Is it ok to offer older seed in the trade forum?

gryffin · January 20, 2012

I was going through some old seed I recently found on the back corner of a shelf. I found multiple packets of a few varieties that I purchased new last year (not knowing I had the old stuff lying around). By old I mean 1997-2000. Would it be viewed as ok to offer them in the trade forum for SASE? I hate to throw them out, but I don't want to offer them if it is bad form to do so.

Thanks for any input.

kath · January 20, 2012

I say list them and mention the date for each pack and see if anyone thinks it's a gamble worth taking for the cost of two envelopes and two stamps.

**carolyn137** · January 21, 2012

IN previous seed offers here I've been offering older seeds but only back to about 2003 b'c older than that it really is often difficult to get them going, especially heart varieties.

If you want to offer back to about 1997 I'd be sure to also post your method of waking up old seeds. For this past seed offer I only offered seed back to 2007 and deleted all the older seed I had been offering back to I think 2003. But I also posted in that seed offer that if anyone saw any seed they couldn't get elsewhere that if they contacted me this summer I'd see if I still had that variety, and a few folks did let me know that that's what they wanted to do.

Since older seed can often take up to a couple of months to germinate, and that's after treatment, it can be a real problem. But there are those who might like the challenge, as they noted in their e-mails.

But this was a seed offer, not a trade situation, and I know I wouldn't offer really old seed in a trade situation b'c while you might offer 1998 seed you might be sent back seed from the past couple of years and, well, I know I wouldn't go for that myself.

This year I was offering seed from 2007 to fresh 2011 seed and if there is a next year I'll delete the 2007's and go from 2008 to fresh 2012 seed.

So as long as you warn folks about those much older seeds, and share with them what you think the germination might be, and also indicate what kind of treatment you'd suggest, well, it's really up to you what you want to do.

But again, for a trade situation, I'm not so sure I'd do that with old seeds b'c you send out seeds from 2000 and get back seeds from 2010, that's not so good as I see it. You called it bad form, I think.

And with those older seeds you really have to send out a LOT of them if anyone is going to have a chance to treat them and wake them up.

Over the past few years Tania and some others have asked me to look in my older seed stash, I have seeds going back to 1991, b'c some varieties over the years have kind of morphed into what they shouldn't be, and sometimes the older seeds can be awakened, and sometimes not. Frogsleap Farm was able to get up some special seeds from 1993 that I sent him, but Mark is very experienced in waking up old seeds. And I still don't know if he got any seeds off those two plants this past Fall b/c it did take so long to get a couple of plants, and I'd sent him I think around 100 seeds.

And I just sent out Tadesse and Wuhib seeds to four folks, those seeds are from 1994, as noted in the Tadesse thread in the WANTED seed subforum. But the reason for that is b'c there currently is no seed source for correct Tadesse seeds as is noted in that thread.

gryffin · January 23, 2012

Thanks for your detailed response. I had been thinking of giving away the seed and not trading it.

After thinking about it some more, I decided to throw out all of the old seed that I am not interested in trying myself. The seeds that I tossed out are ones that are commonly available commercially so using my old seed isn't really worthwhile.

For the other varieties, I am doing some germination testing. Depending on how it goes, I will toss the seed, offer it for free, or try some special methods to wake it up if I really want to grow it again and I can't find it commercially. I don't have any experience waking up old seed, so it'll been an experiment.

Thanks again for the input, I really appreciate it!

erlyberd · January 28, 2012

Not sure what proper seed trading manners are/or should be but I only list stuff that was grown by me the previous year only. If it two or more years old it should be mentioned. What do others think??? I feel all my seeds are very fresh in fact fresher than when I received them.

**carolyn137** · January 28, 2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by erlyberd

Not sure what proper seed trading manners are/or should be but I only list stuff that was grown by me the previous year only. If it two or more years old it should be mentioned. What do others think??? I feel all my seeds are very fresh in fact fresher than when I received them.

When I send out seeds either for my seed offer here or for SSE requests I write the date the seed was produced on each pack, just as I'm doing now for my seed offer and if you look at that seed offer you'll see that the listings are grouped by seed age.

I don't trade seeds for several reasons, but if I did I'd also put the seed age on the pack. I do know that many who trade do not indicate seed age and think that's wrong to do.

Yes, fresh seeds that a person actually produces are great but seed from a variety that's older, as I indicated in my seed offer can also germinate well.

So that's what I think, as you asked.

habitat_gardener · January 28, 2012

I finally looked through my collected vegetable and flower seed this week to decide what to grow, and I was surprised at how old some of my seed was. The most "optimistic" seed-viability chart I found is
http://www.growingyourownveg.com/veg...dviability.php
It gives the average and maximum number of years, and 10 years is the upper limit for all the seeds listed. So, yeah, if I had common varieties of 1997-2000 seeds, I'd compost them.

I've bought outdated seeds a few times for something like 20-50 cents a package; retailers donate the seeds to nonprofits if they're past the sell-by date. I've usually been able to get as many plants as I need for my small garden from these packs. The germination rate is lower for older seeds, though.

For trading, I always put the date and whether it's commercial seed or from my garden. When I'm selecting seed to grow in my own garden, it helps to know the age of the seed so I'll know how much to sow and whether to give the seed special attention.

