Looking for information on some that are new to me...

**nctomatoman** · January 29, 2006

I've accumulated alot of varieties that are new to me, and can fit only so many in the garden in 2006. Aside from pictures on Reinhard Kraft's site and some GW descriptions that have slipped my mind, I am looking for leaf shape/color/flavor for the following:

The Feraltomato (Brad) varieties (likely not yet fully stable) that I got from a GW member (some) and Reinhard (the rest)

Red Velvet
Beauty Queen
Beauty King
Yellow Zebra
Red Boar
Blonde Zebra
Berkeley Tie Dye
Furry Yellow Hog
Freckled Child
Yellow Striped Boar
Furry Red Boar
Big Yellow Zebra
Blonde Boar
Small Pink Stripe
Large Pink Striped
Boars Hoof
Giant Green Zebra

GW trades and shares:

Mountaineer Mystery
Persey
Mutant Stick (Bully, does the mutant form show clearly right away? what were the fruit like compared with "normal" stick?)
Goose Creek
Ledoux Special
Zluta Kytice
Granny Cantrell's German Red
Grandpa Ludolph German Red
Mr. Fumo
Humph
Mama Leone
Yasenichki Yabuchar
Ethel Watkins Best
Evans Purple Pear
Haley's Purple Comet
Tlacolula Ribbed
Rena's Turban
Himmelssturmer
Green Thumb
Corbarino
Green Velvet
Ilka

Looking for any on this list that are MUST grow varieties!

PNW_D · January 29, 2006

Greetings Craig,

Persey
This one is a must grow, my all round best in 2005 nice plant size for pot, delicious taste, good production and disease resistance, good keeper.
Rich, sweet, creamy, with vague acid follow up. Likely a good canner and keeper, but red, not pink. Prolific, extremely healthy plant, and my earliest to set fruit. Small Det. One from Andrey's seed share.

clay199 · January 30, 2006

D,
About Persey, how productive was it and how big were the fruits?
thanks, Clay

ps. How many plants you going to squeeze in this year?

**carolyn137** · January 30, 2006

Craig, quite a few on your second list are already listed in the SSE Yearbook.

And it looks like "N" in NYS sent you both Mama Leone and Humph.

A must grow is Mama Leone and I've described it several times. Want me to do it again? LOL I had planned to send you a few seeds of it, so glad to know you already have it since I have so few seeds. Humph is another green when ripe, indet, RL, etc., that "N" listed in the 2005 Yearbook and you might want to try it as well. For me it still didn't reach the excellence of Cherokee Green, which I still like better than Green Giant.

I'll take a look at the rest of that list later. It's been just a funfilled day here, not, LOL, and it's either a nap or early to bed for me. LOL

Carolyn

PNW_D · January 31, 2006

Clay, will post my grow list shortly in the relevant thread - still can't decide on my early, and now have a few more 'must grows' to consider.

Anyhoo, as for Persey, a small slicer from what I recall. Unfortunately I had a computer crash back in October just when I had finished adding all my digital pictures to my grow out data list. Didn't keep a lot of written notes, was counting on the pictures.

Here is at least is a picture of the plant - very good production, although I didn't count fruit:

[/url]

**Lee** · January 31, 2006

Craig,

I'll be growing Granny Cantrell's German Red this season, so if you can't grow 'em all, I'll have this one for you to try.
Quite a nice tasting variety that Gary brought from KY and I was able to taste at CHOPTAG too....

Lee

bcday · January 31, 2006

Mama Leone and Yasenichki Yabuchar are both on my must-grow list -- good eating and great production.

Craig, you posted something on GW last year re "growout project color for 2006 may be green", are you still planning to do that project? I would be interested to hear how the various greens compare to each other. Besides Humph which I grow every year, I've only tried Green Grape, which I didn't care for, and Cherokee Green, which needs another trial because it didn't do well when I grew it for the first time last year.

Here are some descriptions, hope they help:

Mama Leone:
75 days, indet., regular leaf, 5-6 oz. red pointed plum shape, high yield. An all-purpose sauce and salad tomato that was the only variety grown by an immigrant family who brought the seeds with them from Italy many years ago.

