My fall/winter indoor garden - Page 2

luigiwu · November 4, 2015

Quote:

Originally Posted by OmahaJB

Funny you mention that. I was so happy to find Home Depot having their Garden Center still open that I just picked up the Miracle Gro I found on sale not paying much attention if it was potting soil or just garden soil as I normally do. Some was potting soil, some garden soil. The garden soil looked very rich and said it feeds for three months, but I know it needs a little perlite or vermiculite added and fortunately I've had some perlite sitting in my closet for a couple of years that I'm able to use now.

Will see how it all works out. I do have the 15-30-15 to use a little later. I added some in the bottom third of the 5-gallon buckets so when the roots reach that far it'll help, plus I'll add some to the top few inches of soil once they are ready to flower.

Soooo its still not clear to me if your bags says MIX or SOIL? They don't sell a "potting soil" product do they? Garden soil is denser. For container gardening you want MIX as it is soil-less and is a peat-based product.

Antipodean · November 5, 2015

[QUOTE=OmahaJB;511317]While picking up bags of soil at Home Depot I bought 15-30-15 time release fertilizer to use once it's time for flowers to develop. Would appreciate thoughts on whether that's a good combination for tomato and pepper plants, although I do know the second number needs to be higher for fruiting, just not sure if the first and last being 15 each will be too high for some reason.

Hiya Omaha, the 'phosphorous is for fruiting' thing that gets thrown about is greatly exaggerated. Sure its required, however tomatoes only require a small constant amount during its life cycle.....its not a case of more P will give you more fruits. Similar trace quantities of magnesium and calcium are required.

On the other hand, tomatoes require at least 3-5 times as much nitrogen (than P) and even more potassium (K), and they require it in greater quantities after fruit setting.

So i'd go for N being higher than P, with K being higher still......i use 5-1-7 with trace elements (calcium of 1, magnesium .5).

Good luck with your adventure!!

OmahaJB · November 5, 2015

Quote:

Originally Posted by luigiwu

Soooo its still not clear to me if your bags says MIX or SOIL? They don't sell a "potting soil" product do they? Garden soil is denser. For container gardening you want MIX as it is soil-less and is a peat-based product.

I have both potting soil and mix. Out of the original 5 bags I purchased 2 or 3 were Miracle-Gro garden soil purchased by mistake. Wanted the potting mix but was in a hurry that day. Sunday I was at Home Depot again and picked up 2 more bags, this time Vigoro potting mix,

The garden soil isn't ideal for containers obviously, but will do the best I can with it. Perlite being added along with some time release fertilizer should help.

OmahaJB · November 5, 2015

[QUOTE=Antipodean;512164]

Quote:

Originally Posted by OmahaJB

While picking up bags of soil at Home Depot I bought 15-30-15 time release fertilizer to use once it's time for flowers to develop. Would appreciate thoughts on whether that's a good combination for tomato and pepper plants, although I do know the second number needs to be higher for fruiting, just not sure if the first and last being 15 each will be too high for some reason.

Hiya Omaha, the 'phosphorous is for fruiting' thing that gets thrown about is greatly exaggerated. Sure its required, however tomatoes only require a small constant amount during its life cycle.....its not a case of more P will give you more fruits. Similar trace quantities of magnesium and calcium are required.

On the other hand, tomatoes require at least 3-5 times as much nitrogen (than P) and even more potassium (K), and they require it in greater quantities after fruit setting.

So i'd go for N being higher than P, with K being higher still......i use 5-1-7 with trace elements (calcium of 1, magnesium .5).

Good luck with your adventure!!

Thank you for the info. Guess what I purchased is way over doing it, and not a good balance between N, P, and K. Will see how it works.

OmahaJB · November 5, 2015

Garden pics:

IndoorGarden3.jpg

IndoorGarden5.jpg

The first one is from last Friday I believe. Second one from this evening. Kellogg's Breakfast is in a 10" pot and will soon be switched over to a 5-gallon bucket. It was the first one I transplanted and was worried about having enough soil so made the mistake in using a pot that was way too small. Even a 5-gallon bucket isn't really big enough.

Front two are New Big Dwarf and Aunt Ruby's German Green. Yesterday I had to replace the New Big Dwarf with another NBD seedling because the first one wasn't taking off at all.

Second row: Italian Heirloom, Rosella Purple, Kellogg's Breakfast, and Rosella Purple.

Back row: German Pink, Elephant's Ear (pepper plant), New Big Dwarf, and Rosella Purple.