ScottinAtlanta · January 28, 2012

I would appreciate old seeds - it is easy to give them a try, and nothing lost if they don't sprout. Don't throw them out!

January 20, 2012	#1
gryffin Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: New Hampshire Posts: 229	Is it ok to offer older seed in the trade forum? I was going through some old seed I recently found on the back corner of a shelf. I found multiple packets of a few varieties that I purchased new last year (not knowing I had the old stuff lying around). By old I mean 1997-2000. Would it be viewed as ok to offer them in the trade forum for SASE? I hate to throw them out, but I don't want to offer them if it is bad form to do so. Thanks for any input.

January 21, 2012	#3
carolyn137 Moderator Emeritus Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Upstate NY, zone 4b/5a Posts: 21,169	IN previous seed offers here I've been offering older seeds but only back to about 2003 b'c older than that it really is often difficult to get them going, especially heart varieties. If you want to offer back to about 1997 I'd be sure to also post your method of waking up old seeds. For this past seed offer I only offered seed back to 2007 and deleted all the older seed I had been offering back to I think 2003. But I also posted in that seed offer that if anyone saw any seed they couldn't get elsewhere that if they contacted me this summer I'd see if I still had that variety, and a few folks did let me know that that's what they wanted to do. Since older seed can often take up to a couple of months to germinate, and that's after treatment, it can be a real problem. But there are those who might like the challenge, as they noted in their e-mails. But this was a seed offer, not a trade situation, and I know I wouldn't offer really old seed in a trade situation b'c while you might offer 1998 seed you might be sent back seed from the past couple of years and, well, I know I wouldn't go for that myself. This year I was offering seed from 2007 to fresh 2011 seed and if there is a next year I'll delete the 2007's and go from 2008 to fresh 2012 seed. So as long as you warn folks about those much older seeds, and share with them what you think the germination might be, and also indicate what kind of treatment you'd suggest, well, it's really up to you what you want to do. But again, for a trade situation, I'm not so sure I'd do that with old seeds b'c you send out seeds from 2000 and get back seeds from 2010, that's not so good as I see it. You called it bad form, I think. And with those older seeds you really have to send out a LOT of them if anyone is going to have a chance to treat them and wake them up. Over the past few years Tania and some others have asked me to look in my older seed stash, I have seeds going back to 1991, b'c some varieties over the years have kind of morphed into what they shouldn't be, and sometimes the older seeds can be awakened, and sometimes not. Frogsleap Farm was able to get up some special seeds from 1993 that I sent him, but Mark is very experienced in waking up old seeds. And I still don't know if he got any seeds off those two plants this past Fall b/c it did take so long to get a couple of plants, and I'd sent him I think around 100 seeds. And I just sent out Tadesse and Wuhib seeds to four folks, those seeds are from 1994, as noted in the Tadesse thread in the WANTED seed subforum. But the reason for that is b'c there currently is no seed source for correct Tadesse seeds as is noted in that thread. __________________ Carolyn

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January 20, 2012	#2
kath Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: zone 6b, PA Posts: 5,664	I say list them and mention the date for each pack and see if anyone thinks it's a gamble worth taking for the cost of two envelopes and two stamps.

January 23, 2012	#4
gryffin Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: New Hampshire Posts: 229	Thanks for your detailed response. I had been thinking of giving away the seed and not trading it. After thinking about it some more, I decided to throw out all of the old seed that I am not interested in trying myself. The seeds that I tossed out are ones that are commonly available commercially so using my old seed isn't really worthwhile. For the other varieties, I am doing some germination testing. Depending on how it goes, I will toss the seed, offer it for free, or try some special methods to wake it up if I really want to grow it again and I can't find it commercially. I don't have any experience waking up old seed, so it'll been an experiment. Thanks again for the input, I really appreciate it!

January 28, 2012	#5
erlyberd Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: CT Zone 5 Posts: 186	Not sure what proper seed trading manners are/or should be but I only list stuff that was grown by me the previous year only. If it two or more years old it should be mentioned. What do others think??? I feel all my seeds are very fresh in fact fresher than when I received them.

January 28, 2012	#7
habitat_gardener Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: California Central Valley Posts: 2,543	I finally looked through my collected vegetable and flower seed this week to decide what to grow, and I was surprised at how old some of my seed was. The most "optimistic" seed-viability chart I found is http://www.growingyourownveg.com/veg...dviability.php It gives the average and maximum number of years, and 10 years is the upper limit for all the seeds listed. So, yeah, if I had common varieties of 1997-2000 seeds, I'd compost them. I've bought outdated seeds a few times for something like 20-50 cents a package; retailers donate the seeds to nonprofits if they're past the sell-by date. I've usually been able to get as many plants as I need for my small garden from these packs. The germination rate is lower for older seeds, though. For trading, I always put the date and whether it's commercial seed or from my garden. When I'm selecting seed to grow in my own garden, it helps to know the age of the seed so I'll know how much to sow and whether to give the seed special attention.

January 28, 2012	#8
ScottinAtlanta Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Atlanta, Georgia Posts: 2,593	I would appreciate old seeds - it is easy to give them a try, and nothing lost if they don't sprout. Don't throw them out!