Irrigation irritation !!!

[garyjr]

Originally Posted by imp

The main point of doing this is for consistent watering and also to water very early or late.

Turning on the spigot valve, I can stand out there and hand water, LOL, but I really want to put the water right at the plant and slowly as I have a loamy clay mixed soil. I also wish to run some fertilizer to each plant.

I think this might be the right order, but not really sure so if anyone thinks it is wrong, please say so!

Spigot
Y splitter
one one side of the Y splitter:
Back flow preventer
pressure reducer,
filter
fertilizer of what ever sort if used goes here
timer with 4 valves for 4 zones
coupling to go from male hose threads to 1/2 inch tubing


Is that right?

Most of the back flow preventers, pressure reducers,
and filters are not meant to be under constant pressure.
So normally you would have your y then your timer.
I have a single timer so it is installed in this order:
Y, timer, BFP, Filter, fertigation (if I had it), pressure reducer, female
hose thread, then your 1/2" supply.. I would check with the
supplier and see if they have a pressure reducer designed to be
under constant pressure. If so then you would have y, pressure
reducer, bfp, filter, fertigation, 4 zone valve, supply lines.
You will like having this once it is set up. I used to spend an hour
every afternoon watering and now this has freed up my time..
I have it set on 6 day cycle and then hand water on Saturdays if
needed, and also add TTF on those days when needed. My timer
also has a button to hold down for 3 seconds to suspend all watering.
I pushed that about 4 days ago due to all the recent rain and once
I am ready to resume just hold down for 3 seconds and it will resume
the program. Good luck.

[oakley]

Great use of your front space.

Once you have it figured out you will love it. I'm no help, just support for what they
provide. Knowing your efforts are watered. Enough to tend to otherwise.

Going out to check on things at your leisure with a cup of tea....

I need to get set up with some new containers and i have a cracked filter, etc.
I have a timer and two hand dial timers that just give a set time when needed. Lots of
rain this time of year so i've just used the hand dial spun to 30 min just once so far.
I use the pre-set timer for out of town.

I started with a kit years ago and then added on. What is a preferred on-line ordering
provider for a couple new filters?
I think i used DripWorks but must be many others now...

[Worth1]

Oakley I use Sprinkler warehouse for all of my irrigation needs.
They are out of Houston.
Worth

[imp]

Originally Posted by garyjr

Most of the back flow preventers, pressure reducers,
and filters are not meant to be under constant pressure.
So normally you would have your y then your timer.
I have a single timer so it is installed in this order:
Y, timer, BFP, Filter, fertigation (if I had it), pressure reducer, female
hose thread, then your 1/2" supply.. I would check with the
supplier and see if they have a pressure reducer designed to be
under constant pressure. If so then you would have y, pressure
reducer, bfp, filter, fertigation, 4 zone valve, supply lines.
You will like having this once it is set up. I used to spend an hour
every afternoon watering and now this has freed up my time..
I have it set on 6 day cycle and then hand water on Saturdays if
needed, and also add TTF on those days when needed. My timer
also has a button to hold down for 3 seconds to suspend all watering.
I pushed that about 4 days ago due to all the recent rain and once
I am ready to resume just hold down for 3 seconds and it will resume
the program. Good luck.

Thank you, will try to find out about the constant pressure thing.

Originally Posted by oakley

Great use of your front space.

Once you have it figured out you will love it. I'm no help, just support for what they
provide. Knowing your efforts are watered. Enough to tend to otherwise.

Going out to check on things at your leisure with a cup of tea....

I need to get set up with some new containers and i have a cracked filter, etc.
I have a timer and two hand dial timers that just give a set time when needed. Lots of
rain this time of year so i've just used the hand dial spun to 30 min just once so far.
I use the pre-set timer for out of town.

I started with a kit years ago and then added on. What is a preferred on-line ordering
provider for a couple new filters?
I think i used DripWorks but must be many others now...

Amazon has been the best prices I can find so far for many parts except the ez coupler thing on Dripworks site.

