Soil building for nutrient density

[ScottinAtlanta]

Down south, the shredded kudzu mulch was an interesting idea, because the supply is virtually unlimited. Might want to experiment on a small area first to be sure it can't sprout from a tiny piece of shredded kudzu.

That is a good point. Kudzu is so durable that I have seen years-old baskets woven from dried kudzu vines sprout tendrils if left in wet weather. But I collect my kudzu before it seeds, and I put the entire vines and leaves through my wood chipper, which turns it into finely ground green mulch. I put it into the compost pile, which heats up to well over 100 degrees. As a result, I have never seen the slightest sign of life in the kudzu mulch.

Kudzu also grows underground tubers that are as long as 8 feet, and weigh 200 pounds, which is where much the nitrogen is stored. I am toying with the idea of mulching one of those up to hyper charge the compost.

[COMPOSTER]

Originally Posted by Master_Gardener

Good point. Most soil tests do not include the advice you want, in fact, some labs will allow you to skip recommendations entirely. I set my soil test to a local lab. The analysis is 'OK' but the recommended advice was to use NPK in the form of chemical fertilizers and a bit of S and Fe. Just skip the advice part.

I believe the issues with soil testing are when and how to sample, and also what to do with the results when you get them. Initially, I thought the hard part of soil testing was to actually take and submit the samples. Wrong! It is interpreting the results and then re-mediating your soil in a manor consistent with your cultural practices.

Fast forward to your soil test results. You have x amounts of various minerals, now what do you do? At a minimum, I would suggest reading The Intelligent Gardener before you do anything. Working backwards from the lab results will help you even select a lab.

If you have never done a soil test, your results may surprise you.

You must have read my mind. Intelligent gardener just arrived in the mail yesterday. I've been a Steve Soloman fan for years. He is one of the main reasons I decided a few years ago that even though I was getting good results for very little expense, I needed to explore beyond compost, chicken manure and lime. If you havent already, check out the soil and health library on the web. Tons of different perspectives.

Glenn

[COMPOSTER]

Originally Posted by Master_Gardener

I have more info and pictures in Red Barron's project thread. I did a soil test and added 1/2 of the amendments with the balance to be added this fall. I do not till so everything goes on top. Last fall I added a 24 inch layer of shredded leaves over decomposing straw mulch, now about 1 inch deep across everything. My earthworms are everywhere and in big numbers. I Foliar feed with Calcium and Kelp. I use AACT and compost. I have a 400 sq. ft. raised bed, 600 sq. ft. of converted hard clay lawn. 400 sq. ft. of the previous was never tilled and is currently planted in inoculated legumes as a compost crop. When the legumes are finished, I'll plant inoculated alfalfa and let it over winter. It's a new bed for this year. I covered the grass with cardboard, 3" compost and 3" wood chips and inoculated with AACT. I also supplement with Comfrey and Nettles and I raise red wigglers mostly for making vc for AACT. I want most of my worms working 24 x 7 where they are needed most.

The new bed is slow to come on-line, but that was expected. I was surprised to see so many worms in the new bed so soon.

That's a lot of leaves. I love to use leaves. Really anything that most people consider waste. Leaves, grass clippings, animal manure, wood chips, fire place ashes, ect. The great thing about leaves is that the trees are mining the minerals from the subsoil and some of them end up in the leaves and ultimately in your soil. They are always a substantial component of my compost piles. I also store a big pile of them and add them regularly to my kitchen compost bin when I dump my kitchen scraps. Helps keep the odor to a minimum. Does your property generate them or are you picking them up/having them delivered?

I think you are on your way to having a seriously productive garden.

Glenn

[COMPOSTER]

For those interested in the rock dust portion of this thread, I have started my controlled experiment. I filled 2, exact same 5 gallon containers with the exact same soil mix, exact same measurements of fertilizer and lime and the exact same amounts of my own compost. The only difference is one container has 1/3 lb locally sourced basalt dust. I then planted the same variety of hybrid determinate tomato in each container. I grew the tomatoes from seed, from the same package and started them at the exact same time. Both containers are located within 8 feet of each other on a bed of wood mulch in a full sun location. I will now water them at the same time with the exact same quantity of water.

