Bag of Topsoil and Coffee Grounds

maupin · July 19, 2011

After years on the farm I find myself in the city learning how to grow in containers.

I only have access to coffee grounds-- a lot of them-- as a free soil amendment.

If my container tomatoes are liberally top dressed with spent coffee grounds will that be enough?

fortyonenorth · July 19, 2011

I'm not sure of the nutrient make-up of spent coffee grounds, but I know they make an excellent amendment. Are you asking whether they would provide adequate fertility? I don't think that would be enough.

oc tony · July 19, 2011

I've done the coffee ground thing. The grounds take nutrients from the soil for about 6 weeks before they start to break down and start feeding the plants, so you should use some fertilizer. Another thing you have to watch out for is winds over 20 to 25 miles an hour as they'll blow the grounds out of the containers. You can add a cup or two of fresh grounds every week or two to the containers after the initial 6 week period with out using any other fertilizer.

DiggingDogFarm · July 20, 2011

You can use coffee grounds as the "seed meal" part of the following organic fertilizer recipe for a more complete fertilizer......

"Steve Solomon's Organic Fertilizer Recipe

Mix uniformly, in parts by volume:
4 parts seed meal*
1/4 part ordinary agricultural lime, best finely ground
1/4 part gypsum (or double the agricultural lime)
1/2 part dolomitic lime

Plus, for best results:
1 part bone meal, rock phosphate or high-phosphate guano
1/2 to 1 part kelp meal (or 1 part basalt dust)

*For a more sustainable and less expensive option, you can substitute chemical-free grass clippings for the seed meal, although clippings will not provoke the same strong growth response. Use about a half-inch-thick layer of fresh clippings (six to seven 5-gallon bucketfuls per 100 square feet), chopped into the top 2 inches of your soil with a hoe. Then spread an additional 1-inch-thick layer as a surface mulch."

Read more here: http://www.motherearthnews.com/Organ...ur-Garden.aspx

Alberta · July 20, 2011

If you put too much coffee grounds on top of the containers, it will mat up and not allow water penetration when you water. I would do as diggingdogfarm suggests, read the issue of Mother Earth News. Now with that said...I do some growing in pots also, large pots, this year mostly for peppers. In all honesty I simply added 1/2 compost to the potting mix I use, and the peppers are doing wonderfully. I have 3 cherry tomatoes in pots also (besides the ones I have in the ground) and they too were mixed with half compost and half potting mix. I use Pro-Mix.
Alberta

attml · February 25, 2012

I know I am a little late in this thread but saw it and just wanted to put something out there. Be careful how much in the way of coffee grounds you use because they can stunt plant growth (no joke). There has always been studies about caffeine stunting growth in humans, but apparently caffeine can stunt growth in plants as well. In 8th grade science we were asked to do an experiment on 3 plants using the same seeds in 3 separate containers to test the stunting of growth theory in coffee. Cup A got only water, cup B received lightly caffinated tea and cup C got dark heavily caffeinate coffee. All 3 plants received an equal amout of liquid and a equal amount of light. The result of the experiment was pretty cool and very consistant across the class. The cups with water grew the highest, tea grew second highest and the coffee fed plants came in last every time! There was a very noticable difference between the water plant and the coffee plant! The conclusion: Caffinated coffee stunts plant growth!

Just an FYI and if your kids have to do an experiment for science at school for a project and need an idea that is a pretty good one!

Mark

fortyonenorth · February 25, 2012

Attml - If you have a chance to conduct the experiment again, try adding a "Cup D" - decaffeinated coffee. My bet is that it is not the caffein limiting the growth and you would get the same results as the caffeinated cup.

Quote:

Originally Posted by attml

I know I am a little late in this thread but saw it and just wanted to put something out there. Be careful how much in the way of coffee grounds you use because they can stunt plant growth (no joke). There has always been studies about caffeine stunting growth in humans, but apparently caffeine can stunt growth in plants as well. In 8th grade science we were asked to do an experiment on 3 plants using the same seeds in 3 separate containers to test the stunting of growth theory in coffee. Cup A got only water, cup B received lightly caffinated tea and cup C got dark heavily caffeinate coffee. All 3 plants received an equal amout of liquid and a equal amount of light. The result of the experiment was pretty cool and very consistant across the class. The cups with water grew the highest, tea grew second highest and the coffee fed plants came in last every time! There was a very noticable difference between the water plant and the coffee plant! The conclusion: Caffinated coffee stunts plant growth!

