Rootstock seed sources for uk member

rafters1 · September 7, 2013

Can anyone guide me in the right direction to source rootstock tomato seeds – here in the UK there are very few suppliers and the cost is unreasonable for just a few seeds.

I am a relatively new member to Tomatoville and have learned so much about tomato growing from other more knowledgeable members. One of the most valuable educations has been the grafting of tomatoes, hence my quest for rootstock tomato seed suppliers.

This summer I tried grafting tomatoes and to my utmost amazement it worked! So thrilled, so grateful to the information donated by members for this method of propagation. I used Ageis rootstock and Grandfather Ashlock, Cherokee Purple, Peron and Marmande scions. Although I was very late in starting this experiment, they are now looking strong and I’m confident that next year, with an earlier start, I shall have a modicum of success.

By the way I used wet folded newspaper to wrap around the join which was then kept in place with a washing line clothes peg! Worked really well.

The aim is to purchase at least 50 rootstock seeds – most grateful if anyone knows of such a supplier. Many thanks. Jill

Doug9345 · September 7, 2013

I think they are expensive everywhere. Johnny's is getting close to 50 cents each for seed in 50 seed lots.
http://www.johnnyseeds.com/search.as...mato+rootstock

If I try grafting I think I'm just going to pick a good robust hybrid and go from there.

Jayc · September 7, 2013

I've previously bought some Aegis F1 from Moles, although it looks like they are sold out of them at the moment but they have Arnold F1 in stock? £13.75 fo 50. http://www.molesseeds.co.uk/flower_a...brid_4283.html

rafters1 · September 7, 2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jayc

I've previously bought some Aegis F1 from Moles, although it looks like they are sold out of them at the moment but they have Arnold F1 in stock? £13.75 fo 50. http://www.molesseeds.co.uk/flower_a...brid_4283.html

Many thanks Jayc - I've not tried Arnold F1 so will investigate their success rate before I purchase and I might also try Aubergine Black Beauty as a rootstock.

Have you tried any other rootstock seeds and if so what success rate did you have? Cheers. Jill

rafters1 · September 7, 2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by Doug9345

I think they are expensive everywhere. Johnny's is getting close to 50 cents each for seed in 50 seed lots.
http://www.johnnyseeds.com/search.as...mato+rootstock

If I try grafting I think I'm just going to pick a good robust hybrid and go from there.

Many thanks for your reply I have looked at their prices and agree they are also somewhat on the expensive side when you add carriage. I might try Aubergine Black Beauty as a rootstock. I'm not too sure of any real robust hybrids here in the UK.

Doug9345 · September 7, 2013

Do you have soil borne diseases? That's the most common reason for grafting.

rafters1 · September 8, 2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by Doug9345

Do you have soil borne diseases? That's the most common reason for grafting.

I have to say that at the present time I have not experienced any tomato diseases, my main interest in grafting is to encourage my heirloom tomatoes to produce healthy fruit from a well produced root system plant.

I think this quote from Barbara Damrosch explains it far more eloquently than I can:-

"The benefits of grafted tomatoes
By Barbara Damrosch,March 06, 2013
What the rootstock variety brings to the partnership is a larger, more vigorous root system that lets the plant take up more water and nutrients. Rootstocks are also developed for their resistance to the many ills that can befall these plants (tomatoes, especially), which are mostly from soil-borne fungi, bacteria and nematodes.
This means that you do not have to use products such as the soil fumigant methyl bromide to keep the plants healthy. And you can grow heirloom varieties — big on flavor but often low on productivity — to your heart’s content. There are also rootstocks that enable plants to withstand extremes of hot and cold, wet and dry — even salty conditions."

My own small experiments with grafting have shown me that it is a very useful tool to have in your arsenal which I intend to roll out for mainly heirloom tomatoes.

Thank you for your interest and I hope my reply is not too wordy! Regards Jill

lubadub · September 8, 2013

Has anyone tried using Maxifort to simply grow tomatoes and then using the seeds from those tomatoes to grow rootstock plants? They would be F2.

rafters1 · September 8, 2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by lubadub

Has anyone tried using Maxifort to simply grow tomatoes and then using the seeds from those tomatoes to grow rootstock plants? They would be F2.

I'm not sure that this works - I seem to remember reading somewhere that it's not possible to allow the rootstock seed develop into a tomato plant, save the seed and then use as a rootstock seed.

If you do find out to the contrary I'd be delighted to know the results.

