WV '63 status OP or heirloom?

WVTomatoMan · February 27, 2013

WV '63 is an OP (open pollinated) tomato that was developed by Dr. Mannon Gallegly (WVU) to commemorate West Viginia's centennial (100th anniversary of WV becoming a state). One of the breeding goals was to create a disease tolerant tomato that would address the diseases that affected various areas of the state.

This marks the 50th anniversary of that release. I would like to get a feel as to whether folks think it should be referred to an heirloom now that it is 50 years old.

So what do you think OP or heirloom for WV '63?

Randy

amideutch · February 27, 2013

OP
Ami

PA_Julia · February 27, 2013

Randy,

The question that is raised by the question you asked is when is a tomato strain old enough to be considered an heirloom?

Is it based on a consensus of the powers that be?

In my opinion a stabilized 50 year old line would be considered an heirloom based on age alone.

Doug9345 · February 27, 2013

The way the term heirloom is being used why not. It's a better candidate than many that are being called heirloom. Rutgers is called a commercial heirloom. If that is an heirloom then WV 63 is.

I personally believe that heirloom should be reserved for tomatoes know to be passed down within a family, but the term is being applied to "old" or "old like" open pollinated tomatoes. I'd prefer the term classic and or antique to refer to varieties that are just old.

Redbaron · February 27, 2013

Heirloom

Alfredo · February 27, 2013

In my humble opinion...sounds like an "open-pollinated" variety that will eventually become or considered an heirloom by the majority of gardeners in due time. But that's just me.

~Alfredo

peppero · February 27, 2013

sounds like an OP HEIRLOOM to me. jon

barkeater · February 27, 2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by PA_Julia

Randy,

In my opinion a stabilized 50 year old line would be considered an heirloom based on age alone.

But I don't feel like an heirloom!

Fusion_power · February 27, 2013

Quote:

I'd prefer the term classic and or antique to refer to varieties that are just old.

So if that makes me a "classic" does it make Carolyn an "antique"?

Doug9345 · February 27, 2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fusion_power

So if that makes me a "classic" does it make Carolyn an "antique"?

You are more like fine wine, Vintage. Barkeaters comment made me realize that this tomato was released after I was born.

**carolyn137** · February 27, 2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by Doug9345

The way the term heirloom is being used why not. It's a better candidate than many that are being called heirloom. Rutgers is called a commercial heirloom. If that is an heirloom then WV 63 is.

I personally believe that heirloom should be reserved for tomatoes know to be passed down within a family, but the term is being applied to "old" or "old like" open pollinated tomatoes. I'd prefer the term classic and or antique to refer to varieties that are just old.

There are many definitions of what an heirloom should be and lots of threads here about that.

I'll summarize and say that the original definition was those OP varieties introduced before about 1940 when hybrids first started making an appearance.

Then there are those who say 50 years, and I don't agree with that b'c it says today it's not an heirloom and tomorrow it is, as in a moving target.

Most would say that it should be only the family type heirlooms that should be called heirlooms, but I think it's OK to say the same about OP varieties commercially introduced before 1940.

Rutgers was first released in 1928 so I'd be OK with it being called a commercial heirloom/

WV63 was introduced in 1963, not pre-1940 ,not a family heirloom, so I'd call it just an OP, same as many other OP's.

Carolyn

Alfredo · February 27, 2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by barkeater

But I don't feel like an heirloom!

Barkeater and Fusion power

...I was waiting for everyone to start applying that "50 yr theory" as being an heirloom to themselves at some point in this thread! geez...Like Doug9345 said, more like a fine wine. ~Alfredo

WVTomatoMan · February 27, 2013

PA Julia: Interesting questions. Yeah basically the underlying question deals with age. As far as the second question no one has identified the powers that be to me

, but I suppose general consensus in the tomato community accounts for at least some tomatoes being called heirlooms. However, even at that there are ambiguities. Take Green Zebra for instance. There are several sites, mostly seed sellers, that call it an heirloom. However there are sites that call it OP. The Wikipedia article says that GZ is not an heirloom tomato, despite often being mistakenly designated as one.

Barkeater and Fusion Power: haha.