Rosella Purple in the back on the right isn't doing well, but it might be location under the light.

In the 2nd pic you can see they are thirsty so I better get to it, then transplant Kellogg's Breakfast.

Tormato · November 6, 2015

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gerardo

Awesome. Good one. The worms seem to like the Chargers too.

Cry me a River(s).

OmahaJB · November 8, 2015

New additions just transplanted and set in the grow room, or grow closet really.

IndoorGarden6.jpg

IndoorGarden7.jpg

In the first pic you can see Kellogg's Breakfast was transplanted into a 5-gallon orange bucket. And the new additions are all on the left, first two are Dwarf Arctic Rose, then Italian Heirloom (my 2nd IH plant), and Riesentraube is in the back. The Italian Heirloom that had been in the front on the left is now in the back row in the middle. Also, I mentioned this before but the New Big Dwarf that was in the front that was doing poorly was replaced by a different NBD seedling I had on standby.

Second pic is just a closer view of some of the plants that have been in there for a week and a half.

The leaves are not that light in color, the grow light is on making them appear lighter than they really are in the pics.

jillian · November 8, 2015

Looking good! Excited to grow a few of those varieties next season.

OmahaJB · November 8, 2015

Thanks Jillian. They are growing like weeds under my grow light. Now, whether they will grow tomatoes or not may be another thing. Like previous attempts at growing indoors its an experiment that will hopefully go much, much better this time.

Only tomato variety I'm growing now that I've tasted before is Kellogg's Breakfast, so looking forward to the others. Some varieties like Italian Heirloom and German Pink just aren't mentioned often so I want to taste them to see if they deserve more recognition. Those two are always in Seed Savers Exchange catalog, German Pink because it was one of their first two varieties, and Italian Heirloom I believe because they found it so productive. I'll also be very interested to taste Aunt Ruby's German Green and Reisentraube. And of course the dwarves! I think I just named about every variety I'm growing.

And the Elephant's Ear sweet pepper is a good productive variety that's great to have again in my indoor garden.

OmahaJB · November 13, 2015

A couple of new pics taken today to show new additions of a 2nd Riesentraube in a 10" pot (whatever I can get from it will be a plus); and Chervena Chushka (pepper). They are on the extreme left towards the back. I also had to switch out one of the Dwarf Arctic Rose plants with a seedling of the same I had waiting in the wings (front left). Used a 300-watt PS bulb in a brooder lamp for additional lighting from the side and it got just a little too warm. It would have recovered but I had a better seedling to replace it with.

The second pic is a close up of Kellogg's Breakfast with blossoms forming already. Will have to pick those off since its too soon. They may be a little hard to make out.

OmahaJB · November 20, 2015

No pics this afternoon, just reporting I have flower buds on two Rosella Purple dwarf plants, New Big Dwarf, German Pink, Italian Heirloom, Aunt Ruby's German Green, and I believe I saw some new ones starting on Kellogg's Breakfast.

Mad at myself now for taking the initial four flowers off of Kellogg's Breakfast since the plant was still small. The timing would have been nearly perfect to cross it with Rosella Purple, as one of the Rosella Purple flowers is about to open. The way the flower looks it would be perfect to manipulate to remove the pollen sacks and expose the stigma right now. Maybe I'll post a pic of it.

Due to timing of the when the flowers are opening I may end up needing to use pollen from a dwarf to give to one of the indeterminates. Not ideal, but better than not getting a cross. Always the possibility of new flowers later that will allow for the dwarves to be the moms.

OmahaJB · November 20, 2015

The flower bud's kind of hard to make out but it's in the middle of the pic at the top of the plant. (Changed over to the HPS bulb today and its on, so the funny color of the plants is just the light shining down on them.)

OmahaJB · November 24, 2015

Getting good plant growth and quite a few blossoms, which I can thank my grow light and 15-30-15 time release fertilizer for. Blossoms I was able to count today: Aunt Ruby's German Green - 12; Italian Heirloom - 15; German Pink - 11; Kellogg's Breakfast - 10 (plus the initial 4 I pinched off); Rosella Purple (#1 plant) - 11; Rosella Purple (#2 plant) - 7 (includes a very large top flower); New Big Dwarf - 12; Elephant's Ear sweet pepper - 10. Some of these flower buds are very small as they are just starting out. Have several plants that have no flowers yet because they were transplanted later, or took awhile to start growing.

I've noticed Riesentraube is a slow grower, at least here in my indoor garden.

