Fermenting.

[imp]

Originally Posted by Worth1

imp I am getting a little tired of you following me around and disagreeing or finding fault with everything I do.

Please stop.

I am just posting on threads I find interesting, not following you around. You are making too much of yourself to think that. Just because we do not agree on a subject is not finding fault, just differing view points, which is allowed and encourages discussion on the topic. And, I do not always disagree with you, either.



You must have 1000's of posts that I have never read or commented on.



Worth, this may shock you, but I don't care what you do, really - what you do is your choice. I DO care about safety with canning and such, very much, as botulism can kill people, or make them very ill.

[Worth1]

Originally Posted by imp

I am just posting on threads I find interesting, not following you around. You are making too much of yourself to think that. Just because we do not agree on a subject is not finding fault, just differing view points, which is allowed and encourages discussion on the topic. And, I do not always disagree with you, either.



You must have 1000's of posts that I have never read or commented on.



Worth, this may shock you, but I don't care what you do, really - what you do is your choice. I DO care about safety with canning and such, very much, as botulism can kill people, or make them very ill.

Tried that BS the last time this happened not going to happen this time.
You have a pattern of following me around and doing this to me.

Don't even try to play innocent with this, other people see it too.

Worth

[imp]

Originally Posted by Worth1

Tried that BS the last time this happened not going to happen this time.
You have a pattern of following me around and doing this to me.

Don't even try to play innocent with this, other people see it too.

Worth

Making crazy accusations is not good. Are you trying to stop me from posting on threads I find interesting?


There are so many posts of yours made ( looking at the numbers or your posts under your user name) that I have not read, responded to or anything, so I fail to see your point that I am "following you around". Nonsense, I think you simply do not like for anyone to disagree with you, I guess.



Being safe with fermenting or canning foods is very important, because, as I stated before, botulism can be deadly

[Worth1]

I have no idea what imp posted she is on my ignore list.

[imp]

Originally Posted by Worth1

I have no idea what imp posted she is on my ignore list.

Make an accusation, then hide, LOL. Well, that is good and should stop any further crazy claims. Thank you.

[coronabarb]

<<imp I am getting a little tired of you following me around and disagreeing or finding fault with everything I do.>>

Oh please! Chill out

[coronabarb]

Just went back to see what all this is about. Worth, there is more to canning than pH alone. NCHFP says to never add thickeners to salsa before canning. You can can however you like. If imp or I question what you post, DEAL WITH IT. Don't come on here and make accusations about her.

We've already established that peoples' canning advice here may not be safe, so canner beware. And if you choose to put someone on your ignore list, you can keep that to yourself. We don't have to agree on everything, you are not the authority on everything and yes, you do often come across that way. Time for you to ignore posts as well.

[carolyn137]

Aye Curumba as it is oft said, at least by me,will this never stop?

Carolyn

[coronabarb]

Probably not. The comments continue

[velikipop]

Originally Posted by imp

The National Center for Home Food Preservation recommends canning sauerkraut too. And Salsas have a big write up page, no fermented salsa has been tested.


https://nchfp.uga.edu/how/can_06/sauerkraut.html


" Fully fermented kraut may be kept tightly covered in the refrigerator for several months or it may be canned as follows: Hot pack – Bring kraut and liquid slowly to a boil in a large kettle, stirring frequently. Remove from heat and fill jars rather firmly with kraut and juices, leaving 1/2-inch headspace.
Raw pack – Fill jars firmly with kraut and cover with juices, leaving 1/2-inch headspace."

I don't do any of this and have made sauerkraut for years...no problems at all. The sites you quote are overly cautious in their recommendations.

and link to salsa page:


https://nchfp.uga.edu/publications/n...ets/salsa.html


"We only recommend recipes and procedures we know to be safe, and encourage consumers to use tested, science-based home-canning recipes from reliable sources like our website or some equipment or home preserving ingredient manufacturers. Our recommended home canning recipes for salsa, as well as a discussion of how ingredients impact safety, are collected in this publication:
http://www.uga.edu/nchfp/publication...onal_salsa.pdf
The same, but individual recipes with links to background information in some of them: http://www.uga.edu/nchfp/how/can_salsa.html The most flexible procedure we offer for a home-canned salsa is our Choice Salsa found on this menu."


more at both links.


