yield from tps

[DKelly]

Here is a question aimed at Tom,
Is it possible to get about the same yield from tps compared to seed pieces?

[GunnarSK]

I read that potatoes yield best in the second year growing from TPS, ie. from seed potatoes which have in turn been grown from TPS, but am interested in whatever Tom Wagner, Darrell Jones or anyone who grew (the same) potatoes from TPS and seed potatoes will write.

[Tom Wagner]

I don't expect many folks to get the same yield from TPS seedlings as you would if that same clone was planted from a tuber...i.e. the second year.

It is indeed possible to get outstanding yields...even better than from tubers, but that takes some practice. I make it a practice to assume I will get better yields planting the small tubers from TPS back for the second season. However various pathogens, virus, etc., will enter the 1st year seedling potato as a latent and may manifest itself full-born the next season and yields may plummet.

The conventional wisdom is to start the seedlings in a greenhouse and kill the plants early to obtain little B-sized tubers for replanting. There are many benefits from doing this but I won't go into them here now.

Watching the time of sowing, transplanting twice, hilling, precise watering, good fertility practices....one can learn to accomplish the full yield within the first year. Replanting the tubers will adjust to tubers per hill a bit more accurate and the maturity will be more exacting to follow. Having more than one plant during the second season will objectify the average yield, etc.

I have made it a practice over 58 years of growing potatoes from TPS to select for outstanding first year performance. Diamond Toro is a variety of potato that yielded 11 lbs. as a first year seedling. I have TPS of it for sale.

Because I have so many many clones to work with I do a combination of growing out the mini size tubers in trays..72 cell trays and the direct transplanting to the field. My recommendation to everyone here is to follow a number of different practices to see what works for you. I do not expect anyone to really know TPS in their whole lifetime...I haven't.

Tom Wagner

[DKelly]

Thank you for the thoughful answer.....11 pounds is the number to beat? I will certainly give it a try!

[wingnut]

Tom I am curious about transplanting twice. When, How, and Why.

[Tom Wagner]

Tom I am curious about transplanting twice. When, How, and Why

The whole thing about transplanting twice is to mimic the seedlings growth as close as possible to a potato growing from a tuber. You must bury the transplant to get the underground stem to be like a potato sprout. It will root out along the stem in a way that creates tubers as closely as if were a tuber plant. Potatoes root out from the stem if grown from a tuber and that is why the seedling must undergo the metamorphis of seedling to tuber plant as fast as possible.

The transplanting begins as soon as the first or..... better..second seed leaf is seen….or it can occur at about the leaf 4 to leaf 6 depending on various factors…time of year, temps, light, etc.
The second transplanting happens when the seedling goes to the field. It can go to a fairly large pot and the size of pot will determine the final size of tuber(s) formed. A one inch cell may produce a marble size tuber…a four inch pot..a egg sized tuber…a gallon pot …a tangerine size tuber and an two gallon container can make apple sized tubers or larger, depening on varietiy.

Leaving a potato seedling in a tiny container too long usually hastens maturity and death of the seedling…you don’t want that if you are going to the field to have a plant un-interrupted in its growth.

Hilling up is a form of transplanting because it burries the bottom leaves. This is a necessary evil in producing an optimum yield that represents the yielding abitlity of the new variety. Getting the original root ball down deep into the soil avoids drought and the tubers formed are better if they don’t come directly from the original root ball….tubers are larger and more close represent the truer nature of the potential of the variety.

Transplanting twice avoids the early senescencee that all too often occurs when not transplanted on the favorable times. Knowing when and how that is…comes from experience.

The quicker a seedling starts looking like a potato vines growing from a tuber means that you will get a reasonable yield, shape and size of those seedlings hills. You want that seedling to show the compound leaves at soon as possible You want the height of the plant to look like tuber grown plants.\\

Potato seedlings can get leggy, fall over. get brittle , stay stringy, or otherwise don't grow as you want unless that leggy plant is burried in the soil. Because the seedling does not have a tuber piece to draw nutrients from .....demands that the gardener judiciously provide ample fertilizer, but not so much as to burn the plant.

Tom Wagner

[Farmette]

Oops, I hope I haven't waited too long to plant mine out, but some of the nights here have been in the high 30's. So, if I understand it correctly, I should plant them so that much of the length of the stem is underground with just an inch or two showing above ground? Are you saying that they develop roots along the underground stem, similar to a tomato plant?

