LED fixture recommendation

[Billm302]

I am in the process of restructuring my seed starting fixtures. I currently use T5 HO 48” fixtures for all shelves. I need to set up a new area for my larger seedlings, mainly tomatoes in 4” pots.

I want to start changing over to LED lights. The areas I have identified are 2’ x 4’ shelves. I could mount the new fixture(s) up to 48” above the next lower SHELF.

I have read the threads about LED lights but am more confused than enlightened. My first crack at a plan is to convert 4’ Fluor fixtures to use LED bulbs. But then I thought I should look into other LED fixtures since I have to purchase new fixtures either way.

So what I am looking for is specific fixture/bulb recommendations for how to best cover areas configured 2’ x 4’.

Thanks in advance for any and all thoughts.

[Milan HP]

I'd say that LED grow tubes may be the answer. I can't recommend a specific product as there are quite a few. I'd go for those with inbuilt UV LEDs and full spectrum.

Milan HP

[ClarkB]

I'm certainly no authority on the subject, but I can at least share my experience. I started my seeds a bit too early in 2020 and had about 50 tomato plants and a handful of peppers in my living room with a little sunlight and a single 150W Mars Hydro TS1000 grow light (3'x3' recommended coverage) to support them. Most of the tomatoes were in 0.7 gallon pots and were 12"-24" tall with a couple taller cherries in early May when we still had snow coming down here in upstate NY (photo is on May 8). I had the pots all on plastic bin tops and rotated 4 groups of plants on 4 hour intervals during the day giving each one the prime spot for one interval and peripheral light for the other three. I then moved the light over a 5th group for the 8 hour overnight period. There were a couple varieties that didn't thrive, but most did quite well and grew into huge, healthy plants in the garden. I had ripe cherries on 6 varieties before 7/1 after planting out around 5/18. Thinking I'll pony up for a couple more this year to avoid the shuffling. I'm sure there are other similar lights that will give similar or better growth, but I was quite happy with the results under these conditions.

[Salaam]

Originally Posted by ClarkB

I'm certainly no authority on the subject, but I can at least share my experience. I started my seeds a bit too early in 2020 and had about 50 tomato plants and a handful of peppers in my living room with a little sunlight and a single 150W Mars Hydro TS1000 grow light (3'x3' recommended coverage) to support them. Most of the tomatoes were in 0.7 gallon pots and were 12"-24" tall with a couple taller cherries in early May when we still had snow coming down here in upstate NY (photo is on May 8). I had the pots all on plastic bin tops and rotated 4 groups of plants on 4 hour intervals during the day giving each one the prime spot for one interval and peripheral light for the other three. I then moved the light over a 5th group for the 8 hour overnight period. There were a couple varieties that didn't thrive, but most did quite well and grew into huge, healthy plants in the garden. I had ripe cherries on 6 varieties before 7/1 after planting out around 5/18. Thinking I'll pony up for a couple more this year to avoid the shuffling. I'm sure there are other similar lights that will give similar or better growth, but I was quite happy with the results under these conditions.

Hi, what do you find the coverage area to be in reality, for vegetative growth only? 3x3?

[Ozark]

We have lots of 4-foot double-bulb flourescent shop lights in and around our home - they're in my wood shop, on the patio, in our recessed kitchen ceiling, and every spring I raise tomato and pepper seedlings under three hanging shop lights, 6 bulbs total, covering an area of 4' x 2'.


I bought a case of 25 LED tube bulbs and I'm replacing all the flourescent bulbs with them. The bulbs I bought are "T8 LED Bulbs, 5000K Daylight, Ballast Bypass Tubes; 14 watt - 1800 lumens - One Sided Direct Wire - 4 Ft." We really like the ones I've installed so far.


I intend to install these in the shop lights I use for seedlings also. Those fixtures are old and I've been putting up with flickering lights, buzzing ballasts, and old bulbs that often burn out. With the LED's I shouldn't have any of those problems.


Possibly 6500K bulbs would have been better than 5000's for seedlings, but I'd like to use the bulbs I bought - after all, I'll be using 6 bulbs for only 8 square feet. Thinking that should work OK, what do you think? Thx.

[Milan HP]

Originally Posted by Ozark

We have lots of 4-foot double-bulb flourescent shop lights in and around our home - they're in my wood shop, on the patio, in our recessed kitchen ceiling, and every spring I raise tomato and pepper seedlings under three hanging shop lights, 6 bulbs total, covering an area of 4' x 2'.


I bought a case of 25 LED tube bulbs and I'm replacing all the flourescent bulbs with them. The bulbs I bought are "T8 LED Bulbs, 5000K Daylight, Ballast Bypass Tubes; 14 watt - 1800 lumens - One Sided Direct Wire - 4 Ft." We really like the ones I've installed so far.


I intend to install these in the shop lights I use for seedlings also. Those fixtures are old and I've been putting up with flickering lights, buzzing ballasts, and old bulbs that often burn out. With the LED's I shouldn't have any of those problems.


Possibly 6500K bulbs would have been better than 5000's for seedlings, but I'd like to use the bulbs I bought - after all, I'll be using 6 bulbs for only 8 square feet. Thinking that should work OK, what do you think? Thx.

