will also give you the chance to examine the roots more closely, or lack of roots, as well as time to replant if they don't recover. See how a few do in better mix over a couple of days and see if it seems to make any difference. Its all your call. If it was still early I would probably just try a few first. If you are worried about being behind in getting the plants ready to plant out on time, I might do at least half right away hoping to have more ready to plant out earlier. JMHO