[Indyartist]

I think my timing has been good as for my second transplanting of many of my TPS seedlings, my only question would be on appearance. I'm posting a photo showing my "Skagit Magic" TPS transplant next to a pot which has had "Norland" seed potato planted in it. The "Skagit Magic" plants are growing like crazy but what surprises me as that they seem so broad leafed compared to any other potato I have growing either from seed or tuber. Is the the broadness of the leaves a unique trait of the variety or an indication that it is not developing as one would hope?
My next task is to try and come up with the perfect fertilizer mix for the plants to maximize my results.

[Tom Wagner]

I am finding more and more neat things about the progeny from Skagit Magic. The broad leaf aspect is a valuable trait under certain abiotic stresses...wind, drought, hail, etc. The photo shows a strong indication that this very plant is a tetraploid rather than diploid as in the maternal grandparent...Skagit Valley Gold.

The large leaves usually gives me a larger potato and one that bulks early. The potential for high yield should be there as well.

I've got to get my one thousand seedling transplants of Skagit Magic out to the field so that I can make my observation directly. I did note that this strain does produce seedlings with high vigor and sturdiness...even the cotyledons were wider than other TPS.

I will list Skagit Magic on my TPS website next year for sure. I will try lots of crosses with those that show special traits such as the wide leaf one.

[wingnut]

Can you graft a wide leaf 'skagit magic' top on a low yielding but tasty base for better yields?

[Tom Wagner]

A rootstock variety which has been chosen for its hardiness, disease resistance, or other factors may enhance the productivity and size of the scion. I am not sure the opposite is true, and how that affects the potato rootstalk's yield is unknown to me.

I wonder if the late blight res. of the Skagit Magic and its offspring could offer the rootstalk a hand-up for yield, but then again, tuber blight is inherited differently from foliar blight res.

Most of the studies of rootstalk/scion potato work has been with salt tolerance.

Tom Wagner

[davespitzer]

Tom- If I understood your directions above, you start the seed in 72 cell trays (in sterile soilless mix?), then as soon as there are 2 leaves showing you bury the plant so the stem is under the surface (first transplant), and finally you transplant into the field, again burying the stem (second transplant). So the goal is to get as much stem underground as possible as early as possible, while still having some leaf exposed, correct?

[Tom Wagner]

Exactly!

The idea is to mimic potato plants grown from tubers. By subjecting the potato seedling to two transplanting venues...the roots multiply exponentially and often the leaf nodes buried initiate shoots that.....rather than form tubers....create new vines about ground....growing thus as a compound plant and the yield of the seedling more closely mimics the tuber grown plant.

The first root ball and the second root ball explode with new energy and enjoy the cool wet soil that is present as you continue to 'hill up' the seedling. The idea is to get the optimum environment for a compare/contrast model so that you can select those most likely to repeat their performance as tuber clones.

Seedling potato plants....TPS derived plants....suffer vagarious discord if planted shallow...drought, heat extremes, weed pressure, and worse....lodging disorders.

I spent a lifetime with TPS...often piddling away, dawdling my time away doing things ineffectively. I want people to hit the ground running with TPS and not develop bad habits.

I wish, or hope, to see a day when many folks start their potato patch from TPS (True Potato Seed) and do it well. And let me tell you what.....it is still hard for me to do it well.

I am fully aware that TPS is not for everyone....but how else can you get such great diversity of potato types? My obligation is to inform folks of the obligatory methods as I see them....and provide thousands of unique TPS materials to start the Renaissance of Potato Diversity.

I am stressing the idea that the potato germplasm bank is in many, many backyards and not in some vault somewhere. We must not let the Monsanto's of the world dictate what we grow and eat. I foresee a generation of TPS growers saying, "This Spud's for You" and share with their neighbors, friends and relatives.

Tom Wagner

[Timbotide]

I am stressing the idea that the potato germplasm bank is in many, many backyards and not in some vault somewhere. We must not let the Monsanto's of the world dictate what we grow and eat. I foresee a generation of TPS growers saying, "This Spud's for You" and share with their neighbors, friends and relatives.

Tom Wagner[/QUOTE]


Mr Wagner,

You hit the nail on the head with that statement.
I couldn't have said it any better myself.
I applaud you for all of the hard work you put into
The research and growing that you do to help insure
We have a multitude of varieties available to us.

Tim

[wingnut]

With food prices going up so fast, who doesn't need a cheap dependable supply?