TGRC S. Pimpinellifolium mass growout

[Fusion_power]

I requested seed of the S. Pimpinellifolium core collection from TGRC and received the seed today. My request was made for the express purpose of doing a mass growout to see if any of the lines have significant septoria tolerance. Here are the lines in the core collection:

LA0373, LA0400, LA0411, LA0417, LA0442, LA1237, LA1245, LA1246, LA1261, LA1279, LA1301, LA1335, LA1371, LA1375, LA1478, LA1521, LA1547, LA1576, LA1578, LA1582, LA1584, LA1586, LA1590, LA1593, LA1599, LA1602, LA1606, LA1617, LA1659, LA1683, LA1689, LA1924, LA1936, LA2102, LA2173, LA2181, LA2183, LA2401, LA2533, LA2852


My plan is simply to grow from 3 to 5 plants per selection and plant them enmasse at the north end of my garden where septoria is always such a problem. When They have produced fruit and can be evaluated for septoria, I plan on saving seed ONLY from plants with significantly less disease. Burgundy Traveller and Eva Purple Ball show slight levels of septoria tolerance. I will grow a few of them to see how they compare with the wild pimps. I also have a few selections of other wild tomato species such as S. Peruvianum and S. Chilense that have been found to have very high levels of septoria tolerance. Unfortunately, there are breeding problems with them that do not occur with the S. Pimpinellifolium lines.


I just had a very nice tomato for supper. It was from one of Randy Gardners crosses of Brandywine X a late blight/early blight tolerant line. The flavor was the best of the plants in the greenhouse so far. I have enough seed to grow out several plants next spring.



DarJones

[carolyn137]

Darrel, when you grow those out could you do something else and that's to check and see how many have exerted stigmas.

Keith M has said that about half do of the ones he's looked at. And that's information I didn't know before and I guess many don't when it comes to the geographic isolation recs for keeping pimps away from normal garden tomatoes. Keith has said he'd be more worried about his garden tomatoes X pollinating the currants than the reverse.

I agree that Randy's Brandy cross is pretty darn good. I can't assess it for many of the disease tolerances b/c I don'thave them here but the taste was darn good. One of the others I grew, I grew all four F1's he sent seeds for, was good too but right now I don't have the names in front of me.

And I think you must be involved with Randy and Mark and Keith on the Septoria issue as I recall from previous communications.

[Fusion_power]

I have some of Randy Gardner's disease tolerant lines and have asked frogleap (Mark) to send me some that he is growing. Keith has not really worked much with septoria tolerance.

The best online information I've found is that one will be released from Cornell as early as next year. There is a nice article from Brazil that gives some possibilities including LA1967 which I have seed and plan to grow.

I'll watch for the exerted stigmas. It is one trait among many that might be interesting to verify.

DarJones

[frogsleap farm]

Great project Darrel. I just got my TGRC shipment, so will be sending seed this week.

Mark

[Garf]

Would Everglades qualify as this type of tomato?

[Fusion_power]

The best I recall, Everglades is Solanum Lycopersicum var Cerasiforme

So it is not in the group S. Pimpinellifolium.

DarJones

[zipcode]

Septoria has been a serious problem in my garden since a few years. It complements late blight so well in the destruction of my tomatoes. Late blight acts in very rainy times, whatever is left is picked by septoria and continues even in very dry weather. Seems like morning dew is enough to keep it going strong.
A few years ago when the problem started, and I didn't know I had septoria (no internet) I had a variety that was very resistant to it. Seed saved from local market tomatoes, I planted some, got a veeery late tomato of a pale red, quite big, sort of roundish, but slightly long and ruffled. I didn't plant it again, but now that I know it's a disease (I thought leaves were drying from lack of water) I'm gonna try and see if I can germinate some.

[carolyn137]

Originally Posted by Fusion_power

The best I recall, Everglades is Solanum Lycopersicum var Cerasiforme

So it is not in the group S. Pimpinellifolium.

DarJones

And my understanding is that it's not a cerasiforme as is Matt's Wild Cherry, rather a true Solanum pimpinellifolium.

When the Spanish came north the missionaries and others spread currant tomatoes all along the Gulf Coast and into FL and one can see in the SSE YEarbook lots of listings for wild this and wild that.

THe Everglades one bcame very well known after a man put up a webiste many years ago, and it's still there, hyping it to the skies and also charging LOTS of money for seeds.

Just from feedback I've read online most folks consider it to be just another red currant. But again, if one considers exerted stigmas to be a feature of ALL pimps and that helps define what a pimp is, it would really be great to have confirmation of what Keith said in terms of not all so called pimps have exerted stigmas b'c if the stigmas are retracted as occurred with domestication, then that's one part of the definition of a cerasiforme.

And I would imagine that not all accessions or named varieties are pure pimps anyway b'c after I was given fruits that Amy had brought back from the Galapagos I contacted Dr. Chatelet at the TGRC and knowing the island it came from he could tell me that it was probably a stable interspecies cross. And there's been quite a bit of molecular work done on those wee fruited interspecies crosses in England.

[carolyn137]

Originally Posted by Garf

Would Everglades qualify as this type of tomato?

http://www.mgonlinestore.com/WFETomato/

Aha!

Above I mentioned that man who was hyping the Everglades tomato and as luck would have it I was just going through my faves list for something else and found the website, which I linked to above.

And it's that website that has lured so many folks to this red currant, or not red currant.

[Garf]

The germination ratio on mine was very low.

[Fusion_power]

Look at the leaves in the pics on that website.

Here is the line for S. Pimpinellifolium from the species key on TGRC.
1.2. Fruit diameter less than 1.5 cm, usually ca. 1 cm; leaf margin generally undulate or entire. ...S. pimpinellifolium


And here is a photo of the leaves of the wild florida everglades tomato.

While I will agree that the the fruit size is about right, the leaf structure is not typical Pimpinellifolium which should be a variant of potato leaf. The only place I've seen that particular leaf structure is on Matt's Wild Cherry (Cerasiforme) and Riesentraube (arguably Cerasiforme X Esculentum). Maybe someone with more experience can weigh in. As you said, it might be a stable cross or I might be wrong and it is pure Pimp.

With that said, current thinking is that Solanum Esculentum (our domestic tomato) is directly descended from Solanum Pimpinellifolium. That implies few differences overall.

DarJones

[Garf]

They are a bit small yet, but this is what I was sold to be Everglades.

[mdvpc]

Darrel:

I just got this variety from nativeseeds.org, a place in Tucson. I wonder if this is pimp. If you want some seed to try, pm me.

http://www.nativeseeds.org/catalog/p...roducts_id=815

[Keen101]

Darrel and Frogsleap, how did LA0530 do for you? I'm growing it this year. Was intrigued by the description of orange-brown fruits.