Rescuing Old Beans

[MrsTwigg]

Hi there,

I'm a new member to this site, and though I joined for the purpose of talking about tomatoes, the garden project I am most looking forward to this year is to attempt to grow and collect fresh bean seeds from some old (~15 years) beans that I have. I'm looking for any words of encouragement you more experienced gardeners here may be able to direct my way, as well as any comments or suggestions you may have. I plan to come back and update this thread as things progress.

The story on these beans is this: A couple years ago, my Mom gave me a ziplock bag half full of beans that had been saved by my aunt, who died in 2003 of cancer. She had been ill for a long time before she passed, so I'm pretty sure that she last grew these beans at least a couple years previous to her death--I'm guessing they're around 15 years old. I suppose they had been hidden somewhere until my Mom found them after going through the last few boxes of my Aunt's things. They're quite pretty, being mottled black and white as they are, and at least visually seem to be in perfect shape.

I've since come across some mention on this site about being able to bring back to life very old tomato seeds, so I wonder if I might be able to apply the same approach to these beans. In fact, I now wish I had tried to grow them out immediately after Mom gave them to me, but at the time I thought there was no hope of my being able to re-awaken them...plus, at the time, I was barely beginning to get my feet wet with regard to growing anything from seed.

Now I finally feel like I am ready to try! My aunt was devoted to "old-school" pursuits--she was a talented leather-worker, a skilled outdoorswoman who grew a lot of her own food, as well as holding a professional crabbing license (these can't be purchased--they are passed down in families, where I live), as well as being an amateur genealogist who traced my family's history in the area where I live back to the 17th century. It may sound corny (beany?) but these beans are all I have from my Aunt, and they really symbolize a lot more to me than just a random bag of seeds might...I'd like to think they meant something to her, and now I'd like to save them since, to me at least, they are an important memento of the past.

My intention is, come spring, to soak some of these beans overnight in some water into which I've dissolved some Miracle-Gro, at the rate of about 1 tsp to the gallon of water--I've read that the nitrates from the fertilizer can help old seeds sprout. I then plan to plant them shallowly in some prepared pots of seed-starting mix and place them on a heat mat under lights. If I get any to germinate, I'll then immediately transplant them very carefully into a prepared spot in the garden. If you've read this far, please feel free to let me know what you think of my plan. I'd appreciate any comments!

I'll be keeping my fingers crossed once I get things started...which won't be until late April at the earliest, because I want to make sure the garden soil is nice and warm if I'm lucky enough to get any to sprout. Wish me luck!

[Starlight]

Mrs. Twigg.... If they were my beans, I would not soak them in water with Miracle Grow. Even diluted, the MG can and probably will burn your radicle, the emerging root tip.

I have a lot of old beans and even cucumbers that are like 15 years and older and when I want to try and rejuvenate those seeds, especially if I only have a few. I will only soak, them for a few hours in warm, not hot water with some hydrogen peroxide. That will kick start the seeds and won't burn your root tip in the process.

Most folks won't even use watered down MG on seedlings until they are a week or two old to keep from burning the roots.

Depending upon how many beans you have, I would start with three beans. Put in a small like 6 ounce size juice glass of warm water. Say before you go to bed. Add about a half a capfull of the hydrogen peroxide. Let sit someplace where it is not hot, but where the room is fairly warm.

In the morning rinse the seeds off and plant in soil and give them light and some heat of about 65F-70F . You should start to see sprouts in a few days.

[rxkeith]

darryl jones aka fusion power had a thread somewhere about germinating some old bean seeds of his grandma. four hours might be the max. to soak the beans, definitely not overnight, and without miracle grow. sow the seeds in cell packs using a seed starter mix, and just barely cover the seeds. seedlings may be weak when sprouting. once they are up and growing, gently transplant outside once weather is favorable.
darryl will probably pop in and share his expertise.
i germinated some bush romano seeds that were 10 yrs or older following his advice.
good luck, and keep us posted.


keith

[MrsTwigg]

Thank you both! Sounds like I won't soak them overnight. I was just thinking that they'd be pretty dried out and in need of a long period of rehydration. The hydrogen peroxide must help break down the hard seed coat in some way...I will definitely try that method.