[zeuspaul]

I like Drip Depot because they carry the Perma-Loc fittings. These fittings are easier than most to install and they can be removed much easier than most. Also free shipping for $49 orders, most others are higher than that.

If you are using city water you most likely don't need a filter. Also I would skip the pressure reducer if you use the Drip Depot dripline which is rated to 50 psi. Even if your pressure is higher than that it will be reduced because the drip system is not a closed system. The dripline is pressure compensating for even flow at the built in emitter.

Start with your timer and fertilizer injector. Then a Perma-Loc 1/2 x 3/4 garden hose adapter or whatever is needed to mate with your timer/injector.
https://www.dripdepot.com/product/pe...swivel-adapter

Then some mainline to get you to your tomato plants.
https://www.dripdepot.com/item/polye...length-50-feet

Then a 1/2 x 1/2 coupler
https://www.dripdepot.com/item/perma...size-half-inch

Then 1/2 Dripline.
https://www.dripdepot.com/item/half-...ength-100-feet

Then a 1/2 male pipe thread adapter to end the run
https://www.dripdepot.com/item/perma...size-half-inch You will need a 1/2 inch pvc threaded cap available at your local home improvement center to thread on the adapter to seal the system.

Caution: 1/2 inch is nominal. There are small variations in size depending on where you buy. The links I provided are for matching 1/2 inch sizes.

[imp]

Originally Posted by zeuspaul

I like Drip Depot because they carry the Perma-Loc fittings. These fittings are easier than most to install and they can be removed much easier than most. Also free shipping for $49 orders, most others are higher than that.

If you are using city water you most likely don't need a filter. Also I would skip the pressure reducer if you use the Drip Depot dripline which is rated to 50 psi. Even if your pressure is higher than that it will be reduced because the drip system is not a closed system. The dripline is pressure compensating for even flow at the built in emitter.

Start with your timer and fertilizer injector. Then a Perma-Loc 1/2 x 3/4 garden hose adapter or whatever is needed to mate with your timer/injector.
https://www.dripdepot.com/product/pe...swivel-adapter

Then some mainline to get you to your tomato plants.
https://www.dripdepot.com/item/polye...length-50-feet

Then a 1/2 x 1/2 coupler
https://www.dripdepot.com/item/perma...size-half-inch

Then 1/2 Dripline.
https://www.dripdepot.com/item/half-...ength-100-feet

Then a 1/2 male pipe thread adapter to end the run
https://www.dripdepot.com/item/perma...size-half-inch You will need a 1/2 inch pvc threaded cap available at your local home improvement center to thread on the adapter to seal the system.

Caution: 1/2 inch is nominal. There are small variations in size depending on where you buy. The links I provided are for matching 1/2 inch sizes.

Thank you very much, that will help. I said ez couplers but meant the perma lock ones which appear to be easier and better to use, even with old hands. <smile>

Now I just have to figure out the thing with constant pressures.

[Worth1]

I dont understand the comment about the constant pressure thing.

My main filter and back flow preventer are under constant pressure.
After that is a master valve.
Pressure reducing valves are under constant pressure I just dont have one.
I use solenoid valves with flow control to regulate the water going to the drip lines.
Before those solenoid valves I have 200 mesh filters.
But we are talking apple and oranges.

Here is a pictuer of a typical faucet type drip assembly.


Next what does mesh on a filter mean?
It means the amount of holes in the filter per square inch.
The higher the number the smaller the mesh in other words the better the filter.
These filters I use I think are rated for 120 PSI.

Next lets talk hose and pipe threads.
A hose bib thread is 3/4 inch outside diameter 11 1/2 treads per inch, not tapered.
They are known as garden hose threads or GHT.
A 3/4 pipe thread is 14 threads per inch tapered.
Tapered means the end of the pipe where the treads are cut are at a taper.
This allows the threads to get tighter as the pipe is screwed on.
That taper is 3/4 of an inch per foot.
All pipe of this type of all sises have this same standard for taper.
They are known as national pipe threads or NPT.

