Are any of these particularly tall plants?

[Too Tall Toms]

Originally Posted by PATM

I planted 6 Brandywine tomato plants in my garden this past season, never again!

They are huge plants, that grow to be 12' tall. I ended up using 10' long 2x4s for supports. The plant's leaves and fruit are so large and heavy it will need a cage for support.

Harvest is late summer, with relatively small yields.

Unless you have a big big garden, avoid Brandywine.

Wow.....and Brandywine was on my list of tomatoes to grow next year.

[lakelady]

Originally Posted by Too Tall Toms

Wow.....and Brandywine was on my list of tomatoes to grow next year.

Maybe since we are a little north of you it won't grow so big ?

[Suze]

Your soil, growing conditions, heat, available N (too much can promote a lot of foliage and/or height, sometimes at the expense of fruit production), and amount of watering or rain has a LOT to do with how tall plants will be as others have intimated.

But relatively speaking, from the ones you've listed, I'll indicate the varieties that tend to get the tallest for me in my garden. Compact to me means 5-6' or less, avg 6-8' or so.


Brandywines ('pink' Brandywines in general) - avg to sometimes a bit taller than avg, but def not among the tallest I've grown
Amazon Chocolate - I have only grown PL, and that is compact
BTD Pink - compact
BTD Heart - avg
Black Cherry - on the tall side, can get huge in good conditions
Black from Tula - avg
Brads Black Heart - avg
Cherokee Purple - avg to sometimes a wee bit on the stocky/compact side
Cherokee Chocolate - see above
Jaune flamme - avg
Gary O Sena - avg to a wee bit tall
JD Special CTex - depends, as travis indicated - but I would leave room for avg
Sungold F1 - put this at the end of a row so it has room, I've gotten plants up to 15' tall in a good season!
Paul Robeson - avg
Indian Stripe - avg to sometimes a bit on the stocky/compact side
Kosovo - avg to a bit on the tall side
Bloody Butcher - compact
Danko - compact (shortest one on your list of those I've grown)
Black and Brown Boar - avg

[lakelady]

Originally Posted by Suze

Your soil, growing conditions, heat, available N (too much can promote a lot of foliage and/or height, sometimes at the expense of fruit production), and amount of watering or rain has a LOT to do with how tall plants will be as others have intimated.

But relatively speaking, from the ones you've listed, I'll indicate the varieties that tend to get the tallest for me in my garden. Compact to me means 5-6' or less, avg 6-8' or so.


Brandywines ('pink' Brandywines in general) - avg to sometimes a bit taller than avg, but def not among the tallest I've grown
Amazon Chocolate - I have only grown PL, and that is compact
BTD Pink - compact
BTD Heart - avg
Black Cherry - on the tall side, can get huge in good conditions
Black from Tula - avg
Brads Black Heart - avg
Cherokee Purple - avg to sometimes a wee bit on the stocky/compact side
Cherokee Chocolate - see above
Jaune flamme - avg
Gary O Sena - avg to a wee bit tall
JD Special CTex - depends, as travis indicated - but I would leave room for avg
Sungold F1 - put this at the end of a row so it has room, I've gotten plants up to 15' tall in a good season!
Paul Robeson - avg
Indian Stripe - avg to sometimes a bit on the stocky/compact side
Kosovo - avg to a bit on the tall side
Bloody Butcher - compact
Danko - compact (shortest one on your list of those I've grown)
Black and Brown Boar - avg

Suze, you're awesome, lol....thank you! I know there are a lotof variables but was looking for a "general sort of specific answer" .

[kurt]

Have grown tomatoes here in S. Florida for the last twenty years and in containers.3/4 of mine are cherrys of all kinds.Found out the amount of fertilization will determine plant height and yield-taste.I been experimenting with Algoflash Tomatoe mix and hands down is the best.Using the foliar applications and in ground watering can really control plant height.In the containers I use the Pro Mix BF soil.Due to the summer heat and our shorter growing season found out that I have to top off the plants so as not to waste unripened berrys before the heat sets in.Topping of seems to send all the energy into the bottom of the plant.I beleive the grower can control the plant height and yeild.As a token I will use a control plant of each variety and let them grow wild.Cherrys I have let go will vine to 10-15 feet but the season for me ends so all that is a waste.My wild round tomatoes have grown to 10 foot.I trim them as much as the plant allows.My motto is your growing tomatoes not leaves.Down here in South Florida our ground is full of fungus and bugs that occur naturally hence my container only theory.Thanx to the large enclosed screened pool deck I do not have to spend cash on costly pesticides that the local farmers have to use.Hope this helps and remember you can control plant height /yeild.

[lakelady]

Thanks Kurt, I never thought of cutting them back. Now that you mention it, I think Raybo had posted something about taking a hedge trimmer to his once they hit the top of the extension on his cages. Good to know!

So, I guess now that really means that I don't have the limitations I thought I did for any container grown plants, yay!

[dice]

You could put A-frames at the ends of that narrow garden,
put a piece of chain link fence top rail across the top of it,
and tie a trellis to the top rail.

In the photo below is one sitting on a concrete patio that has one
A-frame and a short piece of pipe on it with a trellis tied to each
end. It supports 3 plants in self-watering containers, but
imagine one of those at each end supporting the end of the
top rail, and you would have the idea. That trellis is 1/8-inch
nylon rope tied like a gillnet, but you could use whatever you
have, can find, or can make for that. The A-frame started with
around 7-foot pieces of scrap wood, and it is about 6 feet tall.
Easy to build. One does need to tuck in stems as they grow,
but it is fairly simple to tie a loop to it if some plant is getting
out of hand.