Doug9345 · September 8, 2013

Your response isn't too long. I've been thinking about doing some grafting myself and I'm trying to figure out what if any advantages it has for me.

I know that in many parts of this country they have soil borne diseases that heirlooms have to resistance to and grafted tomatoes solves that problem. I don't have soil borne diseases so I don't see that gain for the effort.

I've been thinking about doing tomato onto eggplant(aubergine). I have some low wet areas I can't even plow in a dry season and my understanding is that eggplant tolerates wet feet. Other than proving it works, if I'm giving 30 to 50 cents per seed and the only reason I doing it is to plant more tomatoes I might as well go rent an acre of land and use that.

I've also thought to experiment with some of these bigger more rampant heirlooms grafted onto a bush or dwarf root stock. If I could keep their size down so I can keep them covered early in the season there would be an economic benefit. If I have tomatoes for sale before everyone else I can get more for them. I would love to have good tasting, medium-large tomatoes by the first of July in time for the holiday.

What I would love to do is to graft tomato onto nightshade as those things a super tough. What I've read that is that the toxins transfer into the tomato so that is a no go.

rafters1 · September 8, 2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by Doug9345

Your response isn't too long. I've been thinking about doing some grafting myself and I'm trying to figure out what if any advantages it has for me.

I know that in many parts of this country they have soil borne diseases that heirlooms have to resistance to and grafted tomatoes solves that problem. I don't have soil borne diseases so I don't see that gain for the effort.

I've been thinking about doing tomato onto eggplant(aubergine). I have some low wet areas I can't even plow in a dry season and my understanding is that eggplant tolerates wet feet. Other than proving it works, if I'm giving 30 to 50 cents per seed and the only reason I doing it is to plant more tomatoes I might as well go rent an acre of land and use that.

I've also thought to experiment with some of these bigger more rampant heirlooms grafted onto a bush or dwarf root stock. If I could keep thier size down so I can keep them covered early in the season there would be an economic benefit. If I have tomatoes for sale before everyone else I can get more for them. I would love to have good tasting medium largest tomatoes by the first of July in time for the holiday.

What I would love to do is to graft tomato onto nightshade as those things a super tough. What I've read that is that the toxins transfer into the tomato so that is a no go.

My goodness Doug, it seems that you have farming requirements rather than domestic such as myself. I would consider your postion quite differently and perhaps investigate as to whether one of your Universities has done a study on the benefits of various types of rootstock and grafting with the view to early, tasty and abundant tomato crops. Lot of processes involved in greenhouse conditions from seeding the rootstock and scions to eventual potting or planting – would this venture be economically cost effective for you? Did you know that there is such a machine as a grafting robot? The University of Arizona has a magical piece of journalism on this very subject as well as other vegetable grafting. cals.arizona.edu/grafting/grafting-robots.Truly worth a read.

Maxifort, as recommended by JamesL (next post) might be less expensive than most other distributors - $25.50 per 100 but undoubtedly cheaper in bulk.

Had a quick look at growing aubergines, not too sure if they would be that contented with ‘wet feet’, I think the jury is out on that one. I’m going to try this next year by using the aubergine Black Beauty and perhaps find another recommended variety as well.

I’ve no doubt that you are more than up to the task of exploring the viability of your possible rootstock venture and I wish you every success.

Regards Jill

JamesL · September 8, 2013

Jill,
I got Maxifort from Paramount seeds. They have the best price. 25.50 for 100. Don't know if they ship to the UK.
https://www.paramountseeds.com/SeedV...3/Default.aspx
DeRuiter seed in the UK.
http://www.deruiterseeds.com/global/.../Pages/UK.aspx

rafters1 · September 8, 2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by JamesL

Jill,
I got Maxifort from Paramount seeds. They have the best price. 25.50 for 100. Don't know if they ship to the UK.
https://www.paramountseeds.com/SeedV...3/Default.aspx
DeRuiter seed in the UK.
http://www.deruiterseeds.com/global/.../Pages/UK.aspx

James,

Thank you so much for your reply - paramount seeds are definitely an option if they ship to the UK - I'll give them a go tomorrow. Looked at deruiter seeds and went round in circles on their website! I rather think that they only sell directly to distributors and not the general public. Nevertheless, I'll also give them a try. Again, thanks for your input. Regards Jill

JamesL · September 8, 2013

Yes, DeRuiter only sells to distributors. But they should be able to tell you who carries it. Will require an email or phone call though.

zipcode · September 8, 2013

Soil borne diseases aren't quite the only reason for grafting. As you see in most catalogues, the rootstocks are described as being generative or vegetative. So this way they can steer a plant any way you want, depending on your conditions and your variety. Myself I've found that heirlooms could use a little more vegetative, at least in my garden.
Arnold F1 is strongly generative. From what I've read around the forum, seems maxifort is rather vegetative.