Humph:
80 days, indet., regular leaf, 7-10 oz. beefsteak, pale green juicy flesh, sweet fruity flavor.

Yasenichki Yabuchar:
70 days, indet., regular leaf, 5-6 oz. (some up to 9 oz.) round red fruit, sweet, juicy, very high yield. This name may be an alternate spelling for Jasenicki jabucar.

-- BC --

Tania · January 31, 2006

Nancy,

Now I really regret that I didn't get Mama Leone!

Sounds very delicious!

Well, there is always something to look forward to in 2007!

Suze · January 31, 2006

Craig, re the Grandpa Ludolph's, I don't think anyone here or at GW besides Joe (the person that offered seed to some of us) has grown it out yet to the stage of a ripe fruit, unless maybe treefrog in Florida is to that point. Anyhow, here's what little I know of or recall about Grandpa Ludolph's German Red:

First off, fruit is supposed to be a large red slicer. Secondly, it is RL, and not PL as may have been previously indicated. treefrog (from FL -- on GW) got RL leaf type as well. Thirdly, it sure wasn't one of my easier germinators (YMMV). Think I got 2/5 on the first germ after about 2.5 to three weeks of patiently waiting, and 4/10 on the second germ attempt. That's including some major sticktights that just would not come loose to the point that the seedlings eventually died. So, you might want to throw a couple extras in the pot and/or presoak just in case.

there are still a couple of threads left on GW about it:

UPDATE: Un-Named German - Name & Story
http://forums.gardenweb.com/forums/l...180027996.html

UPDATE: Leaf type on Grandpa Ludolph German Red
http://forums.gardenweb.com/forums/l...273210792.html

Grub · January 31, 2006

Sir Craig,

I do belief it's Velvet Red not Red Velvet. Carolyn kindly sent me some but they missed the season cut

According to a post from Hoosier on GW...

SSE 2006 public catalog lists Velvet Red and says:

"Unique, silvery-gray, dusty miller type foliage. Heavy yields of 1-inch cherry tomatoes,excellent sweet flavor. Fruits are also slightly fuzzy but not as furry as the peach tomatoes. First listed by SSE member Carolyn Male in 1997, identical to Angora Super Sweet. Indeterminate. 75 - 80 days from transplant."

It's on my grow list. Grub :wink:

**nctomatoman** · January 31, 2006

Perhaps - could be two different tomatoes. Mine came from someone who was sharing Brad (feraltomato)'s unusual varieties. He has now joined this site - hopefully he will pitch in! I listed it as it was on the packet sent to me. We shall see!

**carolyn137** · February 1, 2006

Velvet Red....my seeds from Joe Bratka, and no, not one he bred, and the same as Angora Super Sweet, which he said he did breed.

And no, the fruits are not fuzzy as Hoosier indicated in that quote above. Gorgeous angora foliage that sparkles in the sun with abundant mediocre tasting cherry fruits, at least to me.

Joe wrote to me about what's now called Grandpa Ludolph's German Red and really wanted me to grow it and taste it. After he gave me the background information he had, I submitted several names to him and he chose Grandpa Ludolph's German Red.

He then sent me two fruits to taste. I didn't think they were all that great, to be honest, and told him so. He then replied that the ones he grew this past summer weren't that good but he had remembered them tasting better in previous years.

He did end up sending seed to several folks.

And in return for sending me those two fruits I sent him several varieties that he requested from me and I see they are on his grow list for this summer.

Right now I have a sinking feeling that I didn't save seeds from those fruits, but he may have sent me more, I just can't remember right now, but I think yes, as in they're somewhere.

Carolyn

travis · February 1, 2006

"Velvet Red....my seeds from Joe Bratka, and no, not one he bred, and the same as Angora Super Sweet, which he said he did breed. And no, the fruits are not fuzzy as Hoosier indicated in that quote above." [Carolyn]

I'm confused. If Velvet Red is the same as Angora Super Sweet, and Joe Bratka says he bred Angora Super Sweet, then wouldn't he allegedly have bred Velvet Red as well?

And the information regarding fuzzy fruit is a direct quote from SSE public catalog not an "indication" from the quoter.

PV

**carolyn137** · February 1, 2006

PV, yes it certainly does sound confusing, doesn't it.

