Burpee

[pmcgrady]

Just got a Burpee seed catalog and was going thru the tomato and pepper seeds...
It looks like they take an OP variety, rename it ( for example Shish!to and call it Dragon Roll Hybrid or Bishops Cap and call it Mad Hatter Hybrid) call it a hybrid and charge a lot for the seeds.

[carolyn137]

Originally Posted by pmcgrady

Just got a Burpee seed catalog and was going thru the tomato and pepper seeds...
It looks like they take an OP variety, rename it ( for example Shish!to and call it Dragon Roll Hybrid or Bishops Cap and call it Mad Hatter Hybrid) call it a hybrid and charge a lot for the seeds.

You are absolutely correct.

I gave up on Burpee several decades ago. And there are some threads here at Tville,I'm not going to try to find them, where several customers called them and said they were confused with some of the names they were using that were knock-offs of
legitimate variety names.

And one of those who called I know was Bill Jeffers.

Here's some history for you

https://www.google.com/search?q=Hist...&bih=815&dpr=1

I think many knew them after WWII when they encouraged many to plant what they called Victory Gardens, meaning veggies,not flowers.

I still have a Burpee catalog that my then neighbor gave to me and it says on the cover,in huge red letters,Victory Garden Seeds.

Carolyn

[TC_Manhattan]

Originally Posted by pmcgrady

Just got a Burpee seed catalog and was going thru the tomato and pepper seeds...
It looks like they take an OP variety, rename it ( for example Shish!to and call it Dragon Roll Hybrid or Bishops Cap and call it Mad Hatter Hybrid) call it a hybrid and charge a lot for the seeds.

Is that even legal?

[carolyn137]

Originally Posted by TC_Manhattan

Is that even legal?

See above, my post #2.

Carolyn

[Cole_Robbie]

Originally Posted by TC_Manhattan

Is that even legal?

Good question. I doubt there is any attorney general who would sue them on behalf of the state in civil court, nor pursue criminal charges. That would leave the option of a civil suit by an individual. However, the catch is the rule that "damages must be foreseeable." And that would limit your damages to the cost of the seed packet. So it is not worth pursuing.

[pmcgrady]

I do realize they have legitimate hybrids (Orange Slice, Big Mama, etc) but it's pretty much blatant renaming of OP varieties as their own F1 hybrids... Wow!

[clkeiper]

Have you noticed their prices? OH MMM GEEE! I like some of their varieties. the ones I have grown they really are hybrids. if they are renamed from another hybrid I can't say but WHO pays their prices? I was thinking... just thinking... of ordering a few but the "honey comb" variety they have on the front cover is 6.00 for 15 seeds. buy their plants? a three pack is 20.00 plus shipping. another 10.00 for that. no, I just can't part with that much money for so few seeds.

[pmcgrady]

Originally Posted by clkeiper

Have you noticed their prices? OH MMM GEEE! I like some of their varieties. the ones I have grown they really are hybrids. if they are renamed from another hybrid I can't say but WHO pays their prices? I was thinking... just thinking... of ordering a few but the "honey comb" variety they have on the front cover is 6.00 for 15 seeds. buy their plants? a three pack is 20.00 plus shipping. another 10.00 for that. no, I just can't part with that much money for so few seeds.

I've been doing some looking, I think Burpee buys a lot of seed from Sakata Seed Japan/America and re sells it.

Check out SeedsnSuch.com-- their prices are $2.79 for all seeds, and less when you buy more than 9 packs-- I have purchased from them for 3 years and am very happy with them.

[mikemansker]

I got a Burpee's catalog too. Skimmed it and looked at the prices. In the trash. I much prefer Totally Tomatoes, SeedsNSuch or Baker's Creek.

[oldman]

On April 1st someone should call and tell them people are reselling their hybrids as OP with different names. Ask if they'd consider suing for the damage to their brand.

If they agree that damages their brand would they admit their deception damages the brand of people selling the heirlooms they have renamed?

Thinking about those kinds of questions is the reason I never studied law.

[zipcode]

I mean, they could be hybrids, not sure why is everyone concluding that because it looks the same it is the same. There are hybrid Jalapenos that look like Jalapenos or hybrid Padrons that look like Padrons.

And Johnny is also selling the Mad Hatter.

[DonDuck]

I've grown the " Mad Hatter" pepper for many years under the names of Bishops Hat and Bishops Crown and I grow it every year from seed I harvested from my garden. It continues to grow true every year. My seed is not hybridized. Looking at photos of both Mad Hatter and Bishops Crown, they appear identical, but so many things can be changed through hybridization, I don't know if they are the same or not. Actually Bishops Crown already has a lot of names and Mad Hatter can easily be added to the list. My primary concern is the accuracy of the belief that it may be an f1 hybrid because it could dissuade people from saving seed if they want to.

[zendog]

I see their seed packs in racks at Home Depot and other places, for $1.98 per pack, etc. They don't have all of their varieties, but it seems a bit ridiculous that if I bought Sweet basil online from them for instance it is $5.19 plus shipping, but so much cheaper at Home Depot. It might be a different seed count, but I'm not even sure about that. And how many basil seeds would I need?

I actually grew the Cimmaron lettuce from the Home Depot rack display one year, when I was worried the 2 older packs from other vendors I had wouldn't germinate. I planted rows of all three packs and the old ones came up fine, but the Burpee seed germination was around 25%. That was their last purchase from me.

[Fred Hempel]

I am also confused about conclusions that Mad Hatter is not a hybrid, but an OP.

Because this would implicate more than just Burpee in a grand conspiracy.

It would implicate the breeder -- Pan American Seeds

It would implicate the AAS Trialing non-profit, who trials and selects All-American selections. Mad Hatter is an All-American Selection.

It would also implicate Johnny's, Totally Tomato, Park Seed, and a number of other sellers of the variety.

And the evidence for this grand conspiracy is what? Photos in the Burpee catalog that show peppers that look similar to known OP varieties?

Just because it is a Bishop's Crown type pepper does not make it an OP pepper.

Are all red cherry tomatoes Matt's Wild Cherry? Are there no red hybrid cherry tomatoes because they all look like red cherry tomatoes in catalogs?

Have OPs ever been sold as hybrids? I am sure they have.

Can OPs sold as hybrids be identified by images in a catalog? Nope.

But hey, don't want to ruin a good conspiracy theory...

Originally Posted by zipcode

I mean, they could be hybrids, not sure why is everyone concluding that because it looks the same it is the same. There are hybrid Jalapenos that look like Jalapenos or hybrid Padrons that look like Padrons.

And Johnny is also selling the Mad Hatter.