Today I made my first attempt at crossing, Rosella Purple x German Pink. Doubt it was successful, as I was unable to get much pollen out of the German Pink flower. Ended up pinching it off the plant so I could sit down and work on slicing the pollen sacks open. Didn't help much. Either I needed to wait just a little bit longer, or I'm still going to have a problem getting pollen from flowers in this apartment, as I have in the past. This apartment does have a problem with humidity but not normally this time of year, so the problem may lay somewhere else. I ended up using a knife to scrape the few grains of pollen off the tiny mirror I was using, and gently rubbed the pollen on the stigma with the side of the knife. We'll see, but not getting my hopes up on this one.

Plant growth from November 10th to November 24tth (height x width):

ARGG 6" x 11 1/2" / 20" x 24"
Italian Heirloom (plant #1) 8" x 12" / 23" x 25"
Italian Heirloom (plant #2) 5" x 9 3/4" / 7" x 10 1/2"
German Pink 9" x 1' / 22 1/2" x 27"
Riesentraube (plant #1) 1" x 4 1/2" / 3 1/4" x 8"
Riesentraube (plant #2) seedling / 1 3/4" x 4 1/4"
Kellogg's Breakfast 7" x 11" / 20" x 21"
Rosella Purple (plant #1) 4" x 10" / 9" x 17"
Rosella Purple (plant #2) 4 1/2" x 9 1/2" / 9" x 16 1/2"
Rosella Purple (plant #3) 2 1/2" x 4 1/2" / 4" x 7 1/2"
Dwarf Arctic Rose (plant #1) 1 1/4" x 2 1/2" / 5' x 7 1/2"
Dwarf Arctic Rose (plant #2) 3rd seedling transplanted in this pot /4" x 4 1/2"
New Big Dwarf (plant #1) 7" x 9 1/2" / 14" x 15"
New Big Dwarf (plant #2) 2 3/4" x 3 1/2" / 7" x 9"
Elephant's Ear (pepper) 6" x 8" / 9" x 11 1/2"
Chervena Chushka (pepper) seedling / 3 3/4" x 6 1/4"

Will post a pic to show off some of the blossoms on German Pink in my next post. The flower I pinched off was already taken off by the time I took the pic.

Edit: Or maybe not. Getting the message my pic is too large again. Maybe another day.....

OmahaJB · November 24, 2015

German Pink flower buds. (Think this will work now.)

OmahaJB · December 1, 2015

Quick update: Have a couple of tomatoes starting to grow. Aunt Ruby's German Green and Italian Heirloom for sure, and believe Kellogg's Breakfast and German Pink are as well but hard to tell for sure. Still lots of blooms. Will have to make sure to buy that fertilizer again, although I know the lighting system is key as well.

Attempted several crosses, but don't believe any took. I transferred pollen from the indeterminates at least twice a day for two or three days for each of the dwarf flowers that were emasculated. No dice. Little hope left for those, but maybe one or two will surprise me and start setting.

Believe its a problem with the pollen just being a little too humid. Had no trouble getting some out each time, but to get the stigma to pick it up I had to take a knife and scrape it into a pile. While doing that I believe the pollen may have been clumping enough the stigma couldn't process it. Will try again when the timing is right, except I'll emasculate the indeterminates and take pollen from the dwarves. Maybe the larger, longer stigmas will have an easier time with the pollen. Will also be using my dehumidifier longer each day than I have been.

Definitely don't want to emasculate any more Rosella Purple flowers as I want to taste some of the tomatoes that people rave about. Have already wasted 5 or 6 potential tomatoes.

One thing I learned was that the electric toothbrush method doesn't work very well for me. I found flicking the back of the flower works best. Tapping got some pollen out, but flicking worked better.

As I imagined, and I'm sure as everyone else imagined when they saw my initial pics, its a small space for that many plants, and they don't like it much. I'm making it work though. Biggest problem, and I did think about this in the beginning is that as I raise the grow light higher and higher for the indeterminates the light is too high for the dwarves and pepper plants. So having the brooder lamp with the 300-watt bulb helps with the shorter plants, its just not the right color spectrum for flowering.

Mmmm-mmmm, thinking about the Aunt Ruby's German Green I'll be having in a month or so. And the others of course. ARGG though sounds like a dynamite variety. I may end up using the plant as my Charlie Brown Christmas tree though. Broken branch and everything. Only difference is the presents will be in the tree itself.

