Surfactant (Spreader/Stickers)

[amideutch]

We have talked about these before and there are all types on the market including good old fashioned Dish Soap which are added to our foliar sprays to help them stay on the plant rather than running off. I was corresponding with a poster at GW who told me about a product made by the company Method and the product is "Go Naked" dish washing liquid. It is organic, derived from seaweed and only a couple drops are needed for a gallon of solution as it is concentrated. It is available at Target stores and other locations. It is also excellent for cleaning dishes and windows as well. Here's a link. Ami

http://www.housekeepingchannel.com/t...aked_Dish_Soap

[brog]

Hi Ted Is it bettert than Molasses? Bill

[mensplace]

Originally Posted by brog

Hi Ted Is it bettert than Molasses? Bill

Molasses, while sticky, will not help either with dormant oil dispersion or in helping to allow the various fungicides and pesticides to "cut through" the natural oils that are on plant leaves to allow for better penetration and coating. Too, wouldn't it help to feed the negative life forms as well as the positive ones? A simple question, not a negation. I have used a tablespoon of natural dish soap for many years and it keeps the dormant oil sprays from simply sittling on the top of the sprayer solution. Have thought about using my sprayer for the various EM (Bokashi) solutions that I have left over as well as the blends of other micro-organisms I have left over on my fruit tree and veggies, but am leery of spraying anything in the air withoug knowing exactly what to expect, and the thought of inhaling a broad range of micro-organisms is also a concern. Truth is, I probably need to start spraying my cabbages and other very early greens (have never been able to successfully save a cabbage). While not a die-hard organic grower, I don't want to use sprays that WILL also kill soil life, including the worms, that I have worked so hard trying to support. Spray the orchard trees every week now, but have NOT touched the garden...and need to if I am to prevent the slugs, earworms, loopers, etc.. Just don't want the lethal soup blend style spray in the garden and, yet, know that ideas of picking the critters every morning will not work adequately.

[amideutch]

Two different animals Bill. This has better surfactant properties but the molasses has all the other ingredients. Using both together would be the best of both worlds. Ami

[mdvpc]

I have heard that folks use Yucca as a spreader/sticker and that it has some properties that help plants through stress periods. Anyone use Yucca?

[Wi-sunflower]

mensplace,

BT should be widely available at any garden center. That should help your cabbage problems.

Carol

[Mischka]

Seventh Generation also manufactures a 100% natural dish soap that works well. I've been using it for years.

http://www.seventhgeneration.com/Dish-Soap

I also use Spray-N-Grow's Coco-Wet. I like it too.

http://www.spray-n-growgardening.com...er=GCCW&top=19

[mjc]

Yucca extract is a commonly used surfactant, especially in certified organic sprays.

A couple of things to remember about dish 'soaps'...not all of them are soaps, many of them are detergents. Antibacterial ones would not be a very good idea for use with any kind of microbial spray. Fancy scents, 'hand care' additives and the like are not needed.

Soap, by it self makes a decent surfactant so why even bother with 'dish soap' which, even for the plain, cheap stuff is much more expensive than taking a bar of plain soap (the little, personnel sized bars of Ivory work great for this) and dissolving it in a gallon of water(grating it makes it easier to dissolve)...this comes out to about the same 'strength' as regular dish soap ?

Also with these 'natural' dish soaps, are the things like the kelp extractives going to be present in sufficient quantity, that once diluted, at teaspoon/gallon levels or so, to actually do any good? Wouldn't it just be better to to just buy an actual foliar spray product used at normal strength and add the cheap soap solution I mentioned above?

[mensplace]

Originally Posted by Wi-sunflower

mensplace,

BT should be widely available at any garden center. That should help your cabbage problems.

Carol

Went to the farm supply a few minutes ago. After being told that they didn't have anything like BT, they said that they had another product that everybody swears by. It was DIPEL. Read the ingredients and found it was BT. Covered every Brassica and used the rest of the two pounds to line the beds where the tomatoes will go. It was comparatively inexpensive, so will use more later in the season if needed. Two pounds goes a long way.

[sfmathews]

If they didn't know that Dipel is the same as BT, I'd consider finding another place....

Originally Posted by mensplace

Went to the farm supply a few minutes ago. After being told that they didn't have anything like BT, they said that they had another product that everybody swears by. It was DIPEL. Read the ingredients and found it was BT. Covered every Brassica and used the rest of the two pounds to line the beds where the tomatoes will go. It was comparatively inexpensive, so will use more later in the season if needed. Two pounds goes a long way.

[mensplace]

Another surfactant used throughout industry and agriculture is the same primary ingredient as is found in hair conditioner.

Originally Posted by mjc

Yucca extract is a commonly used surfactant, especially in certified organic sprays.

A couple of things to remember about dish 'soaps'...not all of them are soaps, many of them are detergents. Antibacterial ones would not be a very good idea for use with any kind of microbial spray. Fancy scents, 'hand care' additives and the like are not needed.

Soap, by it self makes a decent surfactant so why even bother with 'dish soap' which, even for the plain, cheap stuff is much more expensive than taking a bar of plain soap (the little, personnel sized bars of Ivory work great for this) and dissolving it in a gallon of water(grating it makes it easier to dissolve)...this comes out to about the same 'strength' as regular dish soap ?

Also with these 'natural' dish soaps, are the things like the kelp extractives going to be present in sufficient quantity, that once diluted, at teaspoon/gallon levels or so, to actually do any good? Wouldn't it just be better to to just buy an actual foliar spray product used at normal strength and add the cheap soap solution I mentioned above?

[mensplace]

Originally Posted by sfmathews

If they didn't know that Dipel is the same as BT, I'd consider finding another place....

I don't go there for education, but because they are close, have good prices and carry virtually everything ..organic and otherwise.. I ever need. Actually, FAR more than any of the would be "organic" distributors or garden centers in Atlanta and at far better prices. Plus, like an old hardware, they are fascinating to browse. I found the HUGE pigs ears in BULK, Hickory King Corn, and even a sulfur skin treatment for my Cairn who picked up something from another dog. AND, they gave me a REALLY nice hat! I mean, what more could anyone want?

[bohica]

I've used Yucca, the only down side is the foam it creates.
I've used a product from Agro-k that was a soy oil, non chemical, it was awesome, but left a film in my Stihl SR-420, now I use soluble Kelp as a surfactant.

[mdvpc]

Yucca does foam a lot-you have to put it in after the water in your sprayer or its a big problem.

[dustdevil]

Dipel:

http://www.valentbiosciences.com/doc...r/LC_DiPel.pdf