Which is better - small or large transplant?

[carolyn137]

Originally Posted by outsiders71

Carolyn:

I'm trying to understand your method. I've never transplanted from small cells to bigger cells, rather 16oz cups. So keeping the transplants in a smaller growing container prevents a fibrous root structure from forming? Is this only beneficial to tomatoes or peppers/eggplants as well? Thanks.

I'm don't transplant from small cells to larger ones.

I sow my seeds in Permanest pans with artificial mix or sometimes use a 20 row professional seed insert in a standard nursery tray and it's from the seed pans/rows in the trays that I transplant to the 2 inch cells and that's that.

Initially there would be a fibrous root structure that forms in the 2 inch cells but they would form roots that became rootbound. But if you continullay pot up from there you'd get a larger and larger fibrous root structure which is what I don't want.

Again, as I just shared with Joe, try different methods and use controls and those controls should be with the same tomato variety.

Some of the best research on the basics of growing tomatoes were done back in the 30's when that's all there was to be done b'c there was no molecular anything back then. Here's a link to an excellent article on root growth and structure that I think is very helpful. And note that tomato seeds direct planted, which few do, give rise to tap root structures, no fibrous root structures, and that's why we transplant young seedlings at least once, so that we get that fibrous root structure which is better for the plant in terms of increased surface root structures re uptake of water and nutrients.

I just prefer to grow to 6-9 inches in the small cells and plant out at that stage so that the new fibrous root structure forms in the soil where I want it, not in a pot, as I said above.

http://www.soilandhealth.org/01aglib...010137toc.html

Just scroll down to find the veggie/fruit you want to read about, tomatoes are near the end.

And yes, I transplant peppers and eggplant the same way I do tomatoes and for about the same reasons.

And I say I do this and I do that but to be clear, I don't raise anything myself any more after falling in Dec of 2004 b/c of two bad hips and severing all four quads in my right leg, which is rare. And despite two new hips one of the quads didn't return to function, which is why I have to use a walker now and all my gardening is done by Freda, who also does all the cleaning here as well. She's as stubborn as I am and many times wants to do things her way, not mine, but then I softly remind her that I'm the one paying her, which sometimes doesn't work either.

So I'm saying what I used to do and if I weren't in the walker would be doing the same every year.

[tam91]

I think I like Freda.

[SmartAlex]

I much prefer the smaller transplants. They catch up, and you run less of a risk of damaging them.

Last year I was waiting for my husband to finish my raised beds, and I ended up with two foot high tomato plants in gallon pots. What a hassle THAT was. I ended up breaking two of my favorite varieties off completely. But, do not despair. I planted the rootless, pathetic stems up to their necks and watered twice a day. Within the week, the "incredible edible undead tomato plants" decided to live. They were pot babies all summer, but each produced some fruit.

[b54red]

Instead of using those expensive 4 inch pots or 2 inch pots which will tend to fall over when the plants get larger, why not just use the cheap styrofoam coffee cups with a couple of holes punched in the bottom. I have never worried too much about the size of the transplants except during the hotter months of summer when they need to be larger and more hardened off than the ones planted in the spring. I prefer plants between 8 inches tall and about a foot but have used them up to 2 feet. The really tall ones require the trenching method which is a lot more trouble.

[SmartAlex]

Since you mentioned the trenching method... that worked just fine for me and I actually thought it was easier than what I had been doing. Of course, if your plants are less than 8 inches tall, everything is easy and the holes are shallow.

[b54red]

Why use the trenching method with 8 inch tall plants? I only use the trenching method when the seedlings are really tall, like over a foot at least.

[SmartAlex]

Xactly. That's why I like 'em.

[dice]

4-inch tall seedlings, 8-inch tall seedlings, and 12-inch tall
seedlings are usually all the same size plant by the first of July.

[rxkeith]

i go through the same thing some years.

i start my seeds around april 1st, and transplant about 3 weeks later. the beginning of may, they still aren't much to look at, and i wonder how the heck are they going to be big enough to plant out in another month.

you know what? they always are.
plant growth is fast once they recover from transplanting. i usually end up with a 6-8 inch plant once june rolls around. i use 4 inch pots, recycle yogurt cups, and have used empty egg beater cups that my parents would buy. they are about 2 x 2 inches in size. no one right way to do it.


keith

[cushman350]

Fact is, I was raised on what we call a truck farm here in the East with acres and acres of tomatoes, peppers, squash, eggplant, you name it and we grew it. And I started helping out when I was 5 yo riding atop the plant setter and the older I got the more I was expected to do.

Was it pulled and had a water tank in the back, two people sat on each side of the row almost on the ground and the setter broke open the farrow, watered the row and plant sets are held as the setter then closes the farrow and the plant is released from the persons hand. My brotherNlaw farmed in the 60s and used this equipment. Brings back memories of my arms itching in the squash fields.

[carolyn137]

Originally Posted by cushman350

Was it pulled and had a water tank in the back, two people sat on each side of the row almost on the ground and the setter broke open the farrow, watered the row and plant sets are held as the setter then closes the farrow and the plant is released from the persons hand. My brotherNlaw farmed in the 60s and used this equipment. Brings back memories of my arms itching in the squash fields.

THe first plant setter I knew had a large spoke that went around and had rubber clasps that you had to put the plant in so it wouldn'y fall put and as the spoke revolved the plant was set inground between two shoes that opened up the ground and squirt of water went into the ground opening at that same time. There was a seat on top of the water tank and that's where I sat and watched my mother and my Aunt Olive do all the work.

By the time I got a little older my father had bought the kind you describe where the two seats were very low to the ground and there were bins in front of each person and you took the plants and directly planted them inground.

And of course my father drove the tractor and sometimes he'd go too fast and we'd yell slow down b'c we couldn't keep up.

[tomakers]

I've never worried too much about the size of transplants. I move them once into newspaper pots, formed around a Campbell's Tomato soup can (a 1020 flat holds 24), and a few weeks later they are in the ground. They always seem to catch up.
If they are long then they get buried up to their necks. If they're short, they are easier to plant.
I figure it's the genes I'm after, not the size.
JMO,
Tom

[puttgirl]

Originally Posted by OneoftheEarls

there is a catch up factor...I had VOLUNTEERS catch up to by healthy nice transplants

I agree with that one-that's why I don't obsess too much about when to start anymore.

[pacmanJohn]

OP, you might replant into another seed starter mix. The link below shows my plants last year after 3 weeks. The plants on the left were in Miracle Grow Seed Starter and the ones on the right were in Jiffy Seed Starter. I've always had good luck with Jiffy until last year, but the proof is in the pic (for me anyway last year). I replanted these in Miracle Grow and they caught up fine. Just a thought. Also, make sure you don't over water them. I'd rather the soil go dry than get too much water.

[organichris]

I like to transplant 15 inch or so plants - not because its necessarily the best thing, but because I like to bury the plant as deep as possible, making a freaky root system. Plus the older plant will generally produce tomatoes faster, and generally there is a connection between age and size, assuming the plant isn't rootbound and stuck in neutral for several weeks.