So no Miracle-Gro. Alrighty then.

I must say I'm glad to hear that you two have been successful starting old beans...thanks for sharing your experiences; I'd once read that bean seeds are only good for 2-3 years!

[Zeedman]

Originally Posted by MrsTwigg

So no Miracle-Gro. Alrighty then.

While I would not use Miracle Grow (because I do not support the parent company) the use of some nitrogen-containing fertilizer is helpful when resuscitating old beans. My technique is similar to Fusion's; it is posted on several forums as 'nitrate soak method'.

I don't recommend soaking old beans in water (with or without fertilizer), since pathogens present on any one seed could contaminate the entire batch. A light soak in hydrogen peroxide might sterilize some pathogens on the surface, so although I have never tried that, it could be helpful as a pre-treatment.

My preferred method is to plant the beans in cells filled with sterile soil less mix, then to soak the beans - in soil - with a nitrate solution. The solution can be made by adding a teaspoon of liquid fertilizer to a gallon of water; if an organic fertilizer is used, it should be boiled to sterilize it. I add enough solution to the tray to thoroughly saturate the soil, and allow it to soak over night. In the morning, I pour off all excess solution, and place the tray in a warm location (preferably close to 80 degrees F.). If the soil begins to dry, I add sterile water.

For the oldest seeds, I will fill cells part way with seed starting mix, pack that down, lay the bean on top, then cover with fine sand. The sand makes it easier for weak seeds to break the surface. I can't over-emphasize the importance of sterility when resuscitating old seed. Because the seeds take longer to germinate, they are more susceptible to pathogens.

[AlittleSalt]

When using Hydrogen Peroxide for the purpose listed above, do you dilute it with water? Once per week for my pepper and tomato seedlings, I top water with a hydrogen peroxide solution that I dilute 10 parts water to 1 part hydrogen peroxide. Is this dilution rate acceptable for the purpose of this thread or would it be too weak?

MrsTwigg, I meant to write, "Welcome to Tomatoville".

[MrsTwigg]

Thanks, Zeedman. Your points about trying to avoid contamination are well taken. I also like the idea of using something fine, like sand, to cover the beans. I do have a large amount of vermiculite, I wonder if that would be equally acceptable? Unfortunately, I think my bag of vermiculite contains Miracle-Gro...can't seem to get away from the stuff...sometimes it seems like it's in everything. Anyway, if I do go the nitrate-soak method I would imagine I shouldn't over-do it. Maybe I'll try to track down some sand or (plain) vermiculite for this purpose.

Since I have a fair amount of beans, I can probably afford to try a couple different methods with a few at a time. Should make for an interesting comparison, if nothing else.

In another post I mentioned this would be my first season starting veggies under lights. Well, I bought my shoplight and the t8 bulbs for it today (I'll be starting eggplants and maybe peppers this weekend, and 'maters soon, so I need to get all this set up shortly). By the time the beans are (hopefully) sprouting, though, all these other plants will be out in the garden and there should be plenty of space for a fair number of baby bean plants under the 4-foot light. I do regret giving away my good-sized seedling heat mat, though...the one remaining one I have is small and narrow. It might be enough for a dozen or so beans in individual pots at a time. Well, I'll cross that bridge when I come to it.

Oh, and I'll second ALittleSalt's question. Is straight hydrogen peroxide okay to use? I'd imagine so--I just checked a bottle of the stuff that's in my medicine cabinet and it says it's already diluted to a 3% solution. Apparently it can be used straight as an "oral debriding agent," too. Hmm. However, I can see that Starlight's method calls for diluting it further, and that would be my instinct as well. Just wondering what others do.

[mdvpc]

MrsTwigg

I think you have good ideas on your beans.

