A garden is only as good as the ground that it's planted in. Discussion forum for the many ways to improve the soil where we plant our gardens.
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#46 | |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 985
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Dutch, I am open to using cotton seed meal, etc. Do you just leave the leaves/grain on the top of the soil or do you work it in to the top few inches? If not do you have trouble with it blowing off? My garden is on top of a hill and it can get pretty windy at times. Great for drying leaves after a rain, but not so great for some other things. |
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#47 |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Pulaski County, Arkansas
Posts: 1,239
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Here is a list of soil amendments that I found interesting (copied online article). I haven't used most of these, but some information related to topic:
Plant-based fertilizers Fertilizers made from plants generally have low to moderate N-P-K (nitrogen, phosphorus, potassium) values, but their nutrients quickly become available in the soil for your plants to use. Some of them even provide an extra dose of trace minerals and micronutrients. If you don't find all of these at the garden center, check out your local feed store. The most commonly available plant-based fertilizers include the following:
Whether by land, by air, or by sea, animals, fish, and birds all provide organic fertilizers that can help plants grow. Most animal-based fertilizers provide lots of nitrogen, which plants need for leafy growth. The following are some of the most commonly available ones:
Rocks decompose slowly into soil, releasing minerals gradually over a period of years. Organic gardeners use many different minerals to increase the fertility of their soils, but it's a long-term proposition. Some take months or years to fully break down into nutrient forms that plants can use, so one application may last a long time.
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#48 |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: S.E. Wisconsin Zone 5b
Posts: 1,831
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Hi Chris,
I was thinking about using cracked corn which is relatively inexpensive here in Wisconsin. Blain's Farm and Fleet has 50 pound bags for $7.29. Today they have a 10% off sale so it would be $6.56 a bag. http://www.farmandfleet.com/products...cked-corn.html I have not used anything like this yet, and at like point the cause and affect are still speculative. I would definitely work cracked corn into the soil or it may become a calling card for rodents. I would think the microbes in the soil would love it. Feed the soil and let the soil feed the plants. Dutch
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"Discretion is the better part of valor" Charles Churchill The intuitive mind is a gift, and the rational mind is a faithful servant. But we have created a society that honors the servant and has forgotten the gift. (paraphrased) Albert Einstein I come from a long line of sod busters, spanning back several centuries. Last edited by Dutch; February 29, 2016 at 10:10 AM. |
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#49 |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: S.E. Wisconsin Zone 5b
Posts: 1,831
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Thanks "My Foot Smells", your post contained some very good info!
"Corn gluten meal: Derived from corn, this powder contains 10 percent nitrogen fertilizer. Apply it only to actively growing plants because it inhibits the growth of seeds. The manufacturer recommends allowing 1 to 4 months after using this product before planting seeds, depending on the soil and weather conditions. Use it on lawns in early spring to green up the grass and prevent annual weed seeds from sprouting." Chris, It looks like corm meal may works as a pre-emergent and can inhibit seeds from germinating. This would affect both vegetable and weed seeds. This shouldn't affect seedlings as tomatoes and peppers. Other crops that already have already germinated like garlic, shallots and onion sets I would think would be fine too. Dutch
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"Discretion is the better part of valor" Charles Churchill The intuitive mind is a gift, and the rational mind is a faithful servant. But we have created a society that honors the servant and has forgotten the gift. (paraphrased) Albert Einstein I come from a long line of sod busters, spanning back several centuries. |
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#50 |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Zone 8a
Posts: 64
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If you want to do more research on plant based fertilizers, look up things that fall under the category of dynamic accumulators. Things such as stinging nettle, clover, comfrey, dandelion, hairy vetch, horsetail, yarrow, etc.
Dynamic accumulators in con★★★★★★★★ with a product like EM-1 (lactic acid producing bacteria) are great for making your own liquid fertilizers. Such things are amazing for foliar feeding to offset a deficiency in the soil. This is generally referred to as a fermented plant extract. Dynamic accumulators also make the best no-till cover crops. Due to the nature of their deep rooting systems they sequester nutrients far below the standard plowing depth and return them back to the soil surface when cut for decomposition. Within such plants are also plants considered hyperaccumulators that amazing for leaching heavy metals out of soil and therefore essential for bio-remediation or the transitional phases between converting from a chemical fed garden to an organic garden during fallow seasons. A more correct botanical term for such behavior is phytoaccumulation. |
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#51 |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 985
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Great information...thank you all! Dutch, I have used the corn gluten meal as a weed inhibitor. Got the idea from Dixondale Farms when I first started planting their onions. Works pretty good and found it at a small store near here. Pretty reasonable if I remember correctly.