But clearly you don't know Joe Bratka as some of us do. While he has bred several well known and liked varieties, such as Isis Candy and Snowwhite and Ghost and Rabbit and Marizol Bratka, nee Purple Brandywine, he also has represented many varieties, such as the whole Sara series, as being family heirlooms when they aren't.

As I recall, and my memory is not perfect, ahem, Velvet Red, which he got from somewhere, preceded the appearance of Angora Super Sweet by two years.

Initially SSE had listed it in the public catalog as Angora Super Sweet, bred by Joe Bratka. For several years I've been asked to do the proofing of those tomato pages, but that year Aaron was running behind and didn't have time to send me the pages for proof.

I ASAP recognized that the blurbs for both Velvet Red and Angora Super Sweet were identical in the SSE Yearbook and shared that with Aaron. So Aaron changed the entry to Velvet Red b'c it preceded the Angora Super Sweet entry by two years.

Yes, I'm remembering now that it was the blurb in the SSE Public catalog that said the fruits were fuzzy, but I've grown it quite a few times and the fruits aren't fuzzy, as grown by me.

Maybe they had Decorah "dust" that landed on the fruits out there. LOL

I hope that clarifies the situation as much as I can. With Joe it's been hard to determine, sometimes, what was his, and what wasn't. But he usually let some of us know which ones he bred and which ones he didn't, and he never said he bred Velvet Red.

He no longer is active in sending varieties to Bill Minkey , who was the only one who ended up listing his varieties, I know I stopped doing it, once Bill found out that the histories on some of them were concocted and not true.

Early on before Joe started getting shall we say creative, I got many wonderful authentic heirlooms from him b'c he used to get many from the seed pages of National Gardening and Orgainc Gardening.

And Eva Purple Ball was for real as was Marizol Gold, but when he then introduced Marizol Pink and Marizol Red and Marizol Purple, a number of us got suspicious.

Joe was very honest with me when he said that he knew there was a large demand for family heirloom types, so he was going to create some, and he did.

Carolyn

feraltomatoes · February 2, 2006

I will try my best here. I do not take notes very well but do spend endless time in my garden so will go off best memories. I will assure you that all of the varieties I sent Rienhart are genetically different then anything els out there. They all started from natural crosses or mutations from fields of common heirlooms. All original seeds where purchased from the usual commercial sources TT, TGS and Lockhart Seed in Stockton Ca. I think I have walked past over a million individual plants over the years so I have some unique opportunities.
Originally I slapped some names on some(sorry Carolyn)
and decided to send Rienhart much of my favorites because I thought these where valuble to the tomato world and was not sure(typical this time of year) if I was going to play farmer.

Red Velvet- Originally from Garden Peach. One garden peach went red, all seeds from this where just like garden peach but sweeter and red, showed up in the catalog the next year so someone els had the same thing. A year later a large red fuzzy tomato showed up.
Flavor is o.k.
Beauty King- One of my favorites. Harvest is not huge, fairly late, beautiful and tasty for me and all that have commented. Large meaty tipe. Yellow with green stripes turning to red as ripens.

Beauty Queen- Small version of B-King. Still getting large and small fruit. Very attractive, best flavor for me is before full color up. Yellow red striped

Yellow Zebra- Its the name that it was called by customers at farmers market, after sending to Rienhart and learning alot at GW I realized it needed to be seperated from others. I have since called it Yellow Boar
Looks like a yellow version of Green Zebra. Yellow with litghter yellow stripes.

Red Boar- Looks like a red version of Green Zebra. Very good all around. Red striped.

Blonde Zebra- O.k. so I changed it to Blonde Boar. Looks like a white version of GZ>. About half where white half where yellow and even a few reds from grow-out this year. This tomato puts hope in white tomatoes with flavor. I force fed it to people who insisted they did not like white tomatoes, love to see those eye browse jump like that. Pale pale yellow with stripes.

Berkeley Tie Dye- This one is here to stay. I think green fleshed tomatoes have one of the best flavors. Large, three colored stripes, red yellow green, meaty green flesh with red blush.

Furry Yellow Hog- Missed my grow out in 2005. Looks like a GZ but its two toned yellow stipes with fuzz. Had almost a honey flavor late in the season.