In reading your thread, I noted you are going to start your eggplants and peppers first, then your tomatoes later. I am curious why you would do that-my tomatoes are always started 4-6 weeks before my eggplant and peppers. Tomatoes can tolerate cooler temps than eggplant and peppers-if the latter two are planted out before its quite warm, they sulk.

[Father'sDaughter]

Welcome MrsTwigg!

From the advice you've gotten, your question on waking up the old bean seeds seems to be covered and I wish you lots of luck!

The only question I have with your original plan is that you say you will plant them out immediately after they sprout. If it were me, I would look into leaving them in the pots long enough for them to develop a bit more. Many will tell you beans should always be direct sown. If you're careful, it is possible to successfully grow beans from transplants. All of mine are started in pots indoors (or outdoors if we're having a mild spring) a few weeks before plant out.

Where the advice for old seeds seems to require starter cells, maybe someone can chime in on how long after germination can they be safely moved out to the garden.

As for the timing of starting your other seeds, it's how I start mine. My peppers and eggplants are all started about 12-14 weeks before plant out. They are very slow growers in my 60-65 degree basement and if I don't start them that early, they end up going out in late May as tiny little plants. With a shorter growing season, it means they won't produce much before the cooler temps arrive. The tomatoes grow a bit faster, so they get started 8-10 weeks before plant out.

[Zeedman]

Originally Posted by Father'sDaughter

Many will tell you beans should always be direct sown. If you're careful, it is possible to successfully grow beans from transplants. All of mine are started in pots indoors (or outdoors if we're having a mild spring) a few weeks before plant out.

Provided that you are not growing for dry seed, or if your season is long enough for seed to mature, then beans are better off if direct seeded. It is good practice to start old seed as transplants, though; you have better control over germination conditions, no seedling is wasted by thinning, and you get a better stand. In my climate, unpredictable Spring weather often delays planting - sometimes for weeks (as it did last year). If I am unable to direct seed on time, I start beans intended for seed indoors, so less time is lost waiting for good weather. Long-season beans like limas and yardlongs would be very unreliable if I did not use transplants, so I always start those indoors.

Where the advice for old seeds seems to require starter cells, maybe someone can chime in on how long after germination can they be safely moved out to the garden.

Bean seedlings will quickly get leggy under most artificial lighting, so I move the transplants into direct sunlight immediately after germination. Weather permitting, they go into the ground when the first true leaf has begun to grow, which is approximately 10-14 days after planting. If transplanting is delayed (or if the intent is to start them earlier) you can wait up to 3-4 weeks, but there may be some stunting.

As for the timing of starting your other seeds, it's how I start mine. My peppers and eggplants are all started about 12-14 weeks before plant out. They are very slow growers in my 60-65 degree basement and if I don't start them that early, they end up going out in late May as tiny little plants. With a shorter growing season, it means they won't produce much before the cooler temps arrive. The tomatoes grow a bit faster, so they get started 8-10 weeks before plant out.

I start my transplants in a similar sequence, but under warmer conditions, growth is a little faster. Squash peppers first (about -12 weeks before transplant) since they are slow growing; then C. annuum peppers and eggplant at -8 weeks, tomatoes at -6/-7, and tomatillos at -5. When those go outside to harden off, I start cucurbits (at about -2 weeks), and beans as soon as those have germinated.

[MrsTwigg]

Great information, thanks.

And yes, I was planning on starting my eggplants early due to my understanding that they take a little longer to germinate and get underway with good growth. Peppers, too.

I'll probably start my tomatoes sometime the first week in March, with the expectation of setting them out in the garden mid-April. (Average day of last frost for me is April 6th). As for eggplants and peppers, I tend to always get these transplanted outdoors around May 1st, by which time I feel pretty sure the soil is warm, along with the melons, squash, and whatnot that I direct-sow. Per Zeedman's post, though, I may experiment with starting the normally-direct-sown things a couple weeks early, indoors. Might as well make the most of my shoplight this season, especially if it helps me speed up the harvest of some things that conk out in the doldrums of summer for me anyway (cukes I am looking at you!)

Again, thanks for all the tips and advice. I am learning a great deal here!