DANIEL BURSON 2016

[carolyn137]

Originally Posted by kath

Daniels is a potato-leaved variety; Indian Stripe is the regular leaf parent. Btw, all the seeds you sent to me were PL. I started later than normal this year but so far so good.

kath

Correct, and DB is a stable variety,so where do the occasional RL plants come from and that's little more complicated.

Let P=PL, let p= RL

PP is homozygous, dominant and PL
Pp is heterozygous and PL since P is dominant
pp is homozygous recessive and RL

No crossing is needed,rather, a single spontaneous mutation in the seed DNA and it does happen. Such single spontaneous mutations are permanent and heritable

Take Cherokee Purple as an example.

CP is RL,and there are three versions that are PL

Spudakee
Cherokee Purple Potato Leaf
Whoops,I forgot the 3rd one,not a problem.

There are those who have grown out CP and the three PL versions at the same time in the same summer,and all do NOT agree that the PL versions are the same as the original RL except for leaf form.

Take Kellogg's Breakfast,KB, the PL version is KBX, found by Martha Hufford,and almost all agree that they are the same except for leaf form.

Take Indian Stripe,RL, and the PL version ISPL,almost all agree that the only difference is leaf form.

What a single spontaneous mutations in seeds can do is to cause problems in the sequencing of the DNA and cause what are called inversions,repeats,looping out,etc.,and if leaf form alleles are affected,it can then change the phenotpe,what the leaf form looks like,to a different phenotype.

Single spontaneous mutations are also heritable. So anyone with a DB RL who saves seeds should get all RL plants as long as there's been no crossing..

The chances of going from PL to RL are low , thus few RL's for a variety that is PL, but it can and does happen.

I hope that helps,

Carolyn

[carolyn137]

I goofed, was in a hurry waiting for the RN to come and draw blood.

I first posted

Let P=PL, let p= RL

PP is homozygous, dominant and PL
Pp is heterozygous and PL since P is dominant
pp is homozygous recessive and RL


It should be

Let P= RL, Let p =PL

PP is homozygous dominant and RL
Pp is heterzygous,and is RL since RL is dominant to PL
pp is homozygous recessive and is PL

Sorry about that and everything follows as I posted above.

For those who remember their chi square setups from HS you can do that as well,but that would refer only to possible crosses and we're not dealing with crosses,we're dealing with spontaneous mutations of seed DNA.

Carolyn

[mrdoitall]

Thank you Carolyn, you just answered many of my questions I was thinking about asking. So now we have a PL and a RL variety of DB. I'm going to start some RL seed in the next 2 weeks and see if they're all RL. I don't have the season to grow them out all the way.

[Rockandrollin]

Seeds started 2/26/16. All are potato leaf. 3/6 germination (USPS was not gentle).

4/3/16 planted out one and it is now in a 35" x 4.5' cage. Pictured below, getting a couple ripening. Quite a few tomatoes on this plant. Also planted a Gary O'Sena and a Pink Berkeley Tye Dye that day. All ripening tomatoes within a week of each other. April 3 plant out is abnormally early for me.

4/23/16 planted out 2 more in 25" x 9' cages. These 2 haven't set very many tomatoes yet.

All are healthy

[Labradors2]

What the heck are those cages? They look MASSIVE? Maybe it's an optical illusion, but the ones in the middle look taller than the houses

Linda

[Rockandrollin]

Originally Posted by Labradors2

What the heck are those cages? They look MASSIVE? Maybe it's an optical illusion, but the ones in the middle look taller than the houses

Linda

Well I do have a neighbor kid named Jack........

They are big cages and the camera angle makes them look bigger. They are 25" diameter concrete reinforcing wire cages stacked 2 high.

[MissS]

Rockandrollin you have a lovely garden. Your plants look great. I see no disease issues at all and some beautiful fruit. Have you had any disease problems with any other tomatoes this year or are they all so healthy and robust? Let us know what you think of the taste and how they compare to your other plants.

I too like your cages, but 9' is overkill for Daniel Burson. This one stays nice and bushy.

