Porch Swing

AlittleSalt · April 30, 2016

I want to build a porch swing in an area of our main garden that is always in the shade. This area of the garden isn't used to grow anything other than some mint nearby. It's the perfect area for a porch swing.

I looked online at all the local big box type stores (Home Depot, Sears, Lowes, McCoy's and even Walmart) and found that none of them carry porch swings in-store. Is everything .com now?

I found one that is interesting at https://shop.mccoys.com/outdoors/out...niture/p.35338 I like the price and the fact that it comes ready to finish.

Being that it is the shade 24/7 there's no need for a shaded top (cost too much anyway) and I want to build the support frame to look like the picture below - and also paint the swing and support to match the picture.

What I want to use for the support frame is landscape timbers. Something sort of like this https://www.google.com/search?q=porc...EV1JhNOIMIM%3A

I need to add the picture and then I'll reply more info and questions.

AlittleSalt · April 30, 2016

I'm not married to any of these ideas, so thoughts, pictures, and ideas are very welcome. We're just in the planning stage.

In the picture above, center and back, you see a corner post for the garden fence - that is the general area where the porch swing will be.

My wife and grandchildren will use this swing a lot. It needs to hold up to growing grandchildren. My wife only weighs 115 pounds, but I weigh 220, so the swing set needs to easily support 350 pounds swinging on it.

imp · April 30, 2016

Add something there to repel the 'skeeters, too.

Looks like a nice spot to cool off in. Nice spot,Salt.

ContainerTed · April 30, 2016

You can also use a kids swing frame. If you do, concrete in the legs. Most of the home setups for kids swings, etc., use 4"X4" pressure treated. But what you're looking for is just to build a couple "letter A" setups and then put in a crosspiece to support the chains for the swing.

We find a few at the local flea markets, mostly built from oak. They run about $75 to $100 for a two seater (when you can find them). They really are easy to build from simple plans if you have a table saw to rip the slats. If you have a kiln nearby that dries hardwoods, they usually sell the samples they use to test the dryness for half price or less.

I built one back in 2006 from kiln dried Cherry wood. Cost was about $30 for the wood and 15 for the hardware. I have a few air hammers that do brads, finishing nails, and framing. Once I got the wood cut, it went together in one afternoon.

Good luck on your project. Give us some pictures when you get it done.

Worth1 · April 30, 2016

Okay Salty I did some research on the swing in question.
It says unfinished hardwood.
I looked on line to reassure my self about Cypress which is what it is made out of.

Even though cypress is considered a hardwood it is a softer wood in structure.
The wood from old growth is pretty good at weather resistance but new growth not as much.
But it is a good wood and is far better than some oaks like red oak.
It just so happens I have spent a ton of time doing research on the strength of woods and bolts in the last day or so.
And things like moments of force on angles and so on.

I have to say wood is a bugger to calculate because it isn't all the same due to grain structure and things like knots and so on.
Also the way the grain is turned.
So I cant just say go down and buy a 2X4 and it will hold so and so weight.

As for hardware they have gone over the top in safety as far as what to use.

The hangers are rated at 500 lbs per hanger there are two so it is 1000 pounds total.
Some of the others are de rated big time.
This is because people will be sitting on them.
This is crazy.
Just look on line at home depot for porch swing hangers and you will see what I am talking about.
Law suits rule the world.

Back when you and I were kids they would sell s hooks and J hanger bolts to screw into a 2x4 with dag chains.
Not anymore.
If they do they are rated at like 150 pounds.

The same eye bolts they used to sell now say not rated to support people.
Here is a link to turned wire eye bolt load limits.
A 1/2 turned eye bolt working load limit is 200 pounds.
They also say to never load at an angle.
My how times have changed.
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=...1gkbhIfAlZlGhA

You say you weight 200 pounds.
If you were sitting in the middle of the swing your weight would be supported by both bolts.
If you were under one of the bolts it would be supporting all of your weight.

Now the part that is weak is the turned eye not the bolt itself.
A 1/2 grade 2 coarse thread bolt has a proof load of around 7800 pounds.
I wish I had my bolt book I left up there.

Now lets get to the wood.
I may or may not would use the landscape timbers to do this.
Reason is what I said earlier.
If you look all of them are the center of a log.
One thing to consider it where the hangers would be at.
It would be at the ends so the support would be stronger there than in the middle.
Theoretically if it would hold up 100 pounds in the middle it would support 200 pounds halfway to the end from the middle me thinks.

