Sticky..Seed Saving.

[beeman]

I am a newbie to this forum and trying to glean information on seed saving. I am having a time trying to extract information from all the posts available.

Would it be possible for a "Sticky" on the most popular aspects of seed saving and the various methods of disinfecting seeds? PLEASE!

There are so many knowledgeable individuals on this forum I'm sure we could all learn from a write up of the salient points they have discovered. Might just save a great deal of new posts asking questions.

[dice]

(I will let someone else handle the sticky.)

The best two fermenting guides that I have seen:
http://tatianastomatobase.com/wiki/A...g_Fermentation
http://www.victoryseeds.com/informat...ve_tomato.html

(I basically use the second guide, which I read before Ted
created the first one, plus I use a little TSP on the seeds in
a strainer when I find seeds where the fermenting has not
quite finished when I am cleaning them, and I finish off with
a 1-2 minute bleach soak in laundry bleach diluted about
1 part bleach in 4 parts water.)

[huntsman]

Don't wish to hijack this thread, but does this method work for other seeds? Say, peppers and eggplant?

[ContainerTed]

Thanks, Dice.

Beeman, there's another one you should see. At "Wintersown.org" Trudi has a pretty good procedure using cleaning/scouring powders.

Note that the common goal is to get the gel off the tomato seeds, reduce/eliminate pathogens, and then dry/store them.

Huntsman, I've used the fermentation method on tomato and tomatillo seeds, but not on eggplant. With peppers, I spread the seed out on a paper plate and let them dry. Just before planting, I do a quick 1 minute bleach soak like Dice described.

Ted

[robin303]

Feldon has a tutorial on saving seeds that I have been using for two seasons. Can’t find the thread on it dog gone it.

[dice]

I do not have this book yet, but I have seen many
recommendations for it on various forums:

http://www.chelseagreen.com/bookstore/item/361

(Covers more than just tomatoes.)

[mjc]

For straight seed saving Ashworth's Seed to Seed is probably the better choice.

[beeman]

Originally Posted by dice

(I basically use the second guide, which I read before Ted
created the first one, plus I use a little TSP on the seeds in
a strainer when I find seeds where the fermenting has not
quite finished when I am cleaning them, and I finish off with
a 1-2 minute bleach soak in laundry bleach diluted about
1 part bleach in 4 parts water.)

This is all begining to make sense now. Explains why I have out of four plants only one that is doing well.I did not know that seed should be 'cleaned' to prevent disease transmission. Makes sense.

So one step further,
Keeping seed from a successful growing plant is acceptable, even if a sister plant fails due to wilt? Supposed to be VFFN, but most have failed!

I did save seed from my last years peppers, no fermentation, no disinfectant, no disease this year.
Thanks to all.

[feldon30]

Originally Posted by robin303

Feldon has a tutorial on saving seeds that I have been using for two seasons. Can’t find the thread on it dog gone it.

Here you go:

http://www.settfest.com/2009/01/saving-seeds/

and thanks for the ringing endorsement.

[huntsman]

Originally Posted by ContainerTed

Thanks, Dice.



Huntsman, I've used the fermentation method on tomato and tomatillo seeds, but not on eggplant. With peppers, I spread the seed out on a paper plate and let them dry. Just before planting, I do a quick 1 minute bleach soak like Dice described.

Ted

Thank you, Ted.

[dice]

Supposed to be VFFN, but most have failed!

Could be bacterial wilt. If you cut a wilted branch and stick
the cut end in water in a clear container, there will be a milky
discharge into the water if the problem is bacterial wilt. (I
often see it called "Southern bacterial wilt", so I wonder how
much of a problem it really is in cooler soils.)

I do not know whether bacterial wilt is seed borne, but there
are several tomato diseases that are seed-borne, so the bleach
soak is a wise precaution. Fermentation will kill most of them,
but large scale seed production in commercial fields usually
does not use fermentation, but rather some kind of mechanical
process for separating seeds from pulp, so disinfecting the
seeds some way is probably a necessary followup to separating
the seeds from the tomatoes.

