2017 Grafting thread: Open to all

[BigVanVader]

Sweet Bill, Im gonna try a few grafts this weekend. I will follow all I've learned and hope for success.

[b54red]

Originally Posted by Hoosier

What are the advantages of the DE and Oil Dry over peat based potting mix?

I had real problems early on in my grafting experience with damping off in the healing chambers. The moist environment really made a bad problem down here much worse. I tried everything. I tried letting the root stock potting mix get really dry before grafting but then I had too many not take and I still got damping off. I tried not misting the interior but then it was too dry and the scions wilted too quick before the graft union could start healing. I tried taking them out of the chambers early; but that caused too many failures. I tried keeping the chamber vented even from the beginning but with the same results; too many wilted and died. Finally I tried putting a generous portion of DE on the surface of the potting soil and got more successes with less damping off but it was still a problem and I had to time opening the chamber to perfection. If I left them in a day too long I would start seeing the damping off either at the soil line or the graft juncture. So I took the next logical step and used DE for not only my seed starting but for my grafting cups. I first used the small DE that I used in seed starting but it held too much water which meant I was still getting some damping off so I tried the larger DE and added dry DE around the stem and top of the cup before it went into the chamber and that is when my success rates really went up.

I should have thought of this sooner because when I was having so much trouble with damping off with my dense planting seed starting, nothing really worked until I used DE for seed starting. The first time I had a lot of damping off in a healing chamber I should have immediately gone to DE; but being a bit dense it took a while to sink in.

Bill

[Father'sDaughter]

I've been using the small DE for seed starting for a couple of years, but not because I had damping off problems here in my not-so-humid, hot-air heated house.

I tried it, then stuck with it because it's easier to work with, promotes amazing root development, is re-usable, and retains water better without the sogginess of the soilless starting mixes.

Now that I'm moving to grafting, I'm trying to decide if I'll be good with the small DE for the grafted plants as well.

I've been saving egg cartons for seed starting, and I have small seedling pots I will move them into after grafting--the same small pots I've been using to start seeds in DE, and where they stay until they're large enough to pot-up into potting mix.

[b54red]

Originally Posted by Father'sDaughter

I've been using the small DE for seed starting for a couple of years, but not because I had damping off problems here in my not-so-humid, hot-air heated house.

I tried it, then stuck with it because it's easier to work with, promotes amazing root development, is re-usable, and retains water better without the sogginess of the soilless starting mixes.

Now that I'm moving to grafting, I'm trying to decide if I'll be good with the small DE for the grafted plants as well.

I've been saving egg cartons for seed starting, and I have small seedling pots I will move them into after grafting--the same small pots I've been using to start seeds in DE, and where they stay until they're large enough to pot-up into potting mix.

From my experience the small DE holds a bit too much water so it can cause the root stock to take up too much moisture and result in separation of the root stock from the scion. That is one of the reasons I remove most of the root ball from the root stock before grafting. With the full root ball too much moisture can be taken up with the same separation occurring at the graft juncture due to pressure from the rising water causing the two stems to separate.

If you have no damping off problems like I do then you could just use potting soil that isn't too moist instead of DE; but I have too many problems with damping off to use anything that can make it worse. I think damping off is just in the air here. You can try the small DE because you may not have any problems with it. Try some and see. It worked fairly well for me but since I can't leave my plants in the healing chamber too long without problems erupting I am going to continue with what has given me the best and fastest results.

Bill

[BigVanVader]

I've never seen the small stuff around so I have always used the larger granular DE. It has always worked great for me and I've had no issues with seeds coming up or anything.

[b54red]

I opened the healing chamber again today to let in some fresh air. The lid was still good and moist so no misting was needed. I will probably leave it on another day but remove the towel that is shading it from light and then start gradually opening it since the plants I am using are so small. Just a bit of wilting will end them whereas sometimes slightly larger grafts will recover better from a bit of wilting. I'm playing it by ear at this stage as I am every time after the first two or three days in the healing chamber. A lot depends on how the grafts look and the weather.