Here is a little project I have been working on to lift a 1000 pound weight.
Not finished yet but each square represents 6 inches.
None of the other dimensions are exactly right but I needed to do a drawing to calculate some things.
But it will show you how to support the structure you are thinking of building.
A little over board but I know you have your families safety in mind also.
Worth
Gantry hoist.jpg

Deborah · April 30, 2016

Salt, just don't get one foot off the porch swing...

AlittleSalt · April 30, 2016

Worth, that is what I am thinking about. Thank you for all the research. I will ask Jan to read this tomorrow. I would ask her to check it out tonight but she's working till 8 tonight, and then go back at 7 in the morning

She's about to change her availability to 7am-7pm

Worth1 · April 30, 2016

Quote:

Originally Posted by AlittleSalt

Worth, that is what I am thinking about. Thank you for all the research. I will ask Jan to read this tomorrow. I would ask her to check it out tonight but she's working till 8 tonight, and then go back at 7 in the morning

She's about to change her availability to 7am-7pm

Your welcome Salt it just so happens I was doing this yesterday and brushing up and this stuff.

I have to do everything by myself and have to be careful not to get hurt.

One thing you can do to greatly increase the strength of the bent wire type eye bolts is to weld the eye together at the gap.

I am so used to industrial type stuff I cannot believe how cheaply made the stuff it at some of the stores.
As for lifting my 1000 pound load I cant use a forklift in my garage.

I have looked up some stuff for you.
Here is the chain rated at 545 pounds.
http://www.homedepot.com/p/Everbilt-...6440/203958838

Worth

AlittleSalt · April 30, 2016

I will most likely go with that chain you posted the link to. Jan will like that it is shiny and new. Of course I like the 545# part and the fact that it's not going to rust.

Thinking of chains, we do have a lot of chains around the barn. I need to look at them and see what we've got. They're probably too big. I know two of them are tow chains - my father called them log chains.

Worth1 · April 30, 2016

Here are these chain quick links they make all sizes.
This is the small one and it working load limit is 480 pounds.
I think these come in packs of three.
I have screwed myself before and the thing wouldn't fit in the chain or the eye bolt.
http://www.homedepot.com/p/Crown-Bol...4684/203001534

Worth1 · April 30, 2016

I just dug up information from the lowes site on the turned wire type eye bolts.
The 3/8ths is 190 the 1/2 is 300 and the 5/8 was 560 pounds.
Stanly brand.
The forged eye bolts go up into the 2000 pound range or more.
Remember the two bolts that connect to the swing will share the load but they will be at an angle.
So 190 X 4 is 760 divided by 3 is 253.3 X 2 = 506.6 pounds.
Jethro math but it works for me.

This is accommodating the side load on the eye bolts at a 60 degree angle.
So a 3/8 bolt would be fine.
The top eye bolts I think would be fine at 300 pounds each also.
If it were me I would run both chains on both sides to the very top and get rid of almost all of the side load and connect them to the link right under the eye bolt there.
This will also keep the seat from flipping and relieve a ton of stress on the wooden seat.

Worth

Worth1 · May 1, 2016

While doing yet more looking for swing information I found this video.
Everything you wanted to know about porch swings.

https://youtu.be/07_rnlBezQg

matereater · May 1, 2016

Cool song Worth !

Salt, you may want to consider using stainless steel hardware to assemble your swing if you can, its expensive but lasts forever especially outdoors.

AlittleSalt · May 1, 2016

Worth, uh huh.

Steve, I've looked at some of those too.

dmforcier · May 1, 2016

I wouldn't worry about the loading as much as the lateral stability of the hanger - in other words, the frame. A porch swing can anchor into the ceiling joists. You'll be in a free-standing frame. You may be a subdued swinger, but the kids will be going for height at some point. You'll want a lot stronger frame with a wider leg angle than the one in your original picture.

Might consider tying it to a tree (overhead branch?) for safety.

April 30, 2016	#4
ContainerTed Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: 6a - NE Tennessee Posts: 4,538	You can also use a kids swing frame. If you do, concrete in the legs. Most of the home setups for kids swings, etc., use 4"X4" pressure treated. But what you're looking for is just to build a couple "letter A" setups and then put in a crosspiece to support the chains for the swing. We find a few at the local flea markets, mostly built from oak. They run about $75 to $100 for a two seater (when you can find them). They really are easy to build from simple plans if you have a table saw to rip the slats. If you have a kiln nearby that dries hardwoods, they usually sell the samples they use to test the dryness for half price or less. I built one back in 2006 from kiln dried Cherry wood. Cost was about $30 for the wood and 15 for the hardware. I have a few air hammers that do brads, finishing nails, and framing. Once I got the wood cut, it went together in one afternoon. Good luck on your project. Give us some pictures when you get it done. __________________ Ted ________________________ Owner & Sole Operator Of The Muddy Bucket Farm and Tomato Ranch