Just an FYI and if your kids have to do an experiment for science at school for a project and need an idea that is a pretty good one!

Mark

feldon30 · February 25, 2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by maupin

After years on the farm I find myself in the city learning how to grow in containers.

I only have access to coffee grounds-- a lot of them-- as a free soil amendment.

If my container tomatoes are liberally top dressed with spent coffee grounds will that be enough?

My bigger question is, where's the topsoil from?

If it's the 99 cent bags from Wal-Mart, then it's like gardening in cement.

RayR · February 25, 2012

I agree with fortyonenorth, there are other factors other than caffeine that may skew the experiment. Decaf would be a good option for the test. If I was doing an experiment to to determine if caffeine had any effect on plant growth I would use pure caffeine dissolved in water instead of highly caffeinated coffee. The low PH of the coffee I would expect to be a major limiting factor in growth itself. Regardless of what the solution is, coffee, tea, tap water or whatever, I would want to know the PH of the soil itself before and after. The type of plant is a factor too since some plants are more tolerant of low PH conditions than others.

ArcherB · February 25, 2012

Another point on the experiment is that caffeine is water soluble and usually leaves the grounds when brewed. From what I understand, there is very little caffeine left in used coffee grounds.

Of course, this is just what I've read. I have not done any experimentation on my own. Might be a good one to perform though. Do the same experiment but amend coffee grounds and used tea leaves in the soil and water with... well, water.

RayR · February 25, 2012

I've not seen any definitive proof that caffeine has any effect on plant growth. I seen some claims on the Internet both ways but I'm skeptical of the conclusions. One claimed that watering Mung Beans with coffee made the seedling grow faster than with water alone, so the conclusion was that the caffeine was beneficial to the plant growth. I think that conclusion is highly questionable. Coffee also contains Nitrogen, so would it not be logical that the added Nitrogen may be the real growth factor instead of jumping to the conclusion that it was the caffeine?

Petronius_II · February 25, 2012

Steve Solomon's recipe may not be specifically too good for alkaline soils, which are typical of the American Southwest. Before I'd mix up a big batch of any homemade fertilizer recipe, I'd want to consult with some local experts.

One thing I do know about typical New Mexico soils is, usually the biggest concern is getting enough phosphorus. YMMV, obviously.

EDITED TO ADD: Steve Solomon does mention exactly this on page 3 of the Mother Earth News article. Good for him.

attml · February 25, 2012

I agree a decafinated plant would have been a good addition to the experiment! I guess the only way to tell would be to do a side by side comparison of the same plant from the same seeds; one with coffee drounds and one without? I would be interested as well to see if there was any difference in the growth rate?

dice · February 28, 2012

A scientific test of the contributions coffee grounds can make to
a garden soil or container mix:
http://www.sunset.com/garden/earth-f...0400000016986/
(Emphasis is on amending soils with it, but the nutrient availability should
be the same when mixed into container mix.)

July 19, 2011	#1
maupin Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Northern Thailand Posts: 77	Bag of Topsoil and Coffee Grounds After years on the farm I find myself in the city learning how to grow in containers. I only have access to coffee grounds-- a lot of them-- as a free soil amendment. If my container tomatoes are liberally top dressed with spent coffee grounds will that be enough?

July 20, 2011	#4
DiggingDogFarm Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: New York State Posts: 286	You can use coffee grounds as the "seed meal" part of the following organic fertilizer recipe for a more complete fertilizer...... "Steve Solomon's Organic Fertilizer Recipe Mix uniformly, in parts by volume: 4 parts seed meal* 1/4 part ordinary agricultural lime, best finely ground 1/4 part gypsum (or double the agricultural lime) 1/2 part dolomitic lime Plus, for best results: 1 part bone meal, rock phosphate or high-phosphate guano 1/2 to 1 part kelp meal (or 1 part basalt dust) *For a more sustainable and less expensive option, you can substitute chemical-free grass clippings for the seed meal, although clippings will not provoke the same strong growth response. Use about a half-inch-thick layer of fresh clippings (six to seven 5-gallon bucketfuls per 100 square feet), chopped into the top 2 inches of your soil with a hoe. Then spread an additional 1-inch-thick layer as a surface mulch." Read more here: http://www.motherearthnews.com/Organ...ur-Garden.aspx __________________ "The best thing about a vegetable garden is all the meat you can shoot and trap out of it!"