Bill

[b54red]

I messed up yesterday afternoon. I went out late in the day and opened my healing chamber and everything looked good so I decided since the humidity was high from a light rain earlier that I would take the lid off for a half hour then close it back up. My oldest son came home and I forgot all about it and went out early this morning to check on things and found it still sitting with the lid off. All the plants looked okay except with a slight wilting but nothing to worry about. It got down to freezing last night so it was really cool in the greenhouse so that is why I don't think there was major wilting from opening it up too soon. I put the lid back on and will monitor them more closely today and see how they do. I moved the chamber to where it will get much more light and once it heats up in the greenhouse if the plants aren't showing any wilting I will crack the lid well and keep checking it as the day goes on. Unless I forget.

Bill

[txtstorm]

Okay......I did a small round of grafts today. Just six total. Fingers crossed. I've got plenty of plants, so I did a little experiment and dabbed a tiny amount of Clonex on to the cuts of half the scions, just to see if it might facilitate healing. I know it might result in unwanted adventitious roots, but I thought it would be fun just to try.

This time, I grew the plants out under better lights and they are much sturdier than my last attempt. Also, I've waited until they have a bit larger stem diameter. I trimmed most of the leaves and roots before grafting, made sure the union was good and supported the plant with a skewer. They're in the healing chamber at 96% humidity and 75F. I feel good about these (knocking on wood).

This round was Sungold F1 rootstock with German Johnson Benton Strain, Black Krim and Pink Berkely Tie Die scions. If all goes well with these over the next few days, I'll try a round with my Supernatural rootstock.

Cheers,

~Adam

[BigVanVader]

Good Luck Adam, hope they are successful. I may do a few tomorrow.

[txtstorm]

Thanks, BVV! Same to you if you do.

[Gardeneer]

I want to do some experiment too. But I don't have any clips.
Any alternatives to clips ? Maybe something homemade ?

[BigVanVader]

I can mail you some if you haven't ordered any.

[jtjmartin]

Originally Posted by Gardeneer

I want to do some experiment too. But I don't have any clips.
Any alternatives to clips ? Maybe something homemade ?

I've seen a number of videos where people make their own clips out of tubing. This link shows using tubing for tomato cleft grafts:

http://horticulture.ucdavis.edu/main...ting_guide.pdf

Haven't done it myself - but will probably try on some of my extra seedlings.

Jeff

[b54red]

Originally Posted by Gardeneer

I want to do some experiment too. But I don't have any clips.
Any alternatives to clips ? Maybe something homemade ?

I suggest you get some if you want to graft many tomatoes. Below is the link to where I get mine and I think the prices are reasonable. At about 5 cents apiece and they are reusable. Early on the smaller clips are the main ones you will use but as the weather heats up and tomato seedlings grow much faster it is really good to have some of the larger ones. When you get into the grafting process you will find that having a selection of sizes of clips makes the job so much easier and allows you more freedom in selecting what to graft.

https://hydro-gardens.com/?s=tomato+grafting+clips

I did a whole chamber of grafts today after doing about a dozen two days ago. I mainly used the 1.5mm and a few of the 2mm silicon clips. During the whole tomato season the most used clip for me is the 2.5. With my arthritis it is just easier to work with slightly larger seedlings. Today I don't think the ones I grafted will have a real high success rate because my hands just weren't cooperating but in a day or two most of the seedlings will be reaching that easier for me to handle size and then I will have to do a lot of grafting in a short time before my root stock get too large for even my largest 3mm clip.

Bill

[Gardeneer]

Originally Posted by jtjmartin

I've seen a number of videos where people make their own clips out of tubing. This link shows using tubing for tomato cleft grafts:

http://horticulture.ucdavis.edu/main...ting_guide.pdf

Haven't done it myself - but will probably try on some of my extra seedlings.

Jeff

Jeff, thanks that is what I was thinking.

Bill, I saw you are using the clips used for "stringing". Since I plan on doing one row of stringing, I would get some that can have double function.