Most Attractive To Bumblebees?

[noinwi]

They are dark, but they have stripes. I wish I could get a good photo but we broke our camera's view screen so I can't see to adjust for the macro setting, which is a shame because there's one of the bees that got caught by a spidey and although it's dead, it would have been a good shot. I'll check out carpenter bees.

[noinwi]

I think they are leaf-cutter bees. It's cooler and overcast today so the only bee on the plant is the dead one. I looked at it with a magnifying glass and although it didn't look like it had the hairs on the underside, it looks very much like the ones on google images. And, right next to my garden is a stand of alder saplings that show clear signs of leaf-cutting. Mystery solved, I think. Sorry about veering off topic.

[joseph]

Originally Posted by noinwi

Sorry about veering off topic.

I'm welcoming to as many pollinators as will visit my tomato patch... If I found a variety of tomato that attracted honeybees or leafcutters or sweat bees I'd propagate it gladly. I have a huge population of leafcutter bees in the barn, but they stick to the sunflower patch and don't venture into the tomatoes very often. I only put bumblebees in the title because that was what was visiting the tomato flowers last year.

[noinwi]

Well, they're next to but not on my tomatoes. Only the Bumbles are visiting them. The small bees are only interested in tiny white flowers right now...Oregano, Catnip, Queen Ann's Lace. As soon as the sun broke through this afternoon they were everywhere. The Spearmint will bloom soon...that should be a riot! I enjoy all the noise, especially when the Bumbles kick vibrate into high gear! Makes me laugh every time.

[joseph]

To follow up on the progress of this project...

I attempted the following crosses which seem to have been successful.

[DX52-12 X Jagoka]. I got a couple dozen seeds. DX52-12 is an indeterminate plant with exerted stigmas and an open anther cone. It is a Moscow type that was developed specifically for my valley. The F1 aughta thrive here. DX52-12 was highly afflicted by blossom end rot this year. The only tomato I grew that was afflicted. I am not at all happy about that. Whatever. I'll eliminate that trait later on.

And also the reciprocal cross [Jagodka X DX52-12]. It also produced a fruit. It ripened on the vine, but I haven't extracted the seeds yet.

[Jagodka X very late season indeterminate plants with open flowers]. This fruit was picked green. I'm allowing it to ripen on the front porch. The pollen donors were things like Croatian Brandywine, Hillbilly, Virginia Sweets, and/or Black Early, Indian Stripe, Danko, Zolotoe Serdise, and F1 crosses between them.

I made a mistake with the pollination method... I should have used pollen from the extra long season plants to pollinate the quick maturing plants. I did it the other way around, so the fruits didn't mature. By the time I figured out what I had done, it was too late in the season.

Most of the late season pollen donors didn't even ripen a fruit in my garden. But I collected seed from those that did. My intention is to grow this population continuously, selecting year-by-year for earlier maturity and open flower structures, and attractiveness to pollinators. And to use them as pollen donors to my other lines. The ideal tomatoes for my climate will always be determinate, but there are some clever traits in this population. I tasted a Hillbilly. I remember growing it decades ago. The taste is actually palatable, perhaps even bordering on enjoyable. Mostly though I am growing this population for the open flower structure and exerted stigmas.

I also collected a group of fruits that I am calling "Best Of Jagodka" and "Best of Matina". Jagodka last year was highly attractive to bumblebees. There was a lot of diversity among the plants this year. I'm speculating that some of the differences in some plants may be due to natural cross pollination.

[bower]

Glad to hear you got some of the crosses you wanted. Very few of my crosses were successful this year, but I did get a couple I wanted which are nearly ripe. I managed to get a cross of Zolotoe Serdtse X Black Early F1, with a determinate black cherry F2, to help with my space issues for growout. 1 of two determinate is a much better ratio, and 1 of two black is okay for me too. Not sure how fruit size genetics will play out, since one of the 'cherry' parents was not a cherry, but I'm okay with searching for bigger fruit down the line if I can just get the growth habit that I wanted.

I was pretty much disappointed in my hopes of earliness in F1's this year. Only a couple showed any sign of the desired 'heterosis'. Most had flowering dates = the later parent. Looks like I'll be doing selection for earliness in the F2 next spring as well.

Nice to hear you tasted a tomato that you liked! I'm fond of the bicolour taste myself. Sweet and fruity without the intense lycopene punch. (at least, that's what I think makes reds taste so different). I grew Northern Lights this year to compare with Oaxacan Jewel PL, and it was later and less productive but otherwise very similar fruit in colour, taste and texture. Most other bicolours that I've read about are 'late' so it's hard to find space to gamble on em...

[Fusion_power]

There is relatively little heterosis in tomato and what does show up is usually mid-parent heterosis where the offspring are between the extremes of the parents. To get significant levels of heterosis, you have to work with novel genetics such as S. Pimpinellifolium or S. Habrochaites.

The gene controlling early flowering is recessive. It only shows up in the F2.

The gene for determinant is penetrant. It shows up as plant size between the two parents.