Freckled Child- ping pong size with spots and specks. Did not grow last year. Rienhard was sent seeds from original find, I think he said he had two that did and two that did not, but really liked them.

Furry Red Boar- looks like a GZ but its red and fuzzy. Fairly storng flavor. Two toned red stripes.

Big Yellow Zebra- was a discription, named it Porkchop. Medium large flattened beefsteak yelloow with green stripes that riped to two toned yellow stripes. Very good flavor, more on the sweet side.

Craig, I sent you 7 varieties that should be there any day, 5 are from above that should be tried, also sent Large Barred Boar that looks like a striped Cherokee and a matte skin Cherokee Purple that has alot of potential, it showed up in my CP year before last, grew about 20 plants this year and I think it was 100%. Can skin mutate to matte finish?
I have pics of all of these varieties. Gotta go for now.
Brad.........

January 29, 2006	#1
nctomatoman Tomatoville® Moderator Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Hendersonville, NC zone 7 Posts: 10,385	Looking for information on some that are new to me... I've accumulated alot of varieties that are new to me, and can fit only so many in the garden in 2006. Aside from pictures on Reinhard Kraft's site and some GW descriptions that have slipped my mind, I am looking for leaf shape/color/flavor for the following: The Feraltomato (Brad) varieties (likely not yet fully stable) that I got from a GW member (some) and Reinhard (the rest) Red Velvet Beauty Queen Beauty King Yellow Zebra Red Boar Blonde Zebra Berkeley Tie Dye Furry Yellow Hog Freckled Child Yellow Striped Boar Furry Red Boar Big Yellow Zebra Blonde Boar Small Pink Stripe Large Pink Striped Boars Hoof Giant Green Zebra GW trades and shares: Mountaineer Mystery Persey Mutant Stick (Bully, does the mutant form show clearly right away? what were the fruit like compared with "normal" stick?) Goose Creek Ledoux Special Zluta Kytice Granny Cantrell's German Red Grandpa Ludolph German Red Mr. Fumo Humph Mama Leone Yasenichki Yabuchar Ethel Watkins Best Evans Purple Pear Haley's Purple Comet Tlacolula Ribbed Rena's Turban Himmelssturmer Green Thumb Corbarino Green Velvet Ilka Looking for any on this list that are MUST grow varieties! __________________ Craig

January 29, 2006	#2
PNW_D Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: West Coast, Canada Posts: 961	Greetings Craig, Persey This one is a must grow, my all round best in 2005 nice plant size for pot, delicious taste, good production and disease resistance, good keeper. Rich, sweet, creamy, with vague acid follow up. Likely a good canner and keeper, but red, not pink. Prolific, extremely healthy plant, and my earliest to set fruit. Small Det. One from Andrey's seed share. __________________ D.

January 31, 2006	#5
PNW_D Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: West Coast, Canada Posts: 961	Clay, will post my grow list shortly in the relevant thread - still can't decide on my early, and now have a few more 'must grows' to consider. Anyhoo, as for Persey, a small slicer from what I recall. Unfortunately I had a computer crash back in October just when I had finished adding all my digital pictures to my grow out data list. Didn't keep a lot of written notes, was counting on the pictures. Here is at least is a picture of the plant - very good production, although I didn't count fruit: [/url] __________________ D.

January 31, 2006	#8
Tania Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Anmore, BC, Canada Posts: 3,970	Nancy, Now I really regret that I didn't get Mama Leone! Sounds very delicious! Well, there is always something to look forward to in 2007! __________________ Tatiana's TOMATObase

January 31, 2006	#10
Grub Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Sydney, Australia Posts: 2,722	Velvet Red Sir Craig, I do belief it's Velvet Red not Red Velvet. Carolyn kindly sent me some but they missed the season cut According to a post from Hoosier on GW... SSE 2006 public catalog lists Velvet Red and says: "Unique, silvery-gray, dusty miller type foliage. Heavy yields of 1-inch cherry tomatoes,excellent sweet flavor. Fruits are also slightly fuzzy but not as furry as the peach tomatoes. First listed by SSE member Carolyn Male in 1997, identical to Angora Super Sweet. Indeterminate. 75 - 80 days from transplant." It's on my grow list. Grub :wink:

January 30, 2006	#3
clay199 Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Beyond Hope, British Columbia Posts: 201	D, About Persey, how productive was it and how big were the fruits? thanks, Clay ps. How many plants you going to squeeze in this year?

