Watery stem end rot

[ginger2778]

Its been rainy, i think this is caused by fungus or bacteria, should I spray with something, such as b54red's bleach soulution? I have lost several to this, and I am not getting much of a harvest except cherries.
Please help if you can.
Marsha

[carolyn137]

Originally Posted by ginger2778

Its been rainy, i think this is caused by fungus or bacteria, should I spray with something, such as b54red's bleach soulution? I have lost several to this, and I am not getting much of a harvest except cherries.
Please help if you can.
Marsha

Marsha, when I look at the picture I don't see rot at all, I see healed over scar tissue which is probably due to a bit of catfacing.

https://www.google.com/search?q=toma...w=1474&bih=523

Look at the second row, the two vertical rows of green fruits with catfacing at the stem end, and several other pictures showing the same.

The fruits are not lost at all, and will ripen up fine, but usually the fruits are irregular. Catfacing is most often seen with large beefsteak fruits like you showed as well as the ones shown in the Google picture gallery.

Carolyn

[ginger2778]

Thanks Carolyn, if you look down from the healed over scar tissue, you can see the watery spot. It was tiny yesterday. I did some more research at FSU.edu and it is bacterial soft rot, the fruits rot very quickly once it starts. Its caused by several species of Erwinia, Pseudomonas, and a Clostridium species. It is very common in Florida, especially when fruit are kept wet for a time. It can happen from healthy fruit to these wet soft smelly areas in as little as 18 hours.
Here's a good link. http://plantpath.ifas.ufl.edu/extens...dfs/pp0012.pdf
Has pictures of what I see when I cut one open.

Marsha

[ginger2778]

Thank you Karen. It has been dry the last few days, but it is still mid 80s and kinda humid. The relish is a great idea. I was getting so frustrated that I would pick them and just throw them! I am glad you see it too!

Marsha
PS-I am going to mix up b54red's bleach and spray it on them, after all, what have I got to lose? He does a cup to a gallon for 5% bleach, so i'll have to calculate it for the more concentrated one.

[carolyn137]

Originally Posted by ginger2778

Thanks Carolyn, if you look down from the healed over scar tissue, you can see the watery spot. It was tiny yesterday. I did some more research at FSU.edu and it is bacterial soft rot, the fruits rot very quickly once it starts. Its caused by several species of Erwinia, Pseudomonas, and a Clostridium species. It is very common in Florida, especially when fruit are kept wet for a time. It can happen from healthy fruit to these wet soft smelly areas in as little as 18 hours.
Here's a good link. http://plantpath.ifas.ufl.edu/extens...dfs/pp0012.pdf
Has pictures of what I see when I cut one open.

Marsha

I do see it now, but just as your link says, it can be caused by many different bacterial genera and species, so I wouldn 't say it's due to only Erwinia.

My tomato pathology book lists many genera and species

Those tomato varieties that normally have either radial or concentric splitting around the stem end also can be infected, and with any bacteria in the environment and that does initiate a rotting process. Normally those cracks scar over, but with too much rain or irrigation they can resplit.

I'm not sure why you would use bleach, which some find helpful for foliage diseases, b'c not all bacteria are killed by bleach, says the Microbiologist in me, and even if they were, there would still be that split that could be infected again IMO.

Carolyn

[KarenO]

I see the rotting spots you mean at the ends of the cracks. The cracks themselves are not the trouble as they are usually mainly cosmetic however it seems as though in your wet weather they have been the means by which organisms, bacterial and/or fungal have entered your fruit and have caused those wet looking soft spots of rot. Such fruits are not going to ripen but will continue to deteriorate. I would pick them to avoid spread and if you have a use for them they are not too far gone to use as green tomatoes in relish or chutney if you just cut off the soft spots, otherwise into the compost and hope for dryer weather. I don't think spraying will help, think the answer is dry weather which I hope for you comes soon.
KarenO

[RayR]

The bacteria would be inside the tomato infecting the soft tissue. Bleach wouldn't be of any use as a topical spray.
I personally don't like bleach flavored tomatoes either.