[joseph]

I found two more fruits while cleaning the field that resulted from my attempts at hand pollination. They were [Virginia Sweets -- or Hillbilly -- X Ot-Jagodka]. The fruits were midgets compared to the non-crossed fruits on the same plant, but I'll take what I can get. There is more seed from all the various crosses than I'm likely to plant.

[joseph]

This winter I am attempting to grow out the F1 seed of the crosses between Ot'Jagodka and tomatoes that had loose or open flower structures last summer. In my garden, Jagodka is an extra-early super-productive variety that is highly attractive to bumblebees. I am attempting to cross it with varieties that have loose or open flower structures in hopes of increasing the percentage of cross pollination of tomatoes in my garden. Because with more naturally occurring cross pollination, the genetic roulette wheel spins more often, so I get more opportunities to select for varieties that thrive under my specific conditions and way of doing things.

I am growing the plants in the basement at about 65 F. In front of an east facing window under 16 hours of fluorescent light per day. I also have a couple of crossed plants growing in the soil of the greenhouse. I also sent seeds to a grower in Alabama who is attempting to grow them out and get F2 seeds to me before spring.

Some of the plants are currently flowering. It is still 8 weeks before I typically start my tomato transplants, so that seems right on schedule.

From left to right: [DX52-12 X Ot'Jagodka], [Ot'Jagodka X Loose/Open], [Hillbilly X Ot'Jagodka].


Exerted Stigma on [Ot'Jagodka X Loose/Open].


Pollinating with a vibrator, and also by brushing flowers against each other.


Growing a couple plants in a walk-in cold-frame (a.k.a. greenhouse) under cloches, surrounded by bottles of water, under a floating row cover. So far so good. They are forming flower buds.

[Stvrob]

I have Always been under the impression that bumblebee, or carpenter bee activity on tomatoes primarily " buzzes" the blossom and stimulates the release of pollen. It's still not likely that cross pollination between plants will occur due to their activity (though it would still be more likely than if they hadn't visited the flower at all) Is my understanding more or less correct?

[joseph]

Most of the tomato varieties that I have grown have what I call "Industrialized Flowers". They are all closed up. The female part of the flower is entirely enclosed by the anther cones. In many cases the end of the anther cone is essentially sealed shut because it is so tight around the style. Also, on many flowers the petals face outward, much like a pike-phalanx, further discouraging pollination by insects. I attribute this type of flower to plant breeders and heirloom lovers consistently selecting against cross pollination for many decades.

An industrialized flower looks like this:


The flower types that I am looking for in my garden are wide open so that pollen can easily get into and leave the flower. An ideal flower type in my garden might look like this, with all of the flower parts wide open and exposed. The inside of the anthers, where the pollen is, and the stigma are both easily accessible by bumblebees.


Because the pollen is right out in the open, and not enclosed in the anther cone, the flower is more attractive to bumblebees. Also, because the hairs of bees get covered in pollen while buzz pollinating, they are more likely to produce cross pollination if the stigma is right out in the open. Notice the dusting of pollen all over the bees legs and belly.


Edited to add:
In my garden, many species of bumblebees pollinate tomato flowers. It's a general principle that I am aiming for... If the anthers and stigma are wide open and exposed, then any species of pollinator that happens by will be able to cross pollinate the flowers easier than if the flowers are closed up.

[carolyn137]

Originally Posted by Stvrob

I have Always been under the impression that bumblebee, or carpenter bee activity on tomatoes primarily " buzzes" the blossom and stimulates the release of pollen. It's still not likely that cross pollination between plants will occur due to their activity (though it would still be more likely than if they hadn't visited the flower at all) Is my understanding more or less correct?

THE insects that do the most X pollination in most places are the sweat bees which are very tiny and almost impossible to see,

I think THE best article on NCP ( natural cross pollination) was written by Dr. Jeff McCormack when he owned SESE ( southern exposure seed exchange. Let me see if I can go find it for you.

I can't find it at SESE but Jeff has a different website now devoted to articles he's written and I think I might find it there, but no time to do that now.

Sweat bees, yes, the ones to be concerned about,

Carolyn

[PhilaGardener]

Very interesting! A number of McCormack's articles can be found at http://www.savingourseeds.org/publications.html

[carolyn137]

Originally Posted by PhilaGardener

Very interesting! A number of McCormack's articles can be found at http://www.savingourseeds.org/publications.html

Thanks so much for the link b/c that's the other site that Jeff has that I mentioned above.

I'll take a look at the tomato Organic Seed production one first to see if he says the same about X pollination that he did when at SESE.

Carolyn

[joseph]

Originally Posted by joseph

Growing a couple plants in a walk-in cold-frame (a.k.a. greenhouse) under cloches, surrounded by bottles of water, under a floating row cover. So far so good.

These tomatoes are flowering like crazy. This arrangement is keeping them about 50 F at night in spite of freezing temperatures. I'm buzz pollinating them a couple of times per day. When grown in my fields, this variety, Ot'Jagodka, ripens fruit 6 weeks after flowering.




That's a pot of mullein seedlings in the background.