They sound pretty good to me. Their efficiency is quite high and the drawbacks of ballast luminescent tubes can really be annoying. And I am not speaking about the fact that they lose a lot of their intensity with age (up to 40%). If I understand right, you won't have to replace the fixtures.

From the plants' point of view, it's a good idea to have a look at their color spectrum. Not that fluorescent tubes are optimal in that respect. With 5,000°K, I wonder if the LED bulbs radiate enough energy in the blue wavelengths.

Milan HP

[Greatgardens]

I've had poor results from LED tubes that are replacements for 4ft. fluorescent bulbs. I have had very good success with 1 T8 Daylight + 1 T8 Growlux bulb. I've also had good luck with these:

https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

The one thing I'd add is that I don't like the 2ft lengths for my setup. I need 4ft, and joining them does not work out very well, since the joint is not rigid. I use two of these joined along with a T8 daylight bulb. I don't try to grow plants beyond 8-10 weeks, so I have no experience with trying to get fruit from them.

[snagged]

I recently got one of the new XS series lights from Viparspectra (to replace my CFL bulb setup). Have just been testing it so far, but am pleased with it. They seemed to have the best bang for the buck among LED lights right now. You can also find promo codes in YouTube video reviews. Their website has maps showing coverage area for their different light options.

[SQWIBB]

for your setup I would start out with some 6500 k LED bulbs, fairly easy to mod a shop light, and I will explain why at the end.


I started with Fluorescents, then 6000k leds then went to some Roleadros then Viaprspectra 450's then Viparspectra 700's to be honest the Led tubes were just as good and had good coverage.
I ended up with the 3 Viparspectra 700's only because they were for an indoor grow tent and I didn't want to get rid of them so I installed them on my Seed Starting Bench.




2016

• 4 Fluorescent tube shop light modified with 4 additional Led Tubes.

• I also added some ribbon led's 4 ribbons.

• This is before I replaced the Fluors with Led's

2018

• Then I went to some Roleadros.

2019

• 2 Viparspectra 450's

2020

• Two Viparspectra 700's

2021

• And just yesterday installed another Viparspectra 700 positioning them differently. It seems like overkill but the coverage is much better and since there are three dimmer switches on each 700, I can dial back the intensity of each color, (3 channel spectral control), Red White Blue and also adjust the 700's up or down.

• I also have an overflow area that has a Modded four 6500k Led fixture. this is an adjustable shelf on ratchet straps.

My point is, everything I have done from Fluorescent to Led Tubes to Led Grow lights has worked. I like to tweak as you can see by this post. The only drawback about using Tube Led's on a one shelf setup like mine is that you may have to adjust the height of the plants as some may grow quicker than others this is why I like the 3 separate led grow lights as they can be adjusted independently by moving up and down and dimming each grow light.


Again this is for a one shelf setup, you have multiple shelves and I would look into cheap 4 fixture shop-lights or 2 bulb shop light fixtures for each shelf and some LED bulbs and mod them yourself.
You could do three shelves for what it cost me for one Viparspectra 700.


I think I have a post somewhere here on how to mod the shop lights to led's


Found it
http://tomatoville.com/showthread.ph...ghlight=SQWIBB

[Milan HP]

Hello SQWIBB,
this is amazing. You've solved the coverage excellently. It's the key problem. It must have cost you a fortune though. I wonder if the Viparspectras also have UV LEDs built in. I am almost sure they do.

Do you grow tomatoes for fruit under them, that is apart from the plants visible in your photos? That's what I have been doing for 3 years, but my means are terribly primitive compared to yours. I just have a cable/wire system of fluors, LED bulbs and LED grow bulbs. It only has one advantage: it's easily adjustable as the plants grow unevenly. And I have them on window sills, so they also get some daylight. Not really much this winter.
Milan HP

[SQWIBB]

They do have IR built in.









My main issue was when I stared my seedlings for the outdoor garden, they were immediately ravaged by aphids. I was washing the seedlings every other day, never again.











Plus I had a mice problem because of the indoor grow, they really loved the Bok Choy.













I did learn a few things and thought this was interesting.

[Shapshftr]

It looks like those Viparspectras already have UV and Infrared, so you probably don't need to add more of either. Too much would be harmful rather than beneficial.

[Milan HP]

Originally Posted by Shapshftr

It looks like those Viparspectras already have UV and Infrared, so you probably don't need to add more of either. Too much would be harmful rather than beneficial.

Sorry for disagreeing, but judging by the info in the picture they definitely have IR but no UV (below 400 nm). Their spectrum is impressively full, no question about that.
It's debatable whether a few UV LEDs can actually radiate enough energy to make the plants hardened. I am sure that fluorescent tubes don't do that either. It's just about reducing the sunscald effects.

Milan HP

[Billm302]

I am the OP. I think I will go with the lights below. The only thing I will have to figure out is how many lites per 2’ x 8’ shelf and how far above the top of the plants.


https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...ldnSite=1&th=1

[Milan HP]

Originally Posted by Billm302

I am the OP. I think I will go with the lights below. The only thing I will have to figure out is how many lites per 2’ x 8’ shelf and how far above the top of the plants.


https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...ldnSite=1&th=1

I'd say it's a good choice. They may not be as efficient as CXBs but the difference won't be dramatic. And they are optimal in terms of coverage and installation. Didn't find their spectrum though.
Milan HP