Glenn

[TightenUp]

Originally Posted by COMPOSTER

For those interested in the rock dust portion of this thread, I have started my controlled experiment. I filled 2, exact same 5 gallon containers with the exact same soil mix, exact same measurements of fertilizer and lime and the exact same amounts of my own compost. The only difference is one container has 1/3 lb locally sourced basalt dust. I then planted the same variety of hybrid determinate tomato in each container. I grew the tomatoes from seed, from the same package and started them at the exact same time. Both containers are located within 8 feet of each other on a bed of wood mulch in a full sun location. I will now water them at the same time with the exact same quantity of water.

Glenn

i like the idea but i must say i have 2 plants grown from the same batch of seeds and under the exact same conditions right next to one another in the garden and one plant is clearly taller and bushier. neither have been pruned or even touched since i planted them. i think you need a much larger control and test group for accurate results. i'm still interested in your findings though

[COMPOSTER]

Originally Posted by TightenUp

i like the idea but i must say i have 2 plants grown from the same batch of seeds and under the exact same conditions right next to one another in the garden and one plant is clearly taller and bushier. neither have been pruned or even touched since i planted them. i think you need a much larger control and test group for accurate results. i'm still interested in your findings though

Thanks for the input. You are definately right. Thought I had all my variables covered. Probably why I got C's and B's in science class. I knew this could potentially be an issue of contention. The good thing is both plants were very similar in size at the time of transplanting. At least now I know how to make next years experiment more conclusive. Now I need to get more of the exact same container.

Glenn

[nnjjohn]

Well, I am happy with 2 beds doing pretty good considering all that wet June weather and now this heat wave 1st week of July.. Really only having to water my plants a couple times in June.. didn't water yet in July but if no rain soon I will with all this 90 degree weather. One bed is doing poorly for the tomato plants.. they are thin viney and not healthy looking,, as if what was suspected ..same as the last four seasons.. the local lab PH tested high 7.4 back in early June.. I sprinkled another cup of that store bought granular sulfur acidified by Epson.. The cucumbers seem to be doing fine..picked four cucs already and lots of little ones are growing.. just no flowers of matoes in this bed.. I tried hoeing the soil and even hilled the plants thinking this might stimulate better growth..my plants are talking to me.. they need something but can not seem to figure it out. perhaps another PH test after a week or so.. if these plants don't look good, i'm going to try transplanting the swiss chard from the pots i started a few weeks ago into this bed.. still have the other three good tomato beds with plants showing plenty buds and matoes. I will show pics of the beds again

[nnjjohn]

The bed on the shaded side with the cucumbers never yields good tomatoes..not sure if I can blame it on lack of sun because it gets around 6 hrs of sun when it is sunny..the other beds are producing nice size green tomatoes already with bigger thicker plants with many flowers

[COMPOSTER]

Originally Posted by nnjjohn

The bed on the shaded side with the cucumbers never yields good tomatoes..not sure if I can blame it on lack of sun because it gets around 6 hrs of sun when it is sunny..the other beds are producing nice size green tomatoes already with bigger thicker plants with many flowers

I experimented with an area last year that got 5-6 hrs of mid afternoon sun. I planted cukes, bush beans, broccoli and 1 Roma tomato plant. The broccoli was desroyed by cabbage loppers, the bush beans and tomato produced poorly compared to my full sun plantings, but the cukes did pretty well. I didn't get anywhere near full production but I was pretty impressed that I was able to pick 2 or 3 every other day for quite a while. Maybe that is a good area for you to grow cukes as they look nice and healthy.

I was reading a book called the Resiliant Gardener a while back and the author stated that she thought the best tomato for semi shade was Amish Paste.