In other words, it isn't safe to do what you've suggested.

[greenthumbomaha]

Originally Posted by imp

The National Center for Home Food Preservation recommends canning sauerkraut too. And Salsas have a big write up page, no fermented salsa has been tested.


https://nchfp.uga.edu/how/can_06/sauerkraut.html


" Fully fermented kraut may be kept tightly covered in the refrigerator for several months or it may be canned as follows: Hot pack – Bring kraut and liquid slowly to a boil in a large kettle, stirring frequently. Remove from heat and fill jars rather firmly with kraut and juices, leaving 1/2-inch headspace.
Raw pack – Fill jars firmly with kraut and cover with juices, leaving 1/2-inch headspace."


and link to salsa page:


https://nchfp.uga.edu/publications/n...ets/salsa.html


"We only recommend recipes and procedures we know to be safe, and encourage consumers to use tested, science-based home-canning recipes from reliable sources like our website or some equipment or home preserving ingredient manufacturers. Our recommended home canning recipes for salsa, as well as a discussion of how ingredients impact safety, are collected in this publication:
http://www.uga.edu/nchfp/publication...onal_salsa.pdf
The same, but individual recipes with links to background information in some of them: http://www.uga.edu/nchfp/how/can_salsa.html The most flexible procedure we offer for a home-canned salsa is our Choice Salsa found on this menu."


more at both links.


In other words, it isn't safe to do what you've suggested.

We were typing at the same time velikipop.



First question : Can I leave freshly picked and washed (but de-leafed) cabbage on the counter for 2 days before fermenting? Would refrigeration hinder the fermenting process?


(It does say 24-48 hours is okay, but I am targeting Friday morning. Refrigerate?_




Earlier I read on a .edu site (michigan?) the canning of cabbage was after fermentation. I "just" a few minutes ago ordered more airlocks and weights so I could can sauerkraut. It ony lasted a few weeks in the fridge without a hot bath. The reference above contradicts what I read earlier. Am I mis-understanding this?


- Lisa

[coronabarb]

If your kitchen is warm, you could refrigerate to keep best quality. It won't matter when fermenting.

You ferment the cabbage first to make sauerkraut. Then, you can it if you want to. It should stay good in the refrigerator for a long time. We've had a jar of kimchi in the frig for about 2 months now.

[greenthumbomaha]

Thanks Barb. My house has a/c so counter it is. I have three more heads to harvest if bugs and rain don't change things up. I am pooped from the small amount of processing (I also made refrigerator pickles today) and did a bunch of weeding, tying up etc.


- Lisa

[encore]

i lacto ferment cabbage and i have a quart jar in frig, going on 5 months now, they say probably good for up to a year, mine tastes just fine. just saying ---tom

[oakley]

I think, but do correct me if I am wrong, this thread was intended for fermenting. To share
and learn.

Our ancestors, globally, have been salt curing, dry curing, and fermenting for centuries,
before recorded history. Without incident.

Fermenting for eventual canning is completely different by miles. Canning, heat treating, is
just a couple hundred years young. The NCHFP has not a clue about natural fermentation.
They are supplying information for 'safe' canning of fermentations. Very different game.

Natural fermentation has thousands of variations. You can discover many ways to ferment
depending on taste and preference. Once you understand the fermentation process, you can
experiment. Fermentation naturally is never meant to be bottled, jared, or canned by any
heat method. No such thing as 'recommended safe practices' for natural ferments.

I do not heat treat ever. Raw, whole fresh foods, quick pickle, or ferment. We just do not
care for canned, heat treated foods. Not salsa, beans, or really any processed foods.
Canning is processed.

Worth does not need defending but he does what we do and DOES know what he is doing.

Exhausting to try and explain to those so unfamiliar with natural wild ferments.

All cultures have a harvest period of time, a processing for fermenting, then a period of time
in cooler storage or cellars. Above 85 or there about, you may be destroying the balance of
good bacteria. Not at all dangerous because it is obvious. We all have refrigeration so that
keeps the wild ferments active and safe. A hot climate has AC. Cooler climates have root
cellars. Or basements.

All issues with illness is un-safe canning, heat processing. Not natural fermentations.