January 30, 2006	#4
carolyn137 Moderator Emeritus Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Upstate NY, zone 4b/5a Posts: 21,169	Craig, quite a few on your second list are already listed in the SSE Yearbook. And it looks like "N" in NYS sent you both Mama Leone and Humph. A must grow is Mama Leone and I've described it several times. Want me to do it again? LOL I had planned to send you a few seeds of it, so glad to know you already have it since I have so few seeds. Humph is another green when ripe, indet, RL, etc., that "N" listed in the 2005 Yearbook and you might want to try it as well. For me it still didn't reach the excellence of Cherokee Green, which I still like better than Green Giant. I'll take a look at the rest of that list later. It's been just a funfilled day here, not, LOL, and it's either a nap or early to bed for me. LOL Carolyn

January 31, 2006	#6
Lee Tomatopalooza™ Moderator Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: NC-Zone 7 Posts: 2,188	Craig, I'll be growing Granny Cantrell's German Red this season, so if you can't grow 'em all, I'll have this one for you to try. Quite a nice tasting variety that Gary brought from KY and I was able to taste at CHOPTAG too.... Lee

January 31, 2006	#7
bcday Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: NY z5 Posts: 1,205	Mama Leone and Yasenichki Yabuchar are both on my must-grow list -- good eating and great production. Craig, you posted something on GW last year re "growout project color for 2006 may be green", are you still planning to do that project? I would be interested to hear how the various greens compare to each other. Besides Humph which I grow every year, I've only tried Green Grape, which I didn't care for, and Cherokee Green, which needs another trial because it didn't do well when I grew it for the first time last year. Here are some descriptions, hope they help: Mama Leone: 75 days, indet., regular leaf, 5-6 oz. red pointed plum shape, high yield. An all-purpose sauce and salad tomato that was the only variety grown by an immigrant family who brought the seeds with them from Italy many years ago. Humph: 80 days, indet., regular leaf, 7-10 oz. beefsteak, pale green juicy flesh, sweet fruity flavor. Yasenichki Yabuchar: 70 days, indet., regular leaf, 5-6 oz. (some up to 9 oz.) round red fruit, sweet, juicy, very high yield. This name may be an alternate spelling for Jasenicki jabucar. -- BC --

January 31, 2006	#9
Suze Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Texas Posts: 3,027	Craig, re the Grandpa Ludolph's, I don't think anyone here or at GW besides Joe (the person that offered seed to some of us) has grown it out yet to the stage of a ripe fruit, unless maybe treefrog in Florida is to that point. Anyhow, here's what little I know of or recall about Grandpa Ludolph's German Red: First off, fruit is supposed to be a large red slicer. Secondly, it is RL, and not PL as may have been previously indicated. treefrog (from FL -- on GW) got RL leaf type as well. Thirdly, it sure wasn't one of my easier germinators (YMMV). Think I got 2/5 on the first germ after about 2.5 to three weeks of patiently waiting, and 4/10 on the second germ attempt. That's including some major sticktights that just would not come loose to the point that the seedlings eventually died. So, you might want to throw a couple extras in the pot and/or presoak just in case. there are still a couple of threads left on GW about it: UPDATE: Un-Named German - Name & Story http://forums.gardenweb.com/forums/l...180027996.html UPDATE: Leaf type on Grandpa Ludolph German Red http://forums.gardenweb.com/forums/l...273210792.html

February 1, 2006	#12
carolyn137 Moderator Emeritus Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Upstate NY, zone 4b/5a Posts: 21,169	Velvet Red....my seeds from Joe Bratka, and no, not one he bred, and the same as Angora Super Sweet, which he said he did breed. And no, the fruits are not fuzzy as Hoosier indicated in that quote above. Gorgeous angora foliage that sparkles in the sun with abundant mediocre tasting cherry fruits, at least to me. Joe wrote to me about what's now called Grandpa Ludolph's German Red and really wanted me to grow it and taste it. After he gave me the background information he had, I submitted several names to him and he chose Grandpa Ludolph's German Red. He then sent me two fruits to taste. I didn't think they were all that great, to be honest, and told him so. He then replied that the ones he grew this past summer weren't that good but he had remembered them tasting better in previous years. He did end up sending seed to several folks. And in return for sending me those two fruits I sent him several varieties that he requested from me and I see they are on his grow list for this summer. Right now I have a sinking feeling that I didn't save seeds from those fruits, but he may have sent me more, I just can't remember right now, but I think yes, as in they're somewhere. Carolyn