Glenn

[COMPOSTER]

Due to the fact that compost containing various manures needs to be tested to make sure there are no growth inhibiting herbacides, I have the opportunity to increase my rock dust experiment sample size. 3 weeks ago I planted 3 Lucia grape tomato seeds in a mixture of 50% of my garden soil and 50% compost from a pile built late spring of 2012. This pile was about 60% by volume, sheep manure mixed with straw. So to be safe and for peace of mind I always test before adding it to my garden beds. All 3 plants germinated in 6 days. All 3 were Transplanted to 4 inch pots in the same soil/compost mix on 7/7. I am going to use the exact same method as stated in an earlier post to see if there are any discernible differences in the plants/fruits. I'm also going to learn if I can plant mid summer tomatoes and harvest ripe fruits in southern New England. Last year I came close but failed with a later start date.

Glenn

[nnjjohn]

Yes my four cucumber plants are doing great and producing very well.. as you say every few days at least three for family salads.. it is possible this bed has herbicides from stable horse manure mix used previous seasons,,The tomato plants may produce some late season so i won't pull them..i will try transplanting some boxed and potted swiss chard in between the existing plants to experiement and see if the chard will fair as well as the cucumbers. My other three beds with about 16 plants each look like they will produce more than enough tomatoes in the weeks ahead.

[COMPOSTER]

nnjjohn,

If you have the opportunity keep posting your results now and then. I love Chard. I have a decent amount of partial sun area that I would love to be able to use so I can free up more full sun space for Tomatoes, peppers and mellons.

Glenn

[COMPOSTER]

7/27 I planted 2 lucia grape tomatoes in 3 gallon containers using the same parameters as the original 2 samples. So now the sample size has increased to 4. I know this is a very small sample size but space is limited for experiments as I try to grow approximately 6 months of my families produce consumption. I can definitely expand the sample size 50n-100% next year but need to find some more containers that are the exact same size and shape to keep the experiment as exact as possible.

Observations on the original 2 plants transplanted 4 weeks ago are as follows. Rock dust amended plant is approximately 4 inches taller, has more flowers on it and set fruit 2 days earlier than non rock dust plant. Other than that both plants look very healthy and are growing well.

Glenn

[COMPOSTER]

My rock dust experiment was interesting but inconclusive. The first set of tomatoes were a Hybrid called "Booty" and the Basalt dust amended plant was larger, set fruit earlier and produced larger and more fruit. Could not definitively say the fruits tasted better. The Lucia grape tomatoes are still alive and currently have ripe fruit on the plants. The non Basalt dust plant was larger and both plants yielded similarly. I'm still evaluating the taste of the tomatoes. Aside from the tomatoes, my bush beans (same varieties as last year) were the best yielding, best tasting. longest producing I have ever grown. My sweet peppers (different varieties than last year) were the best and sweetest I have ever grown. Again, I know this is inconclusive but my point here is that up to this point there has not been any negative results of using the Basalt dust and all my observations so far have been positive.

I am adding another 1/3 lb of Basalt dust (proceeding with caution) to my beds this fall. I am planning to continue my controlled experiment next year with a larger sample size.

In regards to the nutrient density the only observation I can report is that my wife says that her hair is more healthy and shiny than it has been in years. The only thing we can attribute this to is the vegetable garden.

[Redbaron]

Originally Posted by COMPOSTER

My rock dust experiment was interesting but inconclusive. The first set of tomatoes were a Hybrid called "Booty" and the Basalt dust amended plant was larger, set fruit earlier and produced larger and more fruit. Could not definitively say the fruits tasted better. The Lucia grape tomatoes are still alive and currently have ripe fruit on the plants. The non Basalt dust plant was larger and both plants yielded similarly. I'm still evaluating the taste of the tomatoes. Aside from the tomatoes, my bush beans (same varieties as last year) were the best yielding, best tasting. longest producing I have ever grown. My sweet peppers (different varieties than last year) were the best and sweetest I have ever grown. Again, I know this is inconclusive but my point here is that up to this point there has not been any negative results of using the Basalt dust and all my observations so far have been positive.

I am adding another 1/3 lb of Basalt dust (proceeding with caution) to my beds this fall. I am planning to continue my controlled experiment next year with a larger sample size.

In regards to the nutrient density the only observation I can report is that my wife says that her hair is more healthy and shiny than it has been in years. The only thing we can attribute this to is the vegetable garden.

Thanks for the update. Maybe inconclusive but still encouraging.