Nutrient level question in 5 gallon DWC system

[Icefisher]

Hello all from northwest Wisconsin. I have created my first ebb and flow hydroponic system for growing leafy things. It is now 19 days old and some of the lettuce is nearly ready to selectively pick! I have become intrigued with hydroponics and have been reading lots about deep water culture tomatoes. While searching for more information on DWC tomatoes, I happened on this website. I am hoping to learn much here.

I have one question I hope someone can help me with. I made two 5 gallon bucket DWC systems yesterday. What level should the nutrient solution be in the bucket?

Should it completely immerse the net pot that holds the tomato seedling? Or, should it just allow the lower couple of inches of the net pot to be immersed allowing the nutrient solution to wick up to the root structure?

Thanks for any help.
Icefisher

[Rajun Gardener]

I started with hydro a few months ago and have dutch buckets for tomatoes and Kratky for lettuce. I'm surprised your doing ebb and flow for lettuce when Kratky is so easy but I understand not knowing cause I was the same way before I researched everything I could before starting. It's a whole new world and the results are amazing. I haven't researched tomatoes in dwc but my concern would be what will support the plants roots and I also noticed that tomatoes don't like their roots too wet, I had my pump running 24/7 and all the top leaves curled up so I cut it down to 15 minutes 3 times a day and it made all the difference. Hydro is like steroids so make sure you have head space for tomatoes to grow. I researched every hydro site but got better understanding from watching MHPGardener youtubes, check out the dutch buckets and go from there.

[Icefisher]

Hello Rajun Gardener, thanks for your response. Just starting out and reading through the volumes of information out there on the net regarding hydroponics is a little daunting. As I gain more experience, I plan to try a few different approaches to growing tomatoes and maybe some other things. I was not aware of the Kratky method when I made the ebb and flow system! However, the dutch buckets look like they could be a better method for tomatoes who don't care for wet roots. There sure are a lot of Utube videos out there from people who apparently have been successful in growing tomatoes with DWC systems however.

[Rajun Gardener]

Have you seen MHPgardeners vids, he explains it well and does follow ups to show results. I also use the rockwool to start suckers in and they work great. This whole hydro thing has made me question how I grow in ground also, I'm adding more nutrients now and can tell the difference in just a few weeks. That set up you have is great for strawberries too. I'll try to post an updated pic later of my DB tomatoes, the growth is crazy.

[Mike723]

Hey,

It all depends on the size of the seedlings you put in there.. With DWC I'm always sure to have sufficient roots on my clones before throwing them in the nets. I'm not sure how far down in the net pot you've planted them. I usually go about half way with the clone and then leave the water level about a half an inch below the bottom of the net pot. The roots will stay moist from the splashing of the bubbles and it will encourage them to stretch for the water. Once you see some roots hitting the res water bring the level up to 2-4" above the bottom. You don't want to go too high as immersing the stem can lead to crown rot.

You'll have to experiment with nutrient levels etc - assuming you have a tds meter? The flavor in hydroponics will be lacking due to constant "watering," but that can be overcome by adding some extra salts during harvest time to restrict the plant from taking in too much water.

You should see a gradual rise in ph day to day.. Stick with 5.8 for your target. I swing up to 6.2 without any issues. If you experience a drop in ph and an increase in tds that means your solution is too strong - dilute it some. If you have a large drop in tds (over 50 points) and a considerable increase in ph that means your solution is too weak - strengthen it up some. You will also see drops in ph when there is an accumulation of decaying organic matter in the res (sloughed off root cells etc). Change out the res with a fresh solution to regain stability. Welcome to the wonderfully intriguing world of hydroponics! Good luck and enjoy!

[Icefisher]

Outstanding bits of information! Thanks for this. Can I pick your brain for comments about lighting?

I currently have a sun system light fixture with a foliage grow lamp. I also have the 1000 watt hps lamp for blooming plants. If you are familiar with these, do you know when it is time to switch bulbs?

[Mike723]

What size is the vegetative light (watts)? You want a light cycle of 18-24 hours on during vegetative growth. You can kick it down to 14-16 hours on during flowering - tomatoes are day-length neutral so flowering cannot be triggered by a 12/12 light cycle; contrary to a lot of the garbage you'll read online. A few things to consider: studies have shown that a total dark period of 10 hours a day will produce the best over-all fruit in terms of skin thickness, meat vs pulp, size and taste.

Stick with a determinate variety to minimize the issue of outgrowing your room. You'll most likely need to help with pollination as well - look into an electric toothbrush with a piece of metal/plastic inserted into the brush end.. you'll find a lot of diy's on that..

What line are you using for your nutrients?

Oh and to answer your original question - once you are satisfied with the plant's size you can switch to the red spectrum (hps); as veg growth conditions will be less than optimal - although they'll still stretch some. Could be anywhere from 1-3 months based on strain etc.. I'd say when the plant is anywhere between 2-4' switch it over.

[Icefisher]

Wow, you definitely sound like you have been doing this for awhile! The metal halide lamp is 1000 watts. It is doing a super job on the lettuce and kale I am currently growing. As soon as I figure out how to post photos, I will share. It would have taken me a lot of reading, trial and error not to mention frustration to get to the level of knowledge that you have made available to me in your post's.

As for fertilizer, I have ordered some master blend from Morgan county. If this is a mistake, please let me know what I could do different. I do have a decent pH/ppm/ec meter to monitor nutrient concentrations. This is also a new area for me to get familiar with. By the way, I am in the process of geminating seeds right now, so, it will be a couple of weeks before I place plants into their final home.

Thank you

Am indebted.

Gary

[Rajun Gardener]

Thanks MIKE for your comments. I know I have researched over 50 hours on nute levels of when and why to change but your the 1st to break it down like that. Please keep posting and helping both of us. Icefisher I hope you don't mind if I tag along.

Do you really bring the res level up 2-4" in the net cup? I'm asking because it seemed like I had too much watering. I'm growing in dutch buckets using perlite to grow in, 8 buckets with 1 plant each and started with a 264 gph pump on 24/7, after they got about 3' tall the top leaves started curling under so I researched and came to the conclusion that either I need to refresh the nutes or cut down on watering. I refreshed the nutes and I adjusted the timer to 1 hour 4 times a day and they still had curled under leaves, after about a week the leaves were the same so I cut the pump down to 15 minutes 3 times a day and they look fine now. I didn't touch the nutes since I set it up and that was about three weeks because they were growing crazy and now I'm thinking maybe they used up the nutes. I have a tds and ph meter but only used it to set it up so I don't really know what the nute level was but now I know to check it. I'm also using masterblend, cal-nit and epsom salt. Is there a schedule you use to check nutes and ph and what are signs in the plant that makes you check levels again. Thanks for posting and Ice I'm glad you posted too, I never thought to ask here.

[Cole_Robbie]

I think hydroton clay pellets would work better if you're running pumps 24/7.

Meters and measuring are important now, but after a while you won't have to use the meters nearly as much.