February 1, 2006	#13
travis Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Evansville, IN Posts: 2,984	"Velvet Red....my seeds from Joe Bratka, and no, not one he bred, and the same as Angora Super Sweet, which he said he did breed. And no, the fruits are not fuzzy as Hoosier indicated in that quote above." [Carolyn] I'm confused. If Velvet Red is the same as Angora Super Sweet, and Joe Bratka says he bred Angora Super Sweet, then wouldn't he allegedly have bred Velvet Red as well? And the information regarding fuzzy fruit is a direct quote from SSE public catalog not an "indication" from the quoter. PV

February 2, 2006	#15
feraltomatoes Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Home=Napa Valley/ Garden=Solano County Posts: 245	I will try my best here. I do not take notes very well but do spend endless time in my garden so will go off best memories. I will assure you that all of the varieties I sent Rienhart are genetically different then anything els out there. They all started from natural crosses or mutations from fields of common heirlooms. All original seeds where purchased from the usual commercial sources TT, TGS and Lockhart Seed in Stockton Ca. I think I have walked past over a million individual plants over the years so I have some unique opportunities. Originally I slapped some names on some(sorry Carolyn) and decided to send Rienhart much of my favorites because I thought these where valuble to the tomato world and was not sure(typical this time of year) if I was going to play farmer. Red Velvet- Originally from Garden Peach. One garden peach went red, all seeds from this where just like garden peach but sweeter and red, showed up in the catalog the next year so someone els had the same thing. A year later a large red fuzzy tomato showed up. Flavor is o.k. Beauty King- One of my favorites. Harvest is not huge, fairly late, beautiful and tasty for me and all that have commented. Large meaty tipe. Yellow with green stripes turning to red as ripens. Beauty Queen- Small version of B-King. Still getting large and small fruit. Very attractive, best flavor for me is before full color up. Yellow red striped Yellow Zebra- Its the name that it was called by customers at farmers market, after sending to Rienhart and learning alot at GW I realized it needed to be seperated from others. I have since called it Yellow Boar Looks like a yellow version of Green Zebra. Yellow with litghter yellow stripes. Red Boar- Looks like a red version of Green Zebra. Very good all around. Red striped. Blonde Zebra- O.k. so I changed it to Blonde Boar. Looks like a white version of GZ>. About half where white half where yellow and even a few reds from grow-out this year. This tomato puts hope in white tomatoes with flavor. I force fed it to people who insisted they did not like white tomatoes, love to see those eye browse jump like that. Pale pale yellow with stripes. Berkeley Tie Dye- This one is here to stay. I think green fleshed tomatoes have one of the best flavors. Large, three colored stripes, red yellow green, meaty green flesh with red blush. Furry Yellow Hog- Missed my grow out in 2005. Looks like a GZ but its two toned yellow stipes with fuzz. Had almost a honey flavor late in the season. Freckled Child- ping pong size with spots and specks. Did not grow last year. Rienhard was sent seeds from original find, I think he said he had two that did and two that did not, but really liked them. Furry Red Boar- looks like a GZ but its red and fuzzy. Fairly storng flavor. Two toned red stripes. Big Yellow Zebra- was a discription, named it Porkchop. Medium large flattened beefsteak yelloow with green stripes that riped to two toned yellow stripes. Very good flavor, more on the sweet side. Craig, I sent you 7 varieties that should be there any day, 5 are from above that should be tried, also sent Large Barred Boar that looks like a striped Cherokee and a matte skin Cherokee Purple that has alot of potential, it showed up in my CP year before last, grew about 20 plants this year and I think it was 100%. Can skin mutate to matte finish? I have pics of all of these varieties. Gotta go for now. Brad.........