November 5, 2015	#17
Antipodean Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Oct 2014 Location: Perth Posts: 46	[QUOTE=OmahaJB;511317]While picking up bags of soil at Home Depot I bought 15-30-15 time release fertilizer to use once it's time for flowers to develop. Would appreciate thoughts on whether that's a good combination for tomato and pepper plants, although I do know the second number needs to be higher for fruiting, just not sure if the first and last being 15 each will be too high for some reason. Hiya Omaha, the 'phosphorous is for fruiting' thing that gets thrown about is greatly exaggerated. Sure its required, however tomatoes only require a small constant amount during its life cycle.....its not a case of more P will give you more fruits. Similar trace quantities of magnesium and calcium are required. On the other hand, tomatoes require at least 3-5 times as much nitrogen (than P) and even more potassium (K), and they require it in greater quantities after fruit setting. So i'd go for N being higher than P, with K being higher still......i use 5-1-7 with trace elements (calcium of 1, magnesium .5). Good luck with your adventure!! Last edited by Antipodean; November 5, 2015 at 07:30 AM.

November 5, 2015	#20
OmahaJB Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Toledo, OH Posts: 1,821	Garden pics: IndoorGarden3.jpg IndoorGarden5.jpg The first one is from last Friday I believe. Second one from this evening. Kellogg's Breakfast is in a 10" pot and will soon be switched over to a 5-gallon bucket. It was the first one I transplanted and was worried about having enough soil so made the mistake in using a pot that was way too small. Even a 5-gallon bucket isn't really big enough. Front two are New Big Dwarf and Aunt Ruby's German Green. Yesterday I had to replace the New Big Dwarf with another NBD seedling because the first one wasn't taking off at all. Second row: Italian Heirloom, Rosella Purple, Kellogg's Breakfast, and Rosella Purple. Back row: German Pink, Elephant's Ear (pepper plant), New Big Dwarf, and Rosella Purple. Rosella Purple in the back on the right isn't doing well, but it might be location under the light. In the 2nd pic you can see they are thirsty so I better get to it, then transplant Kellogg's Breakfast. Last edited by OmahaJB; November 5, 2015 at 09:13 PM.

November 20, 2015	#26
OmahaJB Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Toledo, OH Posts: 1,821	No pics this afternoon, just reporting I have flower buds on two Rosella Purple dwarf plants, New Big Dwarf, German Pink, Italian Heirloom, Aunt Ruby's German Green, and I believe I saw some new ones starting on Kellogg's Breakfast. Mad at myself now for taking the initial four flowers off of Kellogg's Breakfast since the plant was still small. The timing would have been nearly perfect to cross it with Rosella Purple, as one of the Rosella Purple flowers is about to open. The way the flower looks it would be perfect to manipulate to remove the pollen sacks and expose the stigma right now. Maybe I'll post a pic of it. Due to timing of the when the flowers are opening I may end up needing to use pollen from a dwarf to give to one of the indeterminates. Not ideal, but better than not getting a cross. Always the possibility of new flowers later that will allow for the dwarves to be the moms. Last edited by OmahaJB; November 20, 2015 at 09:47 PM.

November 24, 2015	#28
OmahaJB Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Toledo, OH Posts: 1,821	Getting good plant growth and quite a few blossoms, which I can thank my grow light and 15-30-15 time release fertilizer for. Blossoms I was able to count today: Aunt Ruby's German Green - 12; Italian Heirloom - 15; German Pink - 11; Kellogg's Breakfast - 10 (plus the initial 4 I pinched off); Rosella Purple (#1 plant) - 11; Rosella Purple (#2 plant) - 7 (includes a very large top flower); New Big Dwarf - 12; Elephant's Ear sweet pepper - 10. Some of these flower buds are very small as they are just starting out. Have several plants that have no flowers yet because they were transplanted later, or took awhile to start growing. I've noticed Riesentraube is a slow grower, at least here in my indoor garden. Today I made my first attempt at crossing, Rosella Purple x German Pink. Doubt it was successful, as I was unable to get much pollen out of the German Pink flower. Ended up pinching it off the plant so I could sit down and work on slicing the pollen sacks open. Didn't help much. Either I needed to wait just a little bit longer, or I'm still going to have a problem getting pollen from flowers in this apartment, as I have in the past. This apartment does have a problem with humidity but not normally this time of year, so the problem may lay somewhere else. I ended up using a knife to scrape the few grains of pollen off the tiny mirror I was using, and gently rubbed the pollen on the stigma with the side of the knife. We'll see, but not getting my hopes up on this one. Plant growth from November 10th to November 24tth (height x width): ARGG 6" x 11 1/2" / 20" x 24" Italian Heirloom (plant #1) 8" x 12" / 23" x 25" Italian Heirloom (plant #2) 5" x 9 3/4" / 7" x 10 1/2" German Pink 9" x 1' / 22 1/2" x 27" Riesentraube (plant #1) 1" x 4 1/2" / 3 1/4" x 8" Riesentraube (plant #2) seedling / 1 3/4" x 4 1/4" Kellogg's Breakfast 7" x 11" / 20" x 21" Rosella Purple (plant #1) 4" x 10" / 9" x 17" Rosella Purple (plant #2) 4 1/2" x 9 1/2" / 9" x 16 1/2" Rosella Purple (plant #3) 2 1/2" x 4 1/2" / 4" x 7 1/2" Dwarf Arctic Rose (plant #1) 1 1/4" x 2 1/2" / 5' x 7 1/2" Dwarf Arctic Rose (plant #2) 3rd seedling transplanted in this pot /4" x 4 1/2" New Big Dwarf (plant #1) 7" x 9 1/2" / 14" x 15" New Big Dwarf (plant #2) 2 3/4" x 3 1/2" / 7" x 9" Elephant's Ear (pepper) 6" x 8" / 9" x 11 1/2" Chervena Chushka (pepper) seedling / 3 3/4" x 6 1/4" Will post a pic to show off some of the blossoms on German Pink in my next post. The flower I pinched off was already taken off by the time I took the pic. Edit: Or maybe not. Getting the message my pic is too large again. Maybe another day..... Last edited by OmahaJB; November 24, 2015 at 06:22 PM.