(There are some bacterial wilt resistant strains, but small size
and uninteresting flavor has initially been associated with
the combinations of genes that provide resistance to that
disease, so they have not been especially popular. Information
from a research report from North Carolina.)

[beeman]

Originally Posted by dice

Could be bacterial wilt. If you cut a wilted branch and stick
the cut end in water in a clear container, there will be a milky
discharge into the water if the problem is bacterial wilt.

I had already determined that it's not bacterial wilt having tested all dead and dying plants.
There are two distinct wilts in my garden. One affects the whole plant, green from top to bottom. Verticillium?
The other starts on one side at the bottom, leaves go yellow then slowly the whole side wilts. Fusarium?
I have discovered that Actinovate will 'cure' the second version, by adding it around the roots, after pulling the mulch to one side, then water it in.
Next year I'll start at plant out.

You missed the second question, so if you don't mind I'll repeat it.
"Keeping seed from a successful growing plant is acceptable, even if a sister plant fails due to wilt?"

[dice]

"Keeping seed from a successful growing plant is acceptable, even if a sister plant fails due to wilt?"

Consider the alternative: every cultivar that has even one
plant of it affected by disease is eliminated entirely from the
gene pool by no one saving seeds of it from any plants, even
healthy ones.

If you want to do that on your own, of course, that is up to you.
Others may make different choices (attack the disease other
ways, because some of the cultivars with no tolerance for that
disease have other redeeming qualities, like great flavor and/or
production).

There is no reason that seeds from the healthy plant would be
carrying the disease.

(Note that the question is a little odd in a "supposed to be
VFFN" context, which is probably an F1 hybrid. Saved seeds
would not come true.)

As for your description, both "types" could be the same
disease (I am thinking verticillium, but one would need
some kind of lab test to be absolutely certain), where
the whole plant wilts green in cultivars with no tolerance
whatsoever for the disease while plants of cultivars with
some tolerance for it only wilt partially.

Edit:
Ironically, that is the approach that I take with perennials around
the yard. If they get disease, they go into the trash, because
I refuse to spray them for diseases. There are just too many
available to put up with varieties that cannot withstand local
plant diseases on their own.

[Blueaussi]

Originally Posted by dice

Edit:
Ironically, that is the approach that I take with perennials around
the yard. If they get disease, they go into the trash, because
I refuse to spray them for diseases. There are just too many
available to put up with varieties that cannot withstand local
plant diseases on their own.

*nods*

I'm not going to put a lot of time and effort into a plant that's never going to be happy in my yard.

[beeman]

Originally Posted by dice

There is no reason that seeds from the healthy plant would be
carrying the disease.
(Note that the question is a little odd in a "supposed to be
VFFN" context, which is probably an F1 hybrid. Saved seeds
would not come true.)
As for your description, both "types" could be the same
disease (I am thinking verticillium, but one would need
some kind of lab test to be absolutely certain), where
the whole plant wilts green in cultivars with no tolerance
whatsoever for the disease while plants of cultivars with
some tolerance for it only wilt partially.
Edit:
Ironically, that is the approach that I take with perennials around
the yard. If they get disease, they go into the trash, because
I refuse to spray them for diseases. There are just too many
available to put up with varieties that cannot withstand local
plant diseases on their own.

Good Stuff, Thanks.
But if I adopted your approach I wouldn't have much growing in the garden. I cannot find cultivars which will stand up to the wilts I have going on.This is trial and error over many years.
I have for example two plants side-by-side, both the same cultivars, for me quite incredible, big, healthy with tons of tomatoes, a sister plant next to it has wilted down to almost nothing.
So I plan, saved seeds per your instructions, Actinovate at plant out time, compost tea and lots of it.
I am determined to get a good year with healthy plants and a full compliment even if they don't grow 'true'. With your help and the advice from this forum, and the good graces from the Tomato Gods I will make it next year.
Any further suggestions?