February 25, 2012	#12
Petronius_II Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Albuquerque, NM - Zone 7a Posts: 209	Steve Solomon's recipe may not be specifically too good for alkaline soils, which are typical of the American Southwest. Before I'd mix up a big batch of any homemade fertilizer recipe, I'd want to consult with some local experts. One thing I do know about typical New Mexico soils is, usually the biggest concern is getting enough phosphorus. YMMV, obviously. EDITED TO ADD: Steve Solomon does mention exactly this on page 3 of the Mother Earth News article. Good for him. Last edited by Petronius_II; February 25, 2012 at 04:46 PM. Reason: obvious

February 28, 2012	#14
dice Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: PNW Posts: 4,743	A scientific test of the contributions coffee grounds can make to a garden soil or container mix: http://www.sunset.com/garden/earth-f...0400000016986/ (Emphasis is on amending soils with it, but the nutrient availability should be the same when mixed into container mix.) __________________ -- alias

July 19, 2011	#2
fortyonenorth Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: NW Indiana Posts: 1,150	I'm not sure of the nutrient make-up of spent coffee grounds, but I know they make an excellent amendment. Are you asking whether they would provide adequate fertility? I don't think that would be enough.

July 19, 2011	#3
oc tony Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: oc ca. Posts: 173	I've done the coffee ground thing. The grounds take nutrients from the soil for about 6 weeks before they start to break down and start feeding the plants, so you should use some fertilizer. Another thing you have to watch out for is winds over 20 to 25 miles an hour as they'll blow the grounds out of the containers. You can add a cup or two of fresh grounds every week or two to the containers after the initial 6 week period with out using any other fertilizer.

July 20, 2011	#5
Alberta Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Mastic, NY Posts: 212	If you put too much coffee grounds on top of the containers, it will mat up and not allow water penetration when you water. I would do as diggingdogfarm suggests, read the issue of Mother Earth News. Now with that said...I do some growing in pots also, large pots, this year mostly for peppers. In all honesty I simply added 1/2 compost to the potting mix I use, and the peppers are doing wonderfully. I have 3 cherry tomatoes in pots also (besides the ones I have in the ground) and they too were mixed with half compost and half potting mix. I use Pro-Mix. Alberta

February 25, 2012	#6
attml Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Annapolis, Maryland Posts: 222	I know I am a little late in this thread but saw it and just wanted to put something out there. Be careful how much in the way of coffee grounds you use because they can stunt plant growth (no joke). There has always been studies about caffeine stunting growth in humans, but apparently caffeine can stunt growth in plants as well. In 8th grade science we were asked to do an experiment on 3 plants using the same seeds in 3 separate containers to test the stunting of growth theory in coffee. Cup A got only water, cup B received lightly caffinated tea and cup C got dark heavily caffeinate coffee. All 3 plants received an equal amout of liquid and a equal amount of light. The result of the experiment was pretty cool and very consistant across the class. The cups with water grew the highest, tea grew second highest and the coffee fed plants came in last every time! There was a very noticable difference between the water plant and the coffee plant! The conclusion: Caffinated coffee stunts plant growth! Just an FYI and if your kids have to do an experiment for science at school for a project and need an idea that is a pretty good one! Mark

February 25, 2012	#9
RayR Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Cheektowaga, NY Posts: 2,468	I agree with fortyonenorth, there are other factors other than caffeine that may skew the experiment. Decaf would be a good option for the test. If I was doing an experiment to to determine if caffeine had any effect on plant growth I would use pure caffeine dissolved in water instead of highly caffeinated coffee. The low PH of the coffee I would expect to be a major limiting factor in growth itself. Regardless of what the solution is, coffee, tea, tap water or whatever, I would want to know the PH of the soil itself before and after. The type of plant is a factor too since some plants are more tolerant of low PH conditions than others.

February 25, 2012	#10
ArcherB Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Austin TX Posts: 200	Another point on the experiment is that caffeine is water soluble and usually leaves the grounds when brewed. From what I understand, there is very little caffeine left in used coffee grounds. Of course, this is just what I've read. I have not done any experimentation on my own. Might be a good one to perform though. Do the same experiment but amend coffee grounds and used tea leaves in the soil and water with... well, water.