November 8, 2015	#22
OmahaJB Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Toledo, OH Posts: 1,821	New additions just transplanted and set in the grow room, or grow closet really. IndoorGarden6.jpg IndoorGarden7.jpg In the first pic you can see Kellogg's Breakfast was transplanted into a 5-gallon orange bucket. And the new additions are all on the left, first two are Dwarf Arctic Rose, then Italian Heirloom (my 2nd IH plant), and Riesentraube is in the back. The Italian Heirloom that had been in the front on the left is now in the back row in the middle. Also, I mentioned this before but the New Big Dwarf that was in the front that was doing poorly was replaced by a different NBD seedling I had on standby. Second pic is just a closer view of some of the plants that have been in there for a week and a half. The leaves are not that light in color, the grow light is on making them appear lighter than they really are in the pics.

November 8, 2015	#23
jillian Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jul 2015 Location: North Carolina Posts: 880	Looking good! Excited to grow a few of those varieties next season.

December 1, 2015	#30
OmahaJB Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Toledo, OH Posts: 1,821	Quick update: Have a couple of tomatoes starting to grow. Aunt Ruby's German Green and Italian Heirloom for sure, and believe Kellogg's Breakfast and German Pink are as well but hard to tell for sure. Still lots of blooms. Will have to make sure to buy that fertilizer again, although I know the lighting system is key as well. Attempted several crosses, but don't believe any took. I transferred pollen from the indeterminates at least twice a day for two or three days for each of the dwarf flowers that were emasculated. No dice. Little hope left for those, but maybe one or two will surprise me and start setting. Believe its a problem with the pollen just being a little too humid. Had no trouble getting some out each time, but to get the stigma to pick it up I had to take a knife and scrape it into a pile. While doing that I believe the pollen may have been clumping enough the stigma couldn't process it. Will try again when the timing is right, except I'll emasculate the indeterminates and take pollen from the dwarves. Maybe the larger, longer stigmas will have an easier time with the pollen. Will also be using my dehumidifier longer each day than I have been. Definitely don't want to emasculate any more Rosella Purple flowers as I want to taste some of the tomatoes that people rave about. Have already wasted 5 or 6 potential tomatoes. One thing I learned was that the electric toothbrush method doesn't work very well for me. I found flicking the back of the flower works best. Tapping got some pollen out, but flicking worked better. As I imagined, and I'm sure as everyone else imagined when they saw my initial pics, its a small space for that many plants, and they don't like it much. I'm making it work though. Biggest problem, and I did think about this in the beginning is that as I raise the grow light higher and higher for the indeterminates the light is too high for the dwarves and pepper plants. So having the brooder lamp with the 300-watt bulb helps with the shorter plants, its just not the right color spectrum for flowering. Mmmm-mmmm, thinking about the Aunt Ruby's German Green I'll be having in a month or so. And the others of course. ARGG though sounds like a dynamite variety. I may end up using the plant as my Charlie Brown Christmas tree though. Broken branch and everything. Only difference is the presents will be in the tree itself.