Black from Tula Potato Leaf

[RJ_Hythloday]

I grew one BFT this year and really like the taste, wife want's more too. I don't think it's worth saving seed from a plant that has been less than productive. I've gotten 3 fruits so far, and a few greenies right now.

In a thread over at GW it was brought up that there is a PL BFT. Searches show that it might come up as RL or PL and one vendor selling live plants only(no seeds) listed it as PL.

Is PL stable? Or is it just a luck of the draw? I'm wondering if I need to grow out alot of BFT to select the PL for planting out, or if any one knows of a commercial or trade source where I could find some PL BFT?

Thanks for any help.

[dice]

Spudatula?

http://tatianastomatobase.com/wiki/Spudatula_Black

The TOMATObase page above does not list any commercial
vendors. This custom Google search for seeds and plants
did not return anything for "spudatula", either:

http://www.google.com/custom?num=50&...%3Aad-kgp1hr6o

(I would bookmark that search page for future reference.)

So seeds are around, but only by trade I guess.

[RJ_Hythloday]

Thanks Dice,

hmmm... the unknown pl parent makes me think more about just growing regular old BFT. I guess it was a chance/accidental cross.

[dice]

hmmm... the unknown pl parent makes me think more about just growing regular old BFT. I guess it was a chance/accidental cross.

Yes, the flavor and fruit size will not be identical to BFT.
Spudatula does have a reputation for good flavor and
production, though:
http://www.tomatoville.com/showthrea...ula#post102018

[carolyn137]

Originally Posted by RJ_Hythloday

Thanks Dice,

hmmm... the unknown pl parent makes me think more about just growing regular old BFT. I guess it was a chance/accidental cross.

it doesn't have to be an unknown PL parent b'c there are many RL varieties that can spontaneously mutate to PL.

The larger question being, are all RL and PL versions of single variety the same except for leaf form. Opinions vary on that, the reason being that there's more than one kind of mutation that can change leaf form and in some cases more than just the single leaf form gene may change thus leading to other changes having to do, with, for instance taste or plant habit, etc.

I don't know of any commercial source for Spudatula so you might want to go to the Seed Exchange Forum here and in the Wanted subforum see if anyone has seeds they can share with you.

[Andrey_BY]

I'm gonna visit Tula (a Russian city with 500000 population) early in September visiting our potential wholesale customers and gonna present at least 10 seed packs of 20 BFT seeds to anybody who would like to try them at their farmers market . Black from Tula or Black Krim are still almost unknown in the present time Russia
So probably Spudatula seeds will be there next year

[RJ_Hythloday]

After some more reading around here, I see that maybe production is not all that high, and I might want to go ahead and save seed. Some people were talking 7 or 8 fruit from one plant as pretty normal.

I've had 3, had to toss one, 2 on the vine and one blossom. Lots of time for more blossoms to develop in the next month or two.

I'm thinking about crossing w/ Marianna's Peace and growing out F1 next year if the bloom sets.

[Tomstrees]

* - correction: after checking my records, my parents were able to get small blackish fruits from PL vines - seeds were saved and distributed.

[amideutch]

I'm growing BFT PL this year and just pulled 10 fruit off of it with more on the plant. Production was up there with Spudakee Purple and the flavor was Excellentee. I'm growing the plant in a 7gal container. Ami

http://www.tomatoville.com/attachmen...6&d=1250270795

[RJ_Hythloday]

The darker one looks to be similar to my BFT, are you indeed getting black fruit from both of you PL's?

[carolyn137]

Black from Tula is not really a black, I call it a pink/black b/c the epidermis is clear and the fruits are definitly pinkish and not the dark color of a Black Krim, etc., which I call red blacks b'c the ei[dermis is yellow.

If it was a single spontaneous mutation that allowed for a PL version to appear, then the PL version should be identical to the original except for leaf form.

If it arose from a more complicated method of mutation, as can happen, and then more than one gene is involved, it might explain why some get PL and some get RL, but I wouldn't think that the color should be significantly different than the original.

There are many PL versions of RL varieties now, and as I noted above, it really depends on how the PL, for instance, arose from the RL. Spontaneous single gene mutations are permanent and genetically stable, but those that involve more complicated mechanisms can then show differences from the original and leaf form may vary.

Spudakee is a good example. It's a PL Cherokee Purple. There's another PL Cherokee Purple that arose in Jere Gettle's tomato patch that he called Cherokee Purple Potato Leaf and has long beenlsited in the SSE Yearbooks.

Some who grow the original RL CP and compare it to either of the two Pl versions say they detect differences while others don't.

How many here have grown Black from Tula and compared it in all ways with Spudatula?

Another good example is Kellogg's Breakfast and its PL version KBX. I think almost everyone agrees that they are about the same except for leaf form, but there are those who say KBX produces more fruits.

Such comparisons between an original variety and a leaf form version really need to be grown in the same summer so that all the many variables can be kept to a minimum.

[amideutch]

Is this what you were looking for? Ami

[RJ_Hythloday]

That's very high production compared to the BFT in my garden. I think I'll have to rethink saving seed.

[amideutch]

RJ, a couple other tomatoes you may want to try if you havn't already are Spudakee Purple=Cherokee Purple PL and JD's Special C-Tex. I too agree with you on the taste of BFT and it will be a perennial in my mater patch. Ami

[RJ_Hythloday]

Thanks for the recommendations, I've just recently learned of spudakee, I've heard the name JD's special C-tex alot, it must be worth looking into. I learned one thing this year, not enough room to be growing out every variety, too many that just haven't earned their keep. But I'll be growing out at least 2 plants for the better varieties next year.