Grape Arbors and Grapes.

[Rajun Gardener]

I hope they make it.

I'm planning on getting some grape plants this spring, still undecided what type. I want something that will be good for jelly and wine.

[Worth1]

Originally Posted by Rajun Gardener

I hope they make it.

I'm planning on getting some grape plants this spring, still undecided what type. I want something that will be good for jelly and wine.

Then your best bet is what they call slip skin grapes and seeded grapes.

[bower]

I need advice about grape pruning, so I hope someone sees this thread who has experience with it.


Last summer I potted up my Swensons grape into a 7 gallon pot. It didn't produce any grapes but it grew 20 ft in one direction (with a big bend at 14 ft or so when it hit the greenhouse wall) and the second branch went up around the rafters. So it definitely needs pruning but I don't know how much to cut. Would be nice to have grapes this summer, too!

[oakley]

I'm a horrid teacher but I do grow grapes. Planted 3 back when computers cost a
hundred grand. So I have a pruning book, old school,
A concord and 2 wine grapes.

A few excellent videos and many worthless ones. Might take the 'few' to get the info you
need that suits what you eventually want...climbing trellis or controlled tame like I have.
It might take 3-4 years to get fruit but so worth it.

I freeze the young leaves in food saver packages of 10, for pickles and kraut, (supposedly the
tannins help them crisp). Dolmas and a good wrap for fish fillets. I make a nice big vat of vinegar
every fall.
I need to study up on cuttings. Would love to have more Concords.

[bower]

Thanks Oakley! I did watch a couple of videos.. The vinyard grape is pruned very small and produces a limited amount of grapes - but they have thousands of vines, rooted a few feet apart. Then I watched a backyard grape pruning video that was not so severe. Went down and made some preliminary cuts, at least.

I understand that fruit will be only on second year wood, so I may have to wait another year.


My friend is really handy with the cuttings! She brought me a Concord this fall, with instructions to plant it outdoors. Hardier than I would have thought.

[Worth1]

If you make cuttings make sure to root them in the direction they were growing or they wont make it.
I had one truss this year and the critters got it.

[oakley]

Good news Bower about the Concord. I'll try and propagate some cuttings from that one.
Pretty sure I tried and failed years ago.

I don't prune as severe as the grape growers but do learn the reasons/why/how from
them. Getting off unnecessary foliage so the clusters get the sun they need.

[clkeiper]

We grow 3 rows of grapes and I have left the pruning to my father in law until the past several years. now he is 90 and has dementia but he still wants to do it. its a disaster but I figure it isn't gong to impact the rest of my life once he is gone. I let him fiddle out there but he doesn't cut off nearly enough usually. So, we go behind later and finish it up. We have concords and a few seedless and we treat them all the same way. we try to leave 4-6 buds on 4 limbs on the grape vine. it looks HORRIBLE when we are done BUT it works. otherwise there is too much plant to support and the grapes aren't nearly as nice. You will be removing 85-90% of the vines when you prune. we might prune to severely for some people but it works for us. here is a clear guid from Ohio state U Extension office.
https://ohioline.osu.edu/factsheet/HYG-1428

[bower]

Thanks Carolynk, that's a good one.


Here are some videos I thought were helpful:
This one is all diagrams and that makes it easy to see what you're getting at. (Reality is always more tangly). It describes and shows the different systems of grape pruning really well.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kf_M_RVWpC0


Then the question is, which system will be best for me?
The four armed kniffen, and umbrella kniffen are recommended for cool climate, in Maine.
He mentions concord, and also labrusca.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nkJHaZSS5eQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0-XQ_ukRMFA


"Cane pruning" is the same as umbrella or "two armed" kniffen, in these videos from Oregon State.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pCs03Mc2HKM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mfd2V5DFDo0
And last not least, the cordon style pruning.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=um9p1eiGiwI


Cane pruning or kniffen looks easiest to do outdoors - I mean for making one or two cuts just to drag away the whole fruiting vine from the previous year... it is less pruning.

Where the cordon style, you have more of a defined shape that gets heavier each year while small stuff is pruned off. That might work better for the greenhouse. Less of a frost risk in the greenhouse too I suppose (although it is not heated).

I'm thinking that the risk of cordon outdoors in the north, is of losing a whole 'arm' in a bad season?

[bower]

We had several sunny days this week, the greenhouse got HOT which means the sun is above the treeline again, and the grapevine and other perennials suddenly have swollen buds ready to pop! So now is the time for a "final" pruning. (I followed the advice for northerners, to do 'preliminary' pruning in winter but wait for early spring for the final cull, in case you lose some due to winter damage.)
I was going to ask, why do they mostly prune back to just 10 buds each on 2 arms. Then I re-read what you said CarolynK - exactly what I needed to know.

One of the 'arms' is much healthier, sturdier and more vigorous than the other, but now that spring is near I see they both have buds (and more than ten). I guess I'll let each keep ten buds and see what happens.

[Tormato]

Do you get much sap running on the second pruning? This thread reminds me that I haven't pruned my grapes for three years. They're in an area about 15' X 15' that is overgrown with blackberry, black raspberry and raspberry brambles. They finally grew out of that area into and through my lilacs, and into the street.
I REALLLLLY need to prune this year.