[ginger2778]

Now now Ray. I think the ones where the bacteria already got inside are too far gone. I was planning to kill those bacteria on the surface of still healthy tomatoes, since I am losing many to this. The dilution is 5 oz of the bleach to a whole gallon of water, not straight bleach, give me some credit guys!
And they can be washed to get the taste off, especially since there will hopefully be quite a few days of growing time after I spray, with wind and rain " cleansing"them
Before I pick them and wash them.
I know of several who spray copper fungicides and daconil, and I am sure you wouldn't like those flavors either, Ray.
My point being tomatoes are often sprayed with many things, but in the proper mix ratios, so in the end, maybe, just maybe, we can get a crop!

Carolyn, if you read my previous post, you will see that I even mentioned more than Erwinia, so your book agrees with that. That sounds like a book worth having. Please, what is it's title?

Marsha

[carolyn137]

Originally Posted by ginger2778

Now now Ray. I think the ones where the bacteria already got inside are too far gone. I was planning to kill those bacteria on the surface of still healthy tomatoes, since I am losing many to this. The dilution is 5 oz of the bleach to a whole gallon of water, not straight bleach, give me some credit guys!
And they can be washed to get the taste off, especially since there will hopefully be quite a few days of growing time after I spray, with wind and rain " cleansing"them
Before I pick them and wash them.
I know of several who spray copper fungicides and daconil, and I am sure you wouldn't like those flavors either, Ray.
My point being tomatoes are often sprayed with many things, but in the proper mix ratios, so in the end, maybe, just maybe, we can get a crop!

Carolyn, if you read my previous post, you will see that I even mentioned more than Erwinia, so your book agrees with that. That sounds like a book worth having. Please, what is it's title?

Marsha

Marsha, if you look again at what I wrote I said that there were many genera and species that were listed in the LINK that YOU gave, notjustErwinia and then went on to say that there are many listed in my tomato pathology book, and perhaps I should have said as well.

Bacterial Fruit Rot due toErwinia is only one of the many bacteria AND fungi that can cause soft rot of fruits, and in my tomato pathology monograph they are all listed as being non-infectious since there has to be a break in the fruit epidermis before they can initiate infection. And none of them are considered infectious b'c it's just normal flora found in the air that can do that when referring to fruit rots.

THe Monograph that I have about tomato disases and conditions was published in 1997 by Seminis Seeds and one of the componies that Seminis bought in that purchase is Petoseed, which has a world class disease lab and the many links you see for this or that disease at State sites are pictures and descriptions from that monograph.It's no longer being published and the last person to have copies to sell was Linda Sapp at Tomato grower supply in Fort Myers,Fl.

But now out of print.

So, I'll just repeat what I said above, and that's while bleach has been known to help with some FOLIAGE diseases by some, and some folks bleach treat their dried produced seeds, there are no reports known for the efficacy of bleach seed treatment that I know of, and nor for the elimination of surface bacteria and fungi from fruit surfaces.

The monograph goes on to say that prevention of fruit rots can depend on:

Not planting plants too close to allow for air circulation
Paying attention to irrigation amounts (no way to predict rain r humidity levels,CJM) and using fungicides since for home gardeners, as opposed to commercial growers with licenses, CJM, there are no effective bactericidal sprays.

Carolyn

[ginger2778]

I think I misinterpreted what you meant to say about the Erwinia in the early post, I am sorry.
I am experimenting to see if there is efficacy. The smooth fruits with no break are all doing fine, so not spraying those except with the routine things. The ones with the scars and cracks are getting the trial, because they have no where to go but up, so I'm not really losing anything. In school, NaClO was a great disinfectant, and a sterilant of many microbes after 10 minutes.(But not those with spores)
I think my spacing is fine, but I admit the foliage is getting a little dense. I need to prune. I wish it would stop the almost daily raining!

I will try to report back to tell if things improved, how the taste was, etc.

Thanks for your help.

Marsha