This is why you cant screw on a garden hose to 3/4 NPT male or female fitting.
You will need what they call a NPT to GHT adapter.

This last bit of information I gave has caused more confusion at the store than any other thing.
People staring baffled as to what to look for to get two things connected.

It is also one of the things I use my lathe for to cut these wild adapter threads I cant buy at the store.

Next plastic over brass.
If you can use brass were practical.
Pre filters should always go on the connection at the hose bib.
Nothing but a screen with a washer around it.
This will protect the timer and most come with it anyway.

Not all timers are alike.
You wont realize this until you start messing with it.
What you want is one with the most on and off cycles you can get for a 24 hour period.

How does the battery operated timer work?
It sends an electric pulse to the toggle valve to turn it on and off.
Pulse on pulse off.

Operating pressure you need to look out for.
Some of this stuff like the DIG timer is only rated for 60 PSI.

My two Orbit timers I dont use anymore are rated for 100 PSI.
One is a single and the other is a double.

It gets a little confusing programming the multi station timers.
You have to be looking at the station number each time you change something to make sure you are on the right one.
Next the pictures of typical assembly.
That is all it is typical and a way to get you to buy more stuff than you need.
And for the most part low end junk.


Let think about a multi station set up.
To look at it you would need filters regulators and so on for each timer station.
This is total BS.
As long as your products have an operating pressure rating higher than your static water pressure you can put all of it before the timers.
By spending a little more this way you will spend way less buying more than you need.
You just need to support the stuff so it doesn't snap off.

Even if your water pressure is sky high all you need to do is put the regulator rated for that pressure first thing and then put the rest of the stuff after it before or after the timer.

Water hammer.

This is something you need to consider big time.
It will destroy your system if not controlled.
It is caused by velocity not pressure.
Add both velocity and pressure and you have even more problems.
Even many lawn irrigation experts dont understand it and for the most part taught wrong.
When you open a valve and water starts racing to the end of the pipe and hits the end you have many pounds of hydraulic load coming to a sudden stop.
Lets say you have 100 pounds of water in a pipe moving at 14 feet per second slamming into a wall all at once.
That is a lot of foot pounds of energy.
I have seen whole city water lines come up out of the ground because someone slammed a main valve open or closed too fast.
What I did with my drip system is make an air chamber to stop this water hammer.
I will show a picture of it in the next post.

Worth

[Worth1]

Here is the anti water hammer device I made.
When the water shuts off the vertical pipe drains out.
When it comes on an air pocket is in it.
This air pocket works as an air cushion stopping hydraulic water hammer and the pressure slowly builds up.
I installed a hose bib that I turn on with remote control to water other stuff.
When I am finished I set the hose down on a bush and let the time run out.
Then I just go shut the valve off when I want.
The manual start stop time is adjustable from one minute to hours.
Worth
IMG_20170527_42556.jpg

[Worth1]

Imp have you decided on anything?
Worth

[decherdt]

What to do with it all in Winter and getting enough "drip" were issues for me, have gone for simplicity and a little more volume and gpm recently. Not sure why I was surprised that an older soaker would blow out without a regulator. I can add backflow preventer with filter and injector if I get tired of hand mixing soluble ferts

[Worth1]

Originally Posted by decherdt

What to do with itt all in Winter and getting enough "drip" were issues for me, have gone for simplicity and a little more volume and gpm recently. Not sure why I was surprised that an older soaker would blow out without a regulator. I can add backflow preventer with filter and injector if I get tired of hand mixing soluble ferts

Soaker hoses come with an orifice they are there for a reason.
They keep the flow of water down so the pressure doesn't build up and blow the hose.

If you have to enough emitters so the gpm keeps the pressure down you don't need a regulator.
Same with the hoses it you have enough in line you don't need the orifice.
There are many ways to cut back flow pressure without a regulator.
A regulator comes into it's own with static pressure.
Worth

[Worth1]

All of my drip lines are pressure controlled with flow control solenoid valves.
Worth