September 7, 2013	#1
rafters1 Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Feb 2013 Location: Bexley, Kent, UK Posts: 33	Rootstock seed sources for uk member Can anyone guide me in the right direction to source rootstock tomato seeds – here in the UK there are very few suppliers and the cost is unreasonable for just a few seeds. I am a relatively new member to Tomatoville and have learned so much about tomato growing from other more knowledgeable members. One of the most valuable educations has been the grafting of tomatoes, hence my quest for rootstock tomato seed suppliers. This summer I tried grafting tomatoes and to my utmost amazement it worked! So thrilled, so grateful to the information donated by members for this method of propagation. I used Ageis rootstock and Grandfather Ashlock, Cherokee Purple, Peron and Marmande scions. Although I was very late in starting this experiment, they are now looking strong and I’m confident that next year, with an earlier start, I shall have a modicum of success. By the way I used wet folded newspaper to wrap around the join which was then kept in place with a washing line clothes peg! Worked really well. The aim is to purchase at least 50 rootstock seeds – most grateful if anyone knows of such a supplier. Many thanks. Jill

September 7, 2013	#2
Doug9345 Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Durhamville,NY Posts: 2,706	I think they are expensive everywhere. Johnny's is getting close to 50 cents each for seed in 50 seed lots. http://www.johnnyseeds.com/search.as...mato+rootstock If I try grafting I think I'm just going to pick a good robust hybrid and go from there. Last edited by Doug9345; September 7, 2013 at 12:26 PM.

September 8, 2013	#8
lubadub Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: PA Posts: 169	Has anyone tried using Maxifort to simply grow tomatoes and then using the seeds from those tomatoes to grow rootstock plants? They would be F2. __________________ Bigger is Better!

September 8, 2013	#10
Doug9345 Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Durhamville,NY Posts: 2,706	Your response isn't too long. I've been thinking about doing some grafting myself and I'm trying to figure out what if any advantages it has for me. I know that in many parts of this country they have soil borne diseases that heirlooms have to resistance to and grafted tomatoes solves that problem. I don't have soil borne diseases so I don't see that gain for the effort. I've been thinking about doing tomato onto eggplant(aubergine). I have some low wet areas I can't even plow in a dry season and my understanding is that eggplant tolerates wet feet. Other than proving it works, if I'm giving 30 to 50 cents per seed and the only reason I doing it is to plant more tomatoes I might as well go rent an acre of land and use that. I've also thought to experiment with some of these bigger more rampant heirlooms grafted onto a bush or dwarf root stock. If I could keep their size down so I can keep them covered early in the season there would be an economic benefit. If I have tomatoes for sale before everyone else I can get more for them. I would love to have good tasting, medium-large tomatoes by the first of July in time for the holiday. What I would love to do is to graft tomato onto nightshade as those things a super tough. What I've read that is that the toxins transfer into the tomato so that is a no go. Last edited by Doug9345; September 8, 2013 at 06:24 PM.

September 7, 2013	#3
Jayc Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: UK Posts: 319	I've previously bought some Aegis F1 from Moles, although it looks like they are sold out of them at the moment but they have Arnold F1 in stock? £13.75 fo 50. http://www.molesseeds.co.uk/flower_a...brid_4283.html

September 8, 2013	#12
JamesL Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: Long Island NY Posts: 1,992	Jill, I got Maxifort from Paramount seeds. They have the best price. 25.50 for 100. Don't know if they ship to the UK. https://www.paramountseeds.com/SeedV...3/Default.aspx DeRuiter seed in the UK. http://www.deruiterseeds.com/global/.../Pages/UK.aspx

September 8, 2013	#15
zipcode Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Romania/Germany , z 4-6 Posts: 1,582	Soil borne diseases aren't quite the only reason for grafting. As you see in most catalogues, the rootstocks are described as being generative or vegetative. So this way they can steer a plant any way you want, depending on your conditions and your variety. Myself I've found that heirlooms could use a little more vegetative, at least in my garden. Arnold F1 is strongly generative. From what I've read around the forum, seems maxifort is rather vegetative.