necessity of uppotting and tray for manging starters?

[paradajky]

Hi!


This will seem pretty banal and probably stupid to most of you. Consider I'm simply excited to finally get started this year and I'm trying to get better compared to my abysmal results last year



I've planned out more plants to grow from seed this year than ever before, hopefully somewhere between 40 and 50**. I will be most likely re-using 6-cell nursery seedling things, then transplanting to 4" pots once they will grow out the ~1.5" cells (or maybe they are 2" I am not at home to measure them now, they are the typical six-packs you see in US nurseries and box stores).



First question: is necessary to do such an up-potting, since nurseries sell healthy seedlings in these small six-pack containers to start with?



Second: what are some tray ideas so I could capture the run-off water (i.e. prevent it from dirtying my house and patio), and also transport the seedlings quickly?


In the past I found the 6-cell fit into the pre-washed greens containers, but that was easy since I only had two 6-cell containers, so 2 greens containers needed only. I would need 6 more and not sure how I'd eat that many greens in one week. Next, if up-potting, I think only two or three 4" pots fit into these so I'd need another 12.. I think I could eat that many in 4-6 weeks to transplant. Then again, that'd be a pain to move around that many once they are in?



I also considered purchasing a 72 starter plug tray cell thing since it comes with a humidity dome and a tray underneath, but, they are flimsy, and like.. why.. when I already have all these 6-cells here at home. Except of course some sort of tray. With the small plugs, I would certainly need to transplant, so this still leaves me missing a tray for the 4" pots.



Would cheap aluminum baking sheets from the restaurant supply store be okay? I'm a little worried about the reflective nature and heat-conducting metal once the seedlings are outside.



Thank you for your time!



** probably a bad idea since I don't really have the space but whatever, I couldn't decide on the varieties so I said wtf and ordered them all

[DK2021]

Originally Posted by paradajky

Hi!


This will seem pretty banal and probably stupid to most of you. Consider I'm simply excited to finally get started this year and I'm trying to get better compared to my abysmal results last year



I've planned out more plants to grow from seed this year than ever before, hopefully somewhere between 40 and 50**. I will be most likely re-using 6-cell nursery seedling things, then transplanting to 4" pots once they will grow out the ~1.5" cells (or maybe they are 2" I am not at home to measure them now, they are the typical six-packs you see in US nurseries and box stores).



First question: is necessary to do such an up-potting, since nurseries sell healthy seedlings in these small six-pack containers to start with?



Second: what are some tray ideas so I could capture the run-off water (i.e. prevent it from dirtying my house and patio), and also transport the seedlings quickly?


In the past I found the 6-cell fit into the pre-washed greens containers, but that was easy since I only had two 6-cell containers, so 2 greens containers needed only. I would need 6 more and not sure how I'd eat that many greens in one week. Next, if up-potting, I think only two or three 4" pots fit into these so I'd need another 12.. I think I could eat that many in 4-6 weeks to transplant. Then again, that'd be a pain to move around that many once they are in?



I also considered purchasing a 72 starter plug tray cell thing since it comes with a humidity dome and a tray underneath, but, they are flimsy, and like.. why.. when I already have all these 6-cells here at home. Except of course some sort of tray. With the small plugs, I would certainly need to transplant, so this still leaves me missing a tray for the 4" pots.



Would cheap aluminum baking sheets from the restaurant supply store be okay? I'm a little worried about the reflective nature and heat-conducting metal once the seedlings are outside.



Thank you for your time!



** probably a bad idea since I don't really have the space but whatever, I couldn't decide on the varieties so I said wtf and ordered them all

You do not want seedlings to be stressed by insufficient space (or light/nutrients/water). Those six-packs of tomato seedlings that are 6 inches tall and already flowering are doing so because they are stressed. Yes, you can bury such stressed seedlings deep when planting out, but why not start with healthy, unstressed plants?

So, YES to potting up, and don't postpone this until the seedlings "out grow" their initial container. Good rule of thumb is to pot up when they've got the first set of true leaves.
Some of the 1020 black plastic trays I've seen/used are really rather flimsy. And when you have a leaky tray that has dripped water all over your floors, you'll get to where I was when I decided it was worth spending the money on a really strong tray that will last for years. I bought the "mega heavy duty" trays sold by Greenhouse Mega Store and boy, they're not kidding that these are heavy duty. These are not going to flex or bend or crack or leak...I love them! Take-out containers work as trays too, if you want to stick to reuse/recycle. Metal trays in southern CA are probably a very bad idea.

As to seed starting containers, I wouldn't personally use a 72-cell tray for tomatoes. Those cells are tiny and you'd want to pot up maybe even before the first true leaves emerge. Remember that root systems develop far faster than the above-ground growth.
I have used the biggest size Jiffy pellets (OK, but I don't want to use peat, and the "biodegradable" casing doesn't biodegrade and I always remove it before potting up), 1020 tray inserts...currently using ones with cells 2.25 x 1.5 x 2.25 deep which I inherited from a friend who closed down his nursery), and this year I am going to try out soil blocking from seeing the success others have had with that. Whichever method/container, my goal is to pot up BEFORE the seedlings' roots have outgrown the initial space they have.
As an aside, you might ask gardening shops if you could have any extra trays etc that they have after the cells/pots they held have been sold. The local shops in my area are always happy to let me have a few. I like the ones that hold 4" round pots or 3 to 4" square pots which are sizes that I use quite a bit (not just for tomatoes).

[paradajky]

Ah.. 1020 trays... THANK YOU!

[DK2021]

Originally Posted by paradajky

Ah.. 1020 trays... THANK YOU!