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#52 | |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Pewaukee, Wisconsin
Posts: 3,148
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My brother is a lawn nut and he used cracked corn spread on his grass 2 years ago. The lawn was spectacular. It was very lush and green. However, he had a terrible rodent problem. So as Dutch has said, work it into the soil.
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~ Patti ~ |
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#53 |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Pulaski County, Arkansas
Posts: 1,239
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[QUOTE= Things such as stinging nettle, comfrey
[/QUOTE] Bringing back to the farm. Stinging nettle down by the slew. I cut comfrey to feed the young turkeys. Slept on an iron rail bed on the front porch and ole' ferrel berry honk is horn to go run limb limbs at 0500 and then come back and sip wild turkey w/ peach snapps out of an cork bottle................. missouri ozarks |
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#54 |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: MS
Posts: 211
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Fascinating thread, and I thank everyone for their comments because it gives me lots to think about. MFS, I am in the process of putting in raised beds similar to yours, except they are 18" tall. The beds have been built and are in place. Now I am trying to make an educated decision on what to fill them with. Options of materials include topsoil from my local co-op. They tell me the topsoil is from w. Alabama. I used quite a bit of it for my flowerbeds that I put in during February. Based on its color, I suspect it may be black prairie soil. I also have a large pile of hardwood wood chips for mulching and pathways, and pine straw. Oak leaves are rather scarce right now. I'm sure the co-op also has compost available in bulk, but I haven't asked yet. Suggestions on ratios and materials to use?
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#55 |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Pulaski County, Arkansas
Posts: 1,239
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kchd, I'm not really an expert, but I can tell you what I used. I have a whoiesale supplier and a 3 axle dump truck driver (think 18 ton) that I use. the mix was a 70/30 compost/green sand. I also used some perlite that I can get for free.
my experience with a straight top soil is that it held too much water and I had problem with fungus and disease. too heavy without a mixer. the sand helps with the drainage, but holds just enough moisture. topsoil does well outside of the box though, but in the box got thick. some places do a 60/40 mix of like matters. I also live across from a horse farm that I can get aged manure, but the ants love the stuff too and have had problems w/ the ★★★★ ants nesting in my pile. in subsequent years, I have either added another heaping of the "supersoil" mix, or just a 4" layer of compost, as the bed shrinks down in existing soil, or decomposes further. I can trailer small loads. I live by a river and live on top of modeling clay. Certain bulbs do ok, but looks like topography of Minnesota after a rain (land of lakes). holds water like a bucket. Thus the RB, which has done well. I've got 11.5", 18", and 22" beds throughout. the higher bed saves my back, but can't vouch it is more ethical than the 18". the shorty I don't plant deep species. Str8 compost may be too "hot" the first year, and it might make a difference to what your native soil composition is. Seems like there would be some kind of silty-compost mix in your area. Mississippi (like Arkansas) can get some heavy, heavy periods of rain in the spring; so I would rather have drainage that something that will take 2 months to sunday to dry out. I usally run some leaky hose on top of bed, so I can drink a beer & water at the same time. LY, I didn't whip out the hose almost until June - got so much water. Once again, this is just an opinion. Last edited by My Foot Smells; March 29, 2016 at 06:06 PM. |
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#56 |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Pulaski County, Arkansas
Posts: 1,239
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In addition, I also have two compost bins that I use. Often like to dump those on the bottom of new bed or mix. Always think composting is a good habit.
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#57 | |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Norway
Posts: 1,049
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Steve |
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#58 |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Mid-Atlantic right on the line of Zone 7a and 7b
Posts: 1,369
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#59 |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Pulaski County, Arkansas
Posts: 1,239
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maybe one more thing to add regarding dirt in a box:
I am of the impression that the soil should not form a dirtball when you try and compact, unlike a snowball. Also, I am on flat land, flood plain. So have no water run off attall. May make difference if you have slope and rocky underlayment. When I think of "topsoil," I envision brown dirt. However, do realize that topsoil has become a rather large spectrum nowadays. The prairie dirt sounds applicable - like it would pass the snowball test. Just a refresh here, as it is hard to say without "being there." Certainly wise to do some research before you have a 30 ton mountain of the wrong stuff. I live on tributary to Ark. River, but the "big" river is just a couple miles over yonder. The dirt on the big river plain is a silty dark soil, sometimes muddy - but not clay. My place is like gumbo mud, you can't drive a nail in the summer and will get buried to your axle in the spring. So........ even a country mile, you can have totally different scene. Most landscape material places will carry the approp mix, and/or will have knowledge of options in your area and more than glad to assist. I know several landscapers and even get their discount on anything (15% up to 50% off direct order of plants and shrubs). In closing, it would be impossible for anyone on forum to give you the best advice (imo). One of those have to be there things, as many factors. |
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#60 | |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Pulaski County, Arkansas
Posts: 1,239
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