Randy

Hillbillygardner · February 27, 2013

This sounds pretty familar to me here the Ozarks. Dr. Lambreth from the university of Missouri developed several OP varities including the Mozark, in the early 1950's. Some seeds were passed down from my grandfather to me and a few neighbors but, to this day, what very,very few people I know that have or have seen this variety consider it an OP.
I think heirloom is being used out of context, much like organic.

Father'sDaughter · February 27, 2013

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alfredo

Barkeater and Fusion power

...I was waiting for everyone to start applying that "50 yr theory" as being an heirloom to themselves at some point in this thread! geez...Like Doug9345 said, more like a fine wine. ~Alfredo

Yes, but that 50 year heirloom definition would only apply to those of us who are stabilized...

February 27, 2013	#1
WVTomatoMan Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: West Virginia - Zone 6 Posts: 594	WV '63 status OP or heirloom? WV '63 is an OP (open pollinated) tomato that was developed by Dr. Mannon Gallegly (WVU) to commemorate West Viginia's centennial (100th anniversary of WV becoming a state). One of the breeding goals was to create a disease tolerant tomato that would address the diseases that affected various areas of the state. This marks the 50th anniversary of that release. I would like to get a feel as to whether folks think it should be referred to an heirloom now that it is 50 years old. So what do you think OP or heirloom for WV '63? Randy

February 27, 2013	#2
amideutch Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Germany 49°26"N 07°36"E Posts: 5,041	OP Ami __________________ Life's journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out, shouting ‘...Holy Crap .....What a ride!'

February 27, 2013	#3
PA_Julia Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Mar 2012 Location: Princeton, Ky Zone 7A Posts: 2,208	Randy, The question that is raised by the question you asked is when is a tomato strain old enough to be considered an heirloom? Is it based on a consensus of the powers that be? In my opinion a stabilized 50 year old line would be considered an heirloom based on age alone. __________________ Personal Best- 4.46 LB Big Zac 2013

February 27, 2013	#5
Redbaron Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Sep 2012 Location: Oklahoma Posts: 4,488	Heirloom __________________ Scott AKA The Redbaron "Permaculture is a philosophy of working with, rather than against nature; of protracted & thoughtful observation rather than protracted & thoughtless labour; & of looking at plants & animals in all their functions, rather than treating any area as a single-product system." Bill Mollison co-founder of permaculture

February 27, 2013	#13
WVTomatoMan Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: West Virginia - Zone 6 Posts: 594	PA Julia: Interesting questions. Yeah basically the underlying question deals with age. As far as the second question no one has identified the powers that be to me, but I suppose general consensus in the tomato community accounts for at least some tomatoes being called heirlooms. However, even at that there are ambiguities. Take Green Zebra for instance. There are several sites, mostly seed sellers, that call it an heirloom. However there are sites that call it OP. The Wikipedia article says that GZ is not an heirloom tomato, despite often being mistakenly designated as one. Barkeater and Fusion Power: haha. Randy Last edited by WVTomatoMan; February 27, 2013 at 05:43 PM. Reason: Typo.

February 27, 2013	#4
Doug9345 Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Durhamville,NY Posts: 2,706	The way the term heirloom is being used why not. It's a better candidate than many that are being called heirloom. Rutgers is called a commercial heirloom. If that is an heirloom then WV 63 is. I personally believe that heirloom should be reserved for tomatoes know to be passed down within a family, but the term is being applied to "old" or "old like" open pollinated tomatoes. I'd prefer the term classic and or antique to refer to varieties that are just old.

February 27, 2013	#6
Alfredo Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: Clifton, NJ Posts: 554	In my humble opinion...sounds like an "open-pollinated" variety that will eventually become or considered an heirloom by the majority of gardeners in due time. But that's just me. ~Alfredo

February 27, 2013	#7
peppero Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: selmer, tn Posts: 2,944	sounds like an OP HEIRLOOM to me. jon

February 27, 2013	#14
Hillbillygardner Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: Eagle Rock, MO Posts: 43	This sounds pretty familar to me here the Ozarks. Dr. Lambreth from the university of Missouri developed several OP varities including the Mozark, in the early 1950's. Some seeds were passed down from my grandfather to me and a few neighbors but, to this day, what very,very few people I know that have or have seen this variety consider it an OP. I think heirloom is being used out of context, much like organic.