April 30, 2016	#5
Worth1 Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Den of Drunken Fools Posts: 38,539	Okay Salty I did some research on the swing in question. It says unfinished hardwood. I looked on line to reassure my self about Cypress which is what it is made out of. Even though cypress is considered a hardwood it is a softer wood in structure. The wood from old growth is pretty good at weather resistance but new growth not as much. But it is a good wood and is far better than some oaks like red oak. It just so happens I have spent a ton of time doing research on the strength of woods and bolts in the last day or so. And things like moments of force on angles and so on. I have to say wood is a bugger to calculate because it isn't all the same due to grain structure and things like knots and so on. Also the way the grain is turned. So I cant just say go down and buy a 2X4 and it will hold so and so weight. As for hardware they have gone over the top in safety as far as what to use. The hangers are rated at 500 lbs per hanger there are two so it is 1000 pounds total. Some of the others are de rated big time. This is because people will be sitting on them. This is crazy. Just look on line at home depot for porch swing hangers and you will see what I am talking about. Law suits rule the world. Back when you and I were kids they would sell s hooks and J hanger bolts to screw into a 2x4 with dag chains. Not anymore. If they do they are rated at like 150 pounds. The same eye bolts they used to sell now say not rated to support people. Here is a link to turned wire eye bolt load limits. A 1/2 turned eye bolt working load limit is 200 pounds. They also say to never load at an angle. My how times have changed. https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=...1gkbhIfAlZlGhA You say you weight 200 pounds. If you were sitting in the middle of the swing your weight would be supported by both bolts. If you were under one of the bolts it would be supporting all of your weight. Now the part that is weak is the turned eye not the bolt itself. A 1/2 grade 2 coarse thread bolt has a proof load of around 7800 pounds. I wish I had my bolt book I left up there. Now lets get to the wood. I may or may not would use the landscape timbers to do this. Reason is what I said earlier. If you look all of them are the center of a log. One thing to consider it where the hangers would be at. It would be at the ends so the support would be stronger there than in the middle. Theoretically if it would hold up 100 pounds in the middle it would support 200 pounds halfway to the end from the middle me thinks. Here is a little project I have been working on to lift a 1000 pound weight. Not finished yet but each square represents 6 inches. None of the other dimensions are exactly right but I needed to do a drawing to calculate some things. But it will show you how to support the structure you are thinking of building. A little over board but I know you have your families safety in mind also. Worth Gantry hoist.jpg Last edited by Worth1; April 30, 2016 at 02:51 PM.

April 30, 2016	#6
Deborah Riding The Crazy Train Again Join Date: Dec 2011 Location: San Marcos, California Posts: 2,562	Salt, just don't get one foot off the porch swing... __________________ "The righteous one cares for the needs of his animal". Proverbs 12:10

May 1, 2016	#13
matereater Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: S.E. Michigan (Livonia) Posts: 1,264	Cool song Worth ! Salt, you may want to consider using stainless steel hardware to assemble your swing if you can, its expensive but lasts forever especially outdoors. __________________ Steve Cleverly disguised as a responsible adult

April 30, 2016	#2
AlittleSalt BANNED FOR LIFE Join Date: May 2014 Posts: 13,333	I'm not married to any of these ideas, so thoughts, pictures, and ideas are very welcome. We're just in the planning stage. In the picture above, center and back, you see a corner post for the garden fence - that is the general area where the porch swing will be. My wife and grandchildren will use this swing a lot. It needs to hold up to growing grandchildren. My wife only weighs 115 pounds, but I weigh 220, so the swing set needs to easily support 350 pounds swinging on it.

April 30, 2016	#3
imp Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Wichita Falls, Texas Posts: 4,832	Add something there to repel the 'skeeters, too. Looks like a nice spot to cool off in. Nice spot,Salt.

May 1, 2016	#14
AlittleSalt BANNED FOR LIFE Join Date: May 2014 Posts: 13,333	Worth, uh huh. Steve, I've looked at some of those too.

May 1, 2016	#15
dmforcier Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Apr 2016 Location: Dallas, TX Posts: 3,825	I wouldn't worry about the loading as much as the lateral stability of the hanger - in other words, the frame. A porch swing can anchor into the ceiling joists. You'll be in a free-standing frame. You may be a subdued swinger, but the kids will be going for height at some point. You'll want a lot stronger frame with a wider leg angle than the one in your original picture. Might consider tying it to a tree (overhead branch?) for safety.