Yes, 10" x 20" trays--these also fit on standard heat mats, if you plan to use one. Possibly not necessary in your area, at least during the warmer times of year. I didn't have one when I lived in San Diego but where I am now it's a necessity.
Again, if you ask nicely at garden shops and such, they might be generous and let you have some of these plastic trays etc. for free, especially if it's a sideline of their business and they otherwise would put the plastic out for recycling. I've been given free stuff like that from my local garden center and a local pet supply shop that also carries a few herbs and such in the spring.

[MrsJustice]

I will be most likely re-using 6-cell nursery seedling things

If you reuse your 6 cell nursery trays; just made sure you soak and clean them very well.

One Day I will share my seedling methods here.

Farmer, Joyce Beggs

[TomNJ]

I never pot-up. Instead I start my seedlings in larger pots to begin with, 3.5" x 3.5", and never disturb them. After four weeks under lights and a week of hardening off they are 12-14" tall, and I plant them out deep. Been doing this for 48 years and my plants are healthy and productive. Last year I averaged 24 lbs per plant.

[paradajky]

Good advice Mrs J.

TomNJ: It's a bit trickier planting "deep" with containers (no yard here), so a theory I just made up now on the spot to support up potting is to simulate a little bit of a deep root system from the plant stem with gradual pot size increases. In reality my whole two seasons hands-on** experience is based on what internet research told me to do hah!

Given my temperate climate, and my generally lazy nature, planting directly in the 4" pots sounds like a great idea. Any results would be better than last year! Thanks for helping justify skipping a step

[Spike2]

I have 4X4 inch pots that I use to start seeds. I start 4 seeds a pot and when they are large enough they get their very own solo cup!



I wash my pots, then soak them in a clorox/water mix, rinse well, dry and put aside till the next season.

[paradajky]

I went to my local hydroponics shop to look at 1020 trays and they are much smaller than expected, and do not fit the small 6 pack thingies (6x2.5" cells) or the 4" square pots very nicely. They really seem to be only designed for the smaller cell inserts or simply using them for free-form sowing.



I have a few of these open trays that the interior measures 16"x16", they take 16 of the 4" square pots or 6 of the 6-packs.



After some internet searching, I cannot seem to find any that are solid to catch the drip. Same for the 4" round pot tray. Do they exist? What are these? I'll try calling the nurseries around me to see what these are, but they won't open for a few more hours and I thought it'd be interesting to share for sake of discussion. I suppose I could cut up a garbage bag and line the inside, but, meh. Maybe I'll see if the restaurant supply store has a low-walled bussing tray or something.

[bitterwort]

I've gotten some very nice heavy-duty flats and also heavy garden trays from Greenhouse Megastore in the past. See if any of these fit your needs.
https://www.greenhousemegastore.com/...s/trays-flats/

[paradajky]

Thanks for the link. DK2021 mentioned the shop and I found that as well the other day. At this point, I'm more just curious what these trays are since I can't find them online anywhere, and all the local nurseries and box stores are using these. Ah, well, no perfect solution as usual, just have to find a nice compromise that I like.

[DK2021]

Looks like shipping on any size order is free this week at www.greenhousemegastore.com. I have those "mega heavy duty" trays and love them! I have used 1020 trays that were comparatively flimsy and sometimes would crack when I was carrying a loaded tray and even more often develop leaks because the plastic was so thin...arrgh! The heavy-duty ones are more expensive but you know, sometimes you do get what you pay for! Though again, if you're lucky, you might get decent supplies free, or improvise with something like a cafeteria tray. As MrsJustice points out--anything you acquire that's already been used and that will contact your plants (pots, tray inserts, cells) should be disinfected to avoid disease.


I've used a lot of gerry-rigged set-ups in the past and I still do re-use things like plastic take-out containers. But 1020 trays are pretty standard and many things (heat mats, grow lights, tray inserts) are designed to fit them. I also like them as they fit my germination set-up well. I have a 30"-wide Metro 6-shelf unit on wheels fitted with 24" LED grow lights on four of the shelves. Two of the shelves also have a 10x20 heat mat. I have a surge-protected power strip that has a timer for half the outlets (for the lights) and constant power to half the outlets (for the heat mats). It's a tidy set up and easy to move as everything is on wheels., and it takes relatively little space (30" x 14").

[zeuspaul]

I use 2-1/2" x 12" x 20" stainless steel chaffing/serving pans. I like these because they last forever. All of my plastic trays are cracked and no longer useable. 1-1/4" deep is also available.
https://www.webstaurantstore.com/cho...p/4070029.html

[MrsJustice]

Originally Posted by zeuspaul

I use 2-1/2" x 12" x 20" stainless steel chaffing/serving pans. I like these because they last forever. All of my plastic trays are cracked and no longer useable. 1-1/4" deep is also available.
https://www.webstaurantstore.com/cho...p/4070029.html

Hello

How does your pan drain the water from your plants?

Do you put holds in the bottom of your pans?

[Salaam]

Being a beginner with some experience, I would say that going the standard way is best. That is, to use 1020 trays, which as many said many things are designed to fit them. If the common wire shelf that many people use fit four 1020 trays neatly per shelf (https://www.costcobusinessdelivery.c...100336293.html).

As for the insert, using a standard insert such as this (https://www.greenhousemegastore.com/...f%3fcount%3d60) helps if you are growing a lot of seedlings because it is easier to fill with soil if all your inserts are the same. You can fill, press down with the bottom of another insert, then fill again to pack it in, the wet.

If you're not growing that many seedlings, then 8 to 10 ounce plastic drinking cups are cheap and work well. Just poke holes around the bottom edges, and you should be able to get about 18 at least to one tray. And they're nice and deep.

I don't pot up - too much work. I would say that for tomatoes, 3.5 inch containers are good to start and finish. You can use 2.5 inch containers, but I would plant those as soon as they get to six to eight inches.