What is in Big Zac?

[icelord]

Can anyone tell me the makeup of the Big Zac, and can the seeds be replanted? I have my suspicions,Maybe Giant Belgium and possibly Brandywine Sudduths? Icelord

[carolyn137]

Originally Posted by icelord

Can anyone tell me the makeup of the Big Zac, and can the seeds be replanted? I have my suspicions,Maybe Giant Belgium and possibly Brandywine Sudduths? Icelord

Minnie Zaccariah, who bred it has said that one of the parents his her own family heirloom. I don't think she's ever said what the other parent is.

She gave exclusive rights to Totally Tomatoes, when it was owned by Wayne Hilton before he solod out to Jung's, to sell Big Zac, which is a hybrid. All was well for a while and then the blurb at TT said to rogue out this and that which meant that there were big problems.

Minnie was asked to come to Garden Web and explain and she said that they hadn't used the right method, or whatever, for her Big Zac and she hoped the problem would be solved.

In the interim there were several seed sites that were selling Big Zac and not Iding that it was F2 seeds they were selling. Not good.

With the switch to the current TT owned by Jung's apparentyl they are now selling the correct F1 Big Zac.

But, year after year I've read the reports of folks who grow it and seldom do they get anything over a couple of pounds. And there are lots of other varieties, OP's, that can match that and more IMO.

I don't grow tomatoes for size, I grow them almost exclusively for taste, so I don't care what size or shape or color a variety has, I just want that taste.

[icelord]

Thank you Carolyn, I to grow for taste I was just curious because we have so many other hybrid O.Ps even from members here I didnt understand why this one would make it to the comercial level and not half of the nice stuff I have been reading about on this site! By the way, I also have your book.
Thank You, Dean

[kygreg]

There is some character on EBAY selling Big Zac's stating that it holds the world's record - about 8 3/4 lb if I remember. I wrote and asked him about it and where the record was recorded; he emailed me back that he grew it himself and he knew what it weighed. I assume people are buying these seeds since they continue to be sold on EBAY; wonder what results they have produced.

[carolyn137]

Originally Posted by kygreg

There is some character on EBAY selling Big Zac's stating that it holds the world's record - about 8 3/4 lb if I remember. I wrote and asked him about it and where the record was recorded; he emailed me back that he grew it himself and he knew what it weighed. I assume people are buying these seeds since they continue to be sold on EBAY; wonder what results they have produced.

Big Zac does not hold the world's record, the variety Delicious does, as grown by Gordon Graham of OK and it was 7# 12 oz.

Just this past week a Big Zac of 7.18 lbs won a contest and it wasn't even the F1 hybrid, is was an F4.

At GW this is being discussed and the thread started by Marv Meissner who wrote the recent book about growing large tomatoes.

Marv also said that the only person who knows the parents of Big Zac F1 are Minnie and perhaps the folks who do the hybridizing for retail sale although, and now I'm implying, she could have coded the ID's. but I also know that she apparently told someone that one of the parents was her own family heirloom.

So no definitive answers..

[icelord]

I Know who if he wanted to, could figure it out!! tw... that was a whisper

he probably knows anyway!!!

[carolyn137]

Originally Posted by icelord

I Know who if he wanted to, could figure it out!! tw... that was a whisper

he probably knows anyway!!!

Nope, Tom wouldn't know either. Actually he doesn't pay that much attention to tomato varieties other than the ones he uses in his breeding programs.

The definitive way would be to do a DNA analyisis, but that wouldn't work either b'c you have to have the analysis of the suspected/known parents to compare with and that's not possible.

And only partial DNA maps have been analyzed and those were involved with law suits by a few commercial growers who claimed they weren't sold the seeds they expected. It costs lots of money to have that done and it's done in only a few labs, mainly those doing research but a few labs will do contract work .

I've known Tom since about 1990 so I do know him fairly well, and we've aged together, me on the East Coast and he on the West Coast.

[icelord]

I know I am pushing it, but what would a really good educated guess be?
I myself would think, perhaps...Giant Belgium and maybe a brandywine. Only because of shape and size. It really isn't horrible to eat either!

Dean

[carolyn137]

Originally Posted by icelord

I know I am pushing it, but what would a really good educated guess be?
I myself would think, perhaps...Giant Belgium and maybe a brandywine. Only because of shape and size. It really isn't horrible to eat either!

Dean

Dean, I don't have a guess, educated or uneducated.

All I can say is that Big Zac F1 is a large red beefsteak variety and what Minnie used for the two parents only she knows. And given the fact that she was early on participating in contests in NJ as well as being written about by Bob Ambrose, also in NJ, in his Tomato Newsletter, now defunct, she had access to any number of varieties. She would have had access to 100's of varieties she could have used at that time and where she lived and she's never said what other varieties she grew for her own personal use at home, other than the one mention that came not from her that she had her own family heirloom.

Since her last name indicates she might be Italian, I don't even know if she is married, then her own family heirloom was probably red as most Italian ones are. but off hand I can't think of any really large red beefsteak varieties of Italian origin so maybe she used that one for taste and crossed it with something else for size.

Just no way of knowing as I see it.

Giant Belgium and Brandywine are both pink so that if they were used the other parent had to be red, since red is dominant to pink in terms of coloration b'c the yellow epidermis makes red tomatoes red and a clear epidermis makes for a pink .

[OneoftheEarls]

mine never looked like this


Mine look like this:

[OneoftheEarls]

and...

[icelord]

Amazing!!! I love when 5 tomatoes take up a whole tailgate!! And thank you Carolyn, I know it is one of the unsolved mysteries in the ever wonderful world of tomatoes!!

Dean

[geeboss]

Earl

Those maters will make one large football size sub BLT. Yummmmm


I'm just happy to have maters and BLT's this year..... next year will be learning more on production and quality thanks to the helping hands here and GW. Now with some dwarfs for the path way in the backyard hopefully my DW won't object to the rest of the jungle. Must remember to make 8 1/2 ft T poles to organize that jungle.

george

[cortona]

wath is strange for the resultant f2 of big zac ibrid is that are almost identical to the ibrid! no variation at all!(and this is something that cal or not ibrid at all or ibrid wit two lines of the same variety!)
the important trait that bigzac are bred for are the fused(crested?) flower that form 2 to 5 tomatoes fused togheter in a a monster one!
i bred for size to and if we look at the result the real deal are not the real ibrid(that grow big one but not the biggest) but as stated the f3 /4 that come from the bigger one selected from the f2 of big special one!

[dustdevil]

OneOTE, when and where did you buy your Big Zac seed from?