Member discussion regarding the methods, varieties and merits of growing tomatoes.
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#16 |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: SoCal Inland
Posts: 2,705
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"Side note: Has it ever been proven that Monsanto has paid people to counter post? If so, would like to see those facts as well. If not proven to be so, it is a way to discredit anyone with a differing viewpoint, and to close off a rational and calm discussion of facts."
After posting on any number of these disguised Monsanto sites and watching the specific pattern of response, which is way too quick vigorous, and unending, it is my opinion, based on my own "critical thinking" that these responders do not follow the pattern of typical facebook discussions. They do, however, follow their own pattern, which in itself is suspect. Anyone who doubts my experience is welcome to conduct their own research. Your milage may vary ![]() |
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#17 |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 3,825
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Bower, you're usually pretty level-handed. But imp describes certain studies as "discredited" and you find that "extremely offensive"??
What is this, a religion, with Seralini your god and/or prophet? Disagree all you want, but please avoid the common practice of making your disagreements personal.
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Stupidity got us into this mess. Why can't it get us out? - Will Rogers |
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#18 | |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Newfoundland, Canada
Posts: 6,794
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You have a lot of gall, telling me off for "making your disagreements personal" after the BS about prophet or god. Really. If you have something to add to the discussion, why don't you make it on topic. And avoid making slurs on me, while you're at it. |
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#19 |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Den of Drunken Fools
Posts: 38,539
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I'm just glad the Houston Astros won the Super Bowl.
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#20 |
BANNED FOR LIFE
Join Date: May 2014
Posts: 13,333
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#21 |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 3,825
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I'm sure the Dodgers find that offensive.
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Stupidity got us into this mess. Why can't it get us out? - Will Rogers |
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#22 |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Den of Drunken Fools
Posts: 38,539
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We can only hope they do.
I have waited all my life for the event. Worth |
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#23 | |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Wichita Falls, Texas
Posts: 4,832
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I certainly never wished to purport that I am the voice of reason, nor have the "final word", and especially "have some special expertise or dedicated your intellect to the subject in some way that makes you feel you have the best informed opinion."; if this was read this way, I regret any lack on my part on making it more clear that all I was trying for was civil discourse on a very polarized topic. I may well NOT have the best informed opinion, but I do have an opinion from reading the study long enough ago, when this subject erupted on the Food Politics board on iDig, and comparing several other studies with Serelini's study choices in protocols and procedures. That is where I find a lot of fault with Serelini's rat studies ( yes, wrong rat breed, different feeds and amounts, too small of control and study groups, are but 3 off the top of my head) and therefore his conclusions from the study. People are very polarized about Serelinni's studies. Note this is not the only study he has had retracted or trouble with his peers about his procedures and protocols in/with his studies, thereby calling his results into question. Since I think it will be pretty impossible to have and maintain a civil and within the rules discussion re Monsanto, etc., with out it veering into politics and also becoming very divisive instead of us all learning from each, I am going to drop it. I am not wishing normally to offend, hurt feelings nor be offended myself, which is something hard to do after all these years, <smile>, for an argument on a discussion board where I come to have fun and exchange ideas in a positive way. I don't have to be "right" nor am I many times, I just have to understand my own thoughts and seek self improvement for myself. Edit: Hopefully, we will all chat and things will be amicable on other subjects. After the above, wishing all a good evening and most pleasant night. Last edited by imp; November 3, 2017 at 06:55 PM. |
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#24 |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: virginia
Posts: 743
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Monsanto has an impeccable reputation and a storied history. They gave us PCBs. They gave us Dioxin. They gave us Agent Orange.
I think their most stunning accomplishment was that they gave us more than 50 EPA Superfund sites. After reading all about them I can honestly say that I totally trust them. https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2008/05/monsanto200805 |
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#25 |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Den of Drunken Fools
Posts: 38,539
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To be fair they didn't give us any of that stuff it already existed and many companies produced it or it is a chemical byproduct.
They didn't discover or invent any of them. When you read misleading stories it makes me question everything in it. As a matter of fact you dont manufacture buy agent orange you mix 2-4-D and 2-4-5-T at 50-50 to get it. 2-4-5 T is the culprit that causes problems and is not manufactured. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arthur_Galston |
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#26 |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: France
Posts: 554
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Some time ago I wrote in a post that as a guest on Tomatovile I would never interfere in threads that always become heated, which is the case with roundup. Unfortunately when I see that Bower, a highly respected lady on the site, has to bear unfair attacks I feel obliged to react but just by giving the European position.
Is roundup a noxious substance ? the point is no longer discussed, governments now try to find how long it can be used before being entirely banned. 4 years is the most severe length of time, 10 years more likely. Now roundup can only be sold to professional growers in France. A reminder : we all have molecules of roundup or its metabolites in our bodies, it doesn’t prove they are harmful, but it’s disquieting. I won’t go further in that field, just say that I’m struck by the lack of information of US population. I won’t post again here though I intend to follow the discussions on that thread. |
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#27 |
Tomatoville® Moderator
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: San Antonio, Texas
Posts: 4,386
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There is no way that consensus will happen on the Monsanto issue. However, the monitors here want you to know that some of the content in some of the posts here are offensive. If you want this thread to stay open, that has to stop. One more instance of rudeness, and the poster will be warned, or if serious enough, banned and the thread shut down.
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Michael |
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#28 |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Southeastern PA
Posts: 1,420
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Lots of strong opinions here and I admire that people have such opinions instead of being apathetic but you will never influence people by browbeating them or calling them names or calling their intelligence into question.
If you don't like Monsanto, don't use their products. I am an organic gardener and do not use chemicals in my garden. There are companies other than Monsanto that manufacture garden chemicals and I do not use them either. I am not knowledgeable about all of the studies pertaining to Monsanto's chemicals or GMO products. I just choose not to use such products in my garden and I do not wish to affect other animals or insects, especially bees, with the these chemicals either. I have enough chemical residue in my body just by breathing or eating supermarket and restaurant food so I try to avoid adding anything additional at home. |
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#29 |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Den of Drunken Fools
Posts: 38,539
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Somewhere in the vast internet I read where DOW has come up with a GMO for something I cant remember what it was oh it was soy seeds.
Instead of posting any links just Google DOW GMO and you can look for yourselves. My point is I feel Monsanto has became the scapegoat while the other culprits are running Scott free to do as they please more or less. The concept originally comes from Leviticus, in which a goat is designated to be cast into the desert with the sins of the community. Other ancient societies had similar practices. In psychology and sociology, the practice of selecting someone as a scapegoat has led to the concept of scapegoating. This practice goes on all the time in businesses the government and just about everywhere you look. People want to find someone to take the blame to take the heat off themselves. In this case I firmly believe it is Monsanto. It is a trick just like the magician does with the pretty girl on stage. Everyone is looking at her while he does what he needs to do without being caught. In other words Monsanto has became a distraction or only one poisonous snake out of many. As long as we keep blaming the rattlesnake for what the copperhead does we will never catch the copperhead and it will continue to run free. Glyphosate is made by many companies now not just Monsanto. Worth |
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#30 |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: SoCal Inland
Posts: 2,705
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"The concept originally comes from Leviticus, in which a goat is designated to be cast into the desert with the sins of the community. " Except the goat is innocent of any wrong doing. The same can hardly be said of Monsanto.
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