Sophie's Choice

I probably am a little arrogant, too, but I'm not trying to be. Sorry about that. I need to work on that.

[BlackBear]

I have tried them in the garden bed and 3 gallon and smaller containers they do very well at 2ft high and many like them for the size of fruit on a such a compact plant. Sophie's is a keeper for me.

[Fusion_power]

Adaptation happens just as fast as the intensity of the selection pressure inducing it. Very intense selection pressure might cull out 9,999 individual plants leaving only 1 that survives. Grow 100,000 plants and you have 10 survivors if you are lucky. Reproduce the 10 survivors and there is a very high chance 100,000 seedlings will give 50,000 or more survivors. Genetics is like that.

I've got tomatoes started now that have a huge advantage in my climate because they have some unusual disease tolerance genes. Will they still be valuable in other climatic conditions? That depends entirely on whether the disease tolerance genes are a help or a hindrance under those conditions.

Sophie's Choice is indeed a very interesting tomato. If I were playing with it, I'd cross with Sub Arctic Plenty.

@Fusion_power

Sub Arctic Plenty is a very interesting tomato from what I hear. I regret not getting seeds for it. There's always next year (I hope). Did you know it's supposed to be parthenocarpic, at least to a degree?

[NarnianGarden]

SAP .. I don't know what's interesting about it - the taste most definitely was not...
And it was not so early either - when I grew it some years ago, it was later than most other beefsteaks (Azoychka, Black varieties and other reds)... To be fair, the spot might have been slightly disadvantageous, away from direct sunlight. Won't grow it anytime soon.

Aurora, Stupice, they all were earlier than SAP..!

[Scooty]

Originally Posted by Fusion_power

Sophie's Choice is indeed a very interesting tomato. If I were playing with it, I'd cross with Sub Arctic Plenty.

SAP is a Beaverlodge line right? Is it the same as the 6808? Or are they completely unrelated?

[carolyn137]

Originally Posted by Scooty

SAP is a Beaverlodge line right? Is it the same as the 6808? Or are they completely unrelated?

No SAP is completely different and unrelated to anything Beaverlodge related.

http://tatianastomatobase.com/wiki/Sub-Arctic_Plenty

Carolyn

[Scooty]

Originally Posted by carolyn137

No SAP is completely different and unrelated to anything Beaverlodge related.

http://tatianastomatobase.com/wiki/Sub-Arctic_Plenty

Carolyn

The link you posted has the developer as Dr. Harris in Alberta, Canada. And other places like Baker's Creek are more specific and state Dr. Harris at "Beaverlodge Research Center" which is in Alberta. So technically not contradictory.

The description for the 6808 on Territorial only says "Beaverlodge Research Center."


Could you help clarify this information? I'm just curious if one is a renamed or a related line.

[carolyn137]

Originally Posted by Scooty

The link you posted has Dr. Harris in Alberta, Canada. And other places like Baker's Creek are more specific and state Dr. Harris at "Beaverlodge Research Center" which is in Alberta. So technically not contradictory.

The description for the 6808 on Territorial only says "Beaverlodge Research Center."

Could you help clarify this information? I'm just curious if one is a rename or a related line.

I've spent 6 hours here at Tville today,just took time off to eat supper,but I can try to help.

If you look at Tania's link SAP , with a PI #(plant ID #) was donated to the PCGRIN list in 1971,and at that time there were no Beaverlodge varieties even known, and here's a Google search on the Beaverlodge ones,and I think dates as well

https://www.google.com/search?q=Beav..._AUIBigA&dpr=1

If you look closely at the dates when they were first introduced to the seed sites mentioned.

I know where I was in 1971 and no Beaverlodge ones were ever mentioned or offered.

So IMO it appears that the Beaverlodge INStititute was a muchlaterdevelopment and was formed much later,and it's perfectly possible that SAP was part of the parentage of one or many of the subsequent Beaverlodge ones.

No way to know that for sure,but to me probable and no time to check the NC Cultivar lists but it's only usually F1 hybrids that are listed there..

Hope that helps a bit.

Carolyn

[Scooty]

I think you're right. I found this old paper from the Canadian Journal of Plant Science published in 1971 by Dr R. E. Harris. on the Sub-Artic vars: Early, Mid, Plenty (see attachment).

It seems Beaverlodge was a "Experimental Station" at that point. Probably renamed to "Research Farm" or "Research Center" when the location starting doing multi-agri research, which makes sense as the build date of the buildings range from 1950-1991.

Though... this doesn't really answer if 6808 is related at all, but I'm going to try and send them an email later this week.

[carolyn137]

Originally Posted by Scooty

I think you're right. I found this old paper from the Canadian Journal of Plant Science published in 1971 by Dr R. E. Harris. on the Sub-Artic vars: Early, Mid, Plenty (see attachment).

It seems Beaverlodge was a "Experimental Station" at that point. Probably renamed to "Research Farm" or "Research Center" when the location starting doing multi-agri research, which makes sense as the build date of the buildings range from 1950-1991.

Though... this doesn't really answer if 6808 is related at all, but I'm going to try and send them an email later this week.

Just repeat those words again,where you said you thought I was right b/c today I need confirmation that I'm not batty.

I've talked about the Cheyenne, WY Experimental Station which was the precursor to the USDA station at Ames,IA,so I do know how these things can go with name changes.

Good sleuthing,so keep it up.

Carolyn

[Scooty]

Originally Posted by carolyn137

Just repeat those words again,where you said you thought I was right b/c today I need confirmation that I'm not batty.

I've talked about the Cheyenne, WY Experimental Station which was the precursor to the USDA station at Ames,IA,so I do know how these things can go with name changes.

Good sleuthing,so keep it up.

Carolyn

Honestly..... the weirdest thing about all this is learning all three Sub-Artic lines owe some reasonable amount of parentage to the Fargo Yellow Pear.... (according to that academic paper).

[BlackBear]

Weird. facts ..as Fargo has also become one of my keeper "traditions" as well I just like the looks of it and it is on my cell phone as a desk top
I didn't know it was such a seminal variety ! In this department I am a gentleman ..but not a scholar ....LOL

It looks like Sophie's Choice *already* has above-average heat-tolerance. It set a fruit, and the heat is already here (it's supposed to cool off tomorrow, though). The plant is looking good.

[BlackBear]

Yep Sophies is a keeper for me !......

it is so compact .and has fruit already inside cover and out side cover..

I have a built in bias toward the regular leaf "compact " and

generally prefer the Rugose leaf determinate dwarf bunch .....

Like Mano, Betalux, Roza Vetrov.........etc. But it is Just so hard to argue with

such a good plant ! Sophies is in the inner circle for my compact/dwarf endeavors .... such nice size fruit ...earliness ..etc.
hard to beat ..if you like the compact size plant ..... another Gold medal ...LOL

if anyone has a compact 2ft RL plant that matches Sophies with earliness and medium fruit size I would sure like to know .....