Combining Multiple Organic Ferts in Container mix

[deeb]

Hi all. New here. (I'm strictly organic, but also doing the container thing, and this is also a general question, so wasn't sure where to post this, so please forgive.)

Just purchasing all the stuff for planting out my heirloom toms in the next couple months in 15-gal containers (not swc). I'm creating a soil-less mix based on "Al's 5-1-1" which I'm sure some of you are familiar with.

My question is about adding fert to my mix and just want to make sure that what I'm thinking of doing won't burn my toms...by the way, my mix has no compost or anything like that, so all food will come from added fert...

Is it okay to combine both something like this Gardenville Rocket Fuel (2-6-1)...to get the transplant off to a strong start (link: http://bit.ly/eQtpTV )

...and also combine that into my soil mix along with this Rabbit Hill Farm Tomato and Pepper Food (2-1.5-3) for slow-release, long-term food. (link: http://bit.ly/faUzwe)

(And/Or possibly use Tomato Tone, but still can't tell for sure whether that's totally organic or not, so feedback on that is welcome.)

...and then I'll probably follow up with a weekly weak dose of liquid seaweed.

So, does anyone think I'll have any trouble combining BOTH a 2-6-1 AND a 2-1.5-3 into the same batch at the same time? Just making sure. Any recommendations are welcome, but organic options preferred.

Thanks!

[rnewste]

deeb,

The "new" Tomato-tone is rated as Organic, although in my personal experience, not as effective as the "old" Tomato-tone it replaced. I'm not familiar with the other 2 products you mention.

Raybo

[deeb]

Thanks Raybo. I've heard mixed feelings about the Tomato Tone, so thanks for your confirmation.

So, regardless of brand/model of fert, do you think combining/doubling up two mild ones around the 2-5-3 NPK range would burn? Just don't want to overdo it, but also want to make sure there's enough food for both the short term and long term.

[rnewste]

deeb,

My personal view is that it is better to under-fertilize, rather than hammering the plant with too much. I would err on the side of a light touch, then you can add more in as the Season progresses, if it is needed.

Also, Where did you find the Bark Fines? Someone else from Austin is looking for them.

Raybo

[amideutch]

Check out the "Organic Gardening Kit" from T&J enterprises at the link below. Ami

http://www.tandjenterprises.com/#Garden_Sales_Kit_

[creister]

I use the shredded pine bark that they sell at Lowe's in 2 and 3 cuf. bags. I am a long way from Austin, but if they sell it in Abilene, should not be a problem to fine in Austin.

You can also supplement with foliar feeding if your plants appear to need more nutrition.

[dice]

I would guess that 2-6-1 and 2-1.5-3 would be fine together.
That comes out to 4-7.5-4 if you add the recommended amount
of both for the size of the container. Some people use 10-10-10,
13-13-13, and fertilizers like those. (Admittedly they have rather
huge plants by the end of the season, and the high nitrogen may
delay fruitset a little.)

I would not expect to have a problem with it if I were using
those two fertilizers together. The kelp will add some potassium,
pushing the potassium percentage up close to the phosphorus
when fruit are ripening. Most experts say that is exactly what
you want for tomatoes.

[deeb]

Thanks everyone! Raybo, I found the closest thing to pine fines at Countryside garden center in north Austin on Pond Springs rd...up the road from Red Barn. It's 3 c/f bags of "Pine Bark Mulch" made by the Landscaper's Pride brand, which is locally made, in New Waverly, TX. Not quite big bulk piles and not as cheap as stuff sold at big boxes, but $7.95/bag (3 cf) ain't too bad. It's the finest ground I've found thus far, although I'll probably screen it a bit to eliminate some larger pieces. It looks like Landscaper's Pride also makes "Soil Conditioner," which appears to be finely pre-screened pine bark mulch, but I couldn't seem to find that. Their Pine Bark Mulch is pretty fine screened, by far the finest texture I've found so far, but again, it still has a few longer (2 inches or so) splinters that I'd prefer to screen out.

I looked at the options available at Lowes, WM, and HD, and everything I found at those places was too coarse. These options included Scotchman's Pride as well as other brands of Pine Bark Mulch. I also called around to Gardenville, Natural Gardener, and maybe a couple others and they all said that what they have in bulk is coarse, big chunks.

Thanks again everyone!

deeb

[chancethegardener]

Before I planted the tomatoes, I applied Sunleaves Peruvian seabird guano (12-11-2). As the plants grow and start to set fruits, I will dilute Sunleaves Indonesian bat guano (0.5-13-0.2) and apply it at the plant base. At the same time, I am planning to add Technaflora soluble seaweed extract (1-1-16) for potassium supplement.The garden mix in the raised bed also has Lambert organic soil+azomite+composted cow manure+earthworm castings+Miracle Gro garden soil with chemically derived fertilizer (I don't use MG anymore, it was in the raised bed already so I didn't remove it).

[panhandler]

I grow in containers 15-20 gallons. Higher-ratio nitrogen fertilization is good at early stage or transplant stage. By flowering I eliminate additional nitrogen ferts completely. Trace minerals are really important too. Rock dust, greensand, sul-po-mag, pulverized dolomite, etc. Mix them in your container mix before you transplant ideally.

[deeb]

Thanks chance and panhandler. Panhandler, I'll definitely be mixing in dolomite. Wasn't sure about the Greensand, since I've never used it, and wondering if it would be too much stuff to mix in all together at the same time into a new batch of soil, including the lime, two fertilizers, and greensand too. Looks like I'll just have to examine the NPK ratios to make sure they all combined won't add up to anything too strong...as opposed to spreading the applications out and applying separately over time.

Chance, just to be clear, you mix in the seabird guano in with the new batch of soil before planting, right...not to the plant before moving to the larger pot?

[chancethegardener]

Seabird guano is a "slow to release" fertilizer especially since the brand I use is granular and difficult to dilute in water. I mix it in the raised bed before I plant the tomatoes. However, I am growing tomatoes in large containers this year and I am adding the guano in small amounts to those containers, too. I will see what happens. When your tomatoes start flowering, you can consider decreasing the nitrogen you give. At this stage, you can try bat guano. The bat guano I use is powdered and a lot easier to mix in water. You can also constantly keep spraying the foliage with an organic liquid fertilizer (I use Botanicare) that has low NPK ratios at all stages of the plant life.

Also, as far as I know Azomite is alkaline but also has trace minerals in it and those minerals are beneficial for healthy plants. If you are growing in containers, don't add it too much (you can experiment on the amounts), though. Regarding the alkalinity, soil microorganisms balances the chemistry for us, unless you don't add something in extreme amounts.

By the way, after I posted the previous message, I applied the seaweed extract at the plant base and on the foliage. I must say this stuff is amazing. A few days after the application, the plants look a lot more healthier and stronger with lots of dark green foliage.

[deeb]

Thanks Chance. I use liquid seaweed for my seedlings and it really does an amazing job at taking their health and growth to a new level, literally.

[panhandler]

I'm trying out AZOMITE this year. I just got a 44 lb. bag of the stuff and I hope tastier food justifies the shipping cost! I've only read good things about it. I wish someone close by home sold the stuff though.

[panhandler]

deeb, I wouldn't sweat adding a little greensand. I go with 1 cup for every 10 gallons when you mix your pre-transplant media together. Approach as a pre-planting time conditioner. You can mix it in with equal amount bone meal, alfalfa meal, whatever organics you want and let them mellow for a couple or few weeks before planting time. Should make Al's 5-1-1 mix even better in my opinion.