Thanks for sharing!

[BigVanVader]

Picked 2 DB Monday. One was small and the other big. Unfortunately the big one is screwed up on the bottom. Mine all have very deformed bottoms. Likely environmental because the Chocolate Stripes planted the same day are doing the same thing.

[travis]

Originally Posted by mrdoitall

Thank you Carolyn, you just answered many of my questions I was thinking about asking. So now we have a PL and a RL variety of DB. I'm going to start some RL seed in the next 2 weeks and see if they're all RL. I don't have the season to grow them out all the way.

No, there is no regular leaf (RL) Daniel Burson tomato variety. There is only a potato leaf Daniel Burson. Anything RL is something other than Daniel Burson. Please do not distribute or grow seeds from a regular leaf plant under or assigned the name "Daniel Burson."

Thank you, Bill Jeffers

[bjbebs]

This plant has upwards of 50 tomatoes on it. Several are in the 12-16 oz. range.

I've watered about 4 times since plant out. After a very hot and dry June it keeps setting fruit.

This plant is a bush. It would probably top out around 6 feet. I'm supporting it outward as it grows due to the heavy load it's carrying.

Ate one tomato from another plant a couple weeks ago, but will wait for more production before reporting on taste.

[carolyn137]

Originally Posted by travis

No, there is no regular leaf (RL) Daniel Burson tomato variety. There is only a potato leaf Daniel Burson. Anything RL is something other than Daniel Burson. Please do not distribute or grow seeds from a regular leaf plant under or assigned the name "Daniel Burson."

Thank you, Bill Jeffers

Correct X 10.!!!!!!!!!!!

Please see my posts I think 226 or 7 or 8 ,trying to explain HOW an RL can arise, usually by a spontaneous seed DNA mutation and I discussed the mechanisms that could be involved from looping out,inversions,repeats,etc., trying to explain why some got RL's from the DB seeds that Miss S distributed.

Carolyn

[MissS]

Originally Posted by BigVanVader

Picked 2 DB Monday. One was small and the other big. Unfortunately the big one is screwed up on the bottom. Mine all have very deformed bottoms. Likely environmental because the Chocolate Stripes planted the same day are doing the same thing.

I wonder if this is due to the heat. I remember Marsha stating that all of her Daniel Burson tomatoes had a "belly button" on them. Is what you are showing a "belly button"? My tomatoes last year did not display any belly buttons, they were just smooth all the way around. They were beautiful looking fruit.

[MissS]

Originally Posted by travis

No, there is no regular leaf (RL) Daniel Burson tomato variety. There is only a potato leaf Daniel Burson. Anything RL is something other than Daniel Burson. Please do not distribute or grow seeds from a regular leaf plant under or assigned the name "Daniel Burson."

Thank you, Bill Jeffers

I agree......... DB is a Purple potato leafed plant.

[MissS]

Originally Posted by bjbebs

This plant has upwards of 50 tomatoes on it. Several are in the 12-16 oz. range.

I've watered about 4 times since plant out. After a very hot and dry June it keeps setting fruit.

This plant is a bush. It would probably top out around 6 feet. I'm supporting it outward as it grows due to the heavy load it's carrying.

Ate one tomato from another plant a couple weeks ago, but will wait for more production before reporting on taste.

That is one very healthy looking tomato plant! My plants did top out at 6 feet last year and I found them to be very productive too.

Has anyone had any disease issues to report? I find it a bit strange that no one has mentioned any disease at all at this point.

[BigVanVader]

Originally Posted by MissS

I wonder if this is due to the heat. I remember Marsha stating that all of her Daniel Burson tomatoes had a "belly button" on them. Is what you are showing a "belly button"? My tomatoes last year did not display any belly buttons, they were just smooth all the way around. They were beautiful looking fruit.

Yeah, you could call it that, some of them are so deformed I have been culling them at small size. Heat is very likely part of the issue as they were planted a few weeks later than my first tomatoes. It is common for some heirloom varieties to have odd shapes/deformities in our extreme heat.