Is this damping off?

[elight]

A tale of two sets of seedlings. Both started in the same tray, same soilless mix, etc. When potting up, some stayed in the tray and others were moved to a tub with higher sides. The ones in the tray look great whole the ones in the tub look like death. Only difference I see is that the tub has higher sides - maybe an air circulation issue?

I just moved the seedlings from the tub to a lower-walled pan but you can see both in the photo. Any thoughts greatly appreciated.



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[KarenO]

Were they sitting in water in the higher sided pan?

KarenO

[MissS]

KarenO poises a good question. Was the higher sided pan cleaned well prior to using it?

[AlittleSalt]

elight, by seeing the water/mix line in the container I think you and I made the same mistake. http://www.tomatoville.com/showthread.php?t=44010 Overwatering is the issue.

[elight]

Both were watered about the same... Maybe 1/4-1/2" when they dry out. Was that too much?

Good question about cleaning the tub. I always clean with bleach after use each season, but then they sit in my garage so I suppose it could have picked something up.

Think these are worth saving? Too late to re-seed here in zone 9b.

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[ddsack]

I'm sure it's the higher sides.

I had a similar thing happened when I once ran out of low trays and had to move a large batch of 3"-4" tall seedlings into a tub that was about 2" higher than the top of the cups. No plants died, but the stems stayed flimsy and lower leaves were dying. To look at them from the top, the top leaves looked fine, but I could see the damage when I went to unload them from the tub. Lack of air circulation, stagnant air, less light must be the problem.

If they are still alive, I would re-pot them up deep and they should survive.

[brownrexx]

With damping off you should see the stems shriveled and constricted at the soil line. This is where the fungus attacks the stem.

[Ricky Shaw]

Is higher sides the difference or possibly the 1020's have ridged bottoms and those cups drained better than the cups in the flat bottom tub?

[KarenO]

judging from the waterline visible they were sitting in water. It is a mistake lots of folks make. Many people are told that they must water from the bottom which isn't strictly true at all, The advice I give is not to wet the foliage but it's easy to water tomatoes in individual cups without wetting the foliage even when watered from the top. The trouble is, folks place cups or pots into a basin or other pan with no drainage and then pour water into the basin to water their seedlings. This would be OK if, after the seedlings have had a chance to absorb their max of water that the basin was emptied. Unfortunately, folks sometimes leave the seedlings sitting in even a 1/4 inch of water in the bottom of the basin and this results in waterlogged roots, lack of air to the roots and the resulting inability of the roots to properly absorb nutrients and can result in leaf edema and root rot.
Seedling cups must never be allowed to remain sitting in even a little bit of water. They "drown"
good drainage is very important
KarenO

[elight]

Thank you Karen for the insight. How much time would you say is required for the seedlings to soak up the water before emptying? Top-watering sounds like a chore.

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[KarenO]

10 minutes?
Depends on your medium. The goal is always moist but not wet. You can imagine a fresh piece of cake. It is very moist but you could not squeeze a drop of water out of it right?
Your soil should be like that. Moist but not so you could wring water out of it.
Watering is something I enjoy. I use the opportunity to inspect everything frequently and admire the "babies"

KarenO

[elight]

With a real baby in the house now, it's harder and harder to find time for the tomato babies. =)

Thank you for the advice. Taking down the fall plants this weekend and putting out the spring plants the following week! Wish I had known the weather we've had this winter - would have overwintered some instead!

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[carolyn137]

Originally Posted by brownrexx

With damping off you should see the stems shriveled and constricted at the soil line. This is where the fungus attacks the stem.

Correct.

And it's good to know that damping off doesn't happen just with small new seedlings. I have a monograph of tomato diseases from Petoseed that shows very clearly that planst from 4 to 6 inches tall can still get that constricted lesion at the soil level.

Carolyn

[KarenO]

Originally Posted by elight

With a real baby in the house now, it's harder and harder to find time for the tomato babies. =)

Thank you for the advice. Taking down the fall plants this weekend and putting out the spring plants the following week! Wish I had known the weather we've had this winter - would have overwintered some instead!

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You're welcome enjoy your baby and then your tomatoes. When you are my age you will have endless time for tomatoes. Babies are more important.
Best wishes!
KarenO