Cloning?

[GrowingCoastal]

Well, I did something I'd bet everyone here would say NOT to do, including me. Three seedling toms got damped off after transplant and watering. I pinched off the tops of those three and put them back into a corner of their 2.5" pots thinking 'this is stupid' as I did so, but do it I did! This week they have perked right up and appear to be growing on their hot mat under lights.

This is not advice for anyone to follow, just a demo of how much plants try to grow. Tough little survivors under adverse conditions.

[Groundhog]

I'm constantly amazed at what a person can learn on this forum. Last year I found Carolyn's method of waking up old seeds, which BTW, worked great. (Thanks Carolyn). This year I hear about cloning tomatoes. This old dog is learning all sorts of new tricks

Is it safe to assume that this can also be used to duplicate hybrid varieties ?

[sirtanon]

Originally Posted by Groundhog

I'm constantly amazed at what a person can learn on this forum. Last year I found Carolyn's method of waking up old seeds, which BTW, worked great. (Thanks Carolyn). This year I hear about cloning tomatoes. This old dog is learning all sorts of new tricks

Is it safe to assume that this can also be used to duplicate hybrid varieties ?

Absolutely, it's a great way to duplicate a hybrid tomato plant. I've done it in the past. Buy 1 hybrid plant from Lowe's, plant it and wait for it to grow, then start cutting suckers off of it and plant them elsewhere. It's also a good way to extend hybrid seeds, if you have a long enough growing season. Start 1 from seed, then take cuttings and grow those.

[SueCT]

I haven't propagated anything in years, but when I did, I always found they did better being stuck directly into soil, preferably with a little rooting hormone. When I tried to start in water everything grew root pretty readily but would then wilt severely when transplanted into soil. They seemed to go through a kind of transplant shock and sometimes didn't make it at all.

I prefer propagation, which is the term that has been used for this for as long as I have been alive, although I suppose the word clone is more attention getting. Makes it sound much more scientifically complicated than sticking a cutting in water or soil, lol.

[Worth1]

Here is what I do when I do it.
I put soil (what ever soil) in a container without holes.
It is like a muddy soup so to speak.
Then when the plant puts out roots I put a drain hole in the bottom and let out the excess water and go from there.
Works for me big time no shock what so ever.

[jillian]

I've also tried both methods; rooting in soil seems, at least to me to be a bit quicker and produces a stronger plant.

[carolyn137]

Originally Posted by sirtanon

I hope you don't take what I said as disagreement to what you said about cloning them in a growing medium. I understand the benefit of starting them out that way instead of in water, and I always appreciate your wisdom and knowledge.

Heck, you have been very influential in my tomato growing since I reached adulthood.

However, here in phoenix, where it is typically very dry and frequently hot (today hit 92 degrees F), I have found that cuttings/clones of tomato plants tend to have a better chance of survival if I start them in water. It can be tricky to keep plants in a growing medium moist enough here.. unless I watch them like a hawk. It's generally just easier to put them in water with just a smidgen of MG, and then once the roots get about 1" or longer, carefully move them to mix/soil and use a mist sprayer to keep them from drying out for the first 24 hours or so.

It also helps with space management - I can just cut them all, tag them with string and then put them all into one vase/bowl.

Not a problem at all with your disagreement comment.

All anyone can do is to make suggestions and I've never seen anyone here TELL someone what they MUST do.

Carolyn

[carolyn137]

Originally Posted by sirtanon

Absolutely, it's a great way to duplicate a hybrid tomato plant. I've done it in the past. Buy 1 hybrid plant from Lowe's, plant it and wait for it to grow, then start cutting suckers off of it and plant them elsewhere. It's also a good way to extend hybrid seeds, if you have a long enough growing season. Start 1 from seed, then take cuttings and grow those.

Please allow me to add to your post above,thank you.

What you are talking about is dehybridizing an F1 variety. I've tried to dehybridize several F!'s and here's the problem.

If the original F1 had just two parents, and that was true for Better Boy and Big Boy and Ramapo, etc.,many of the eariest F1's, that might work, as it did with me for Ramapo.

But most F1's now have several parents and for those it does not work.I can go into this more when I have time if you want me too,or try to find that post I've made several times about how modern F1 hybrids are constructed.

Carolyn

[Groundhog]

Originally Posted by carolyn137

Please allow me to add to your post above,thank you.

What you are talking about is dehybridizing an F1 variety. I've tried to dehybridize several F!'s and here's the problem.

If the original F1 had just two parents, and that was true for Better Boy and Big Boy and Ramapo, etc.,many of the eariest F1's, that might work, as it did with me for Ramapo.

But most F1's now have several parents and for those it does not work.I can go into this more when I have time if you want me too,or try to find that post I've made several times about how modern F1 hybrids are constructed.

Carolyn

Just when I thought I was starting to understand this cloning thing, you threw me a curve. How is a novice like myself go about finding out how many parents a tomato has?

Right now, my interests are dealing with the Sweet/ Super sweet 100s and this new "Fried Green Tomato" but is there a method of determining the number of parents a variety has? Sounds weird to me but it is a serious question.

[MrBig46]

I use cloning only to keep the hybrid varieties (the other seeds of which are unavailable to me) tomatoes over the winter. In autumn I take the sucker (G1) from the plant. I put it in a crucible, pour the substrate with water and I cover it with a glass. During the winter I breed three to four generations of tomatoes.
Vladimír

[sirtanon]

Originally Posted by carolyn137

Please allow me to add to your post above,thank you.

What you are talking about is dehybridizing an F1 variety. I've tried to dehybridize several F!'s and here's the problem.

If the original F1 had just two parents, and that was true for Better Boy and Big Boy and Ramapo, etc.,many of the eariest F1's, that might work, as it did with me for Ramapo.

But most F1's now have several parents and for those it does not work.I can go into this more when I have time if you want me too,or try to find that post I've made several times about how modern F1 hybrids are constructed.

Carolyn

Sorry, I think my wording might have been misleading. I understand how dehybridizing/stabilizing works.. but I was referring to something different.

I wasn't talking about saving seeds from the clones/cuttings, I was just saying that if you only had a few of a particular hybrid seed (let's say 5), and wanted to plant out 5 plants, rather than plant all 5 seeds to get 5 plants, you just plant 1 seed, then as it grows, take some cuttings and propagate those until you have 5 plants (1 from seed, and 4 from the propagated suckers). This way, you've got 5 identical hybrid plants growing, and you still have 4 seeds left, so you can plant again next season.

Doing it this way, you could grow 5 plants each for 5 separate seasons. Heck, if they were good enough ( and lucky enough ), a person could even save a cutting from 1 plant and carry it over until the next season and start again.

[slugworth]

my clones are now big enough to clone again