How to tie a gillnet:
http://www.aircav.com/survival/asch08/asch08p11.html

(Use the prusik knot, the girth hitch is worthless, and a
rigid top rail works a lot better than a piece of rope across
the top. It will take some experimenting to figure out how
long of pieces of rope/string one needs for the verticals for
a given height. That depends on mesh size. Dropping 3 pieces
from the top and tieing the mesh all the way to the bottom
gives one a good idea about that. Chain link fence top rail
comes in long lengths, so finding one the length of the
area that you described would be no problem.)

Or just use a pre-made piece of trellis, anchored to the top
with zip ties, and anchor the bottom corners. The bottom of it
can be a foot or two off the ground for indeterminates.

It is more preliminary work than florida weave, but easy to
maintain during the season, and the whole system can be
transported to a patio, driveway, somewhere else in the
yard, etc.

[FILMNET]

Brandywine has huge fruits that takes over 80 days to ripen. The stems will break if you don't tie them up. I did this 2 years ago. Center stem 4-5 ft tall the branches long ones with fruit 2-3 ft off the center.I tied them to a fence lucking. 1-2 lb fruits if you have nice dirt. Not for me again, i love other pink big fruits.

[kurt]

I found out the best way to control my cherry tomatoes is to top off.The reason being is that cherrys can grow to 10-15 feet if you let them.I time the ripening of the first tressles of berrys to the next keeping in mind the end of my growing season here in South Florida before the heat sets in.Before when I used to let them grow wild I found out that the plants would flower to the end but not ripen well enough before they succombed to the end of my season.So with that in mind topping off will direct all the energys to the bottom berrys.Also I select and prune the suckers off for as they will not grow in time for the end of season.My motto is your growing tomatoes not leaves.I like my plants almost butt naked,this provides good air exchange and sun exposure to the berrys.Mind you sun increases sugar content for sweetness.The air exchange keeps plants good and dry that prevents humidity thus reducing fungus and mold growth.Thanks to the large enclosed pool deck that I grow in containers keeps the insects out that are one of the main vectors of mold and fungus transmission.Found over the years that fungus and molds come from the ground up,once it is present it will morph into the next year growth through the contamination of the orginal ground,on the planting tools,and containers.I pressure wash with a Phisan product the area,in the meantime all the containers,and even the snips,planting shovels, rakes etc.I clean the pruning shears after each cuttings.Even my bamboo stakes and poles are nuked before each season.I gave up growing in ground here in S. Florida years ago becuase of the perfect conditions for mold/fungus and the large amount of insects and this year the aphids that have gone rampant here.Found out that the Pro Mix soil is the best for containers along with the Algoflash Tomatoe Mix.I could grow in ground but the pesticide cost would kill me and is harmful to the ground water and general enviorment.Gardning gloves are also a good vector for transmission so I never use them I just wash my hands before and after each handling.Hope this all makes sense and good luck this year.

[lakelady]

wow those are great suggestions, and Dice, thanks for the pics. I was thinking "how do I do something similar to a Florida weave" over there. i'll try to take pics. It's the ugly side of the yard, along a private road, and I just finished cutting out the old bushes that were like 20' high. I'm replacing the bushes on the street level, but just below it, is my little garden to be. I've been amending that soil for two months now, so by next Spring it shoudl be Prime!

[dice]

Florida weave is a good "just in time" system, because you can build
it as the plants grow, and it does not take much in the way of materials,
stakes (T-posts at the ends) and twine. But it does take a fair amount
of work during the season, stringing additional levels of twine around
the plants, tightening them, etc.

Here is a system I like, steel I-beams set in concrete with what looks
like winch cable for trellises:
http://www.tomatoville.com/showthread.php?t=19126

edit: Actually they used nylon cord from post to post. I was
misremembering, but it seems like winch cable would fit
the rest of the system.

[kurt]

After fighting the trellis systems the last few years I graduated to a one time set up using 8 ft. bamboo poles with twine and these circular snap on rapid clips you can by online called rapid clips.Using a 5 gallon container at the beggining of each row I place 2 poles in middle of pot to the outsides and at every 5-6 pot two more poles.Then from bottom of plant up at the first good leaders out from the first plant all the way to the end of the row a horizontal treated sisal twine tied off at each pole with the plastic twist ties.This horizontal twine will occur every foot to one and half foot up to the top of the 8 ft.bamboo which forms a ladder type structure.This allows me to place the leaders to the twine with the clips where I want them plus adjusting them as they grow.Spreaders inbetween the poles are used for strengh thus creating the ladder affect.At the tops of the poles at each end of my 30-40 foot rows I tie them back to prevent collapse and sagging to the pool enclosure.This system allows me to train the plants for optimum spacing and air flow/sun absorption and harvet/pruning.This also allows me to remove any unwanted weak plants that shows any disease symtoms which you should remove, bag and get rid of before the spread sets in.The twine also lets me tighten it up at the plastic ties when needed and in the morning when the flowers are dry from the dew you can shake the poles for optimum pollinization.The treated sisal can be reused,the clips reused,the ties reused,the bamboo poles after each season are sprayed with bleach and coated with linsseed oil and have been reused for the last 6 yrs with no real degeneration.

[Too Tall Toms]

Originally Posted by kurt

After fighting the trellis systems the last few years I graduated to a one time set up using 8 ft. bamboo poles with twine and these circular snap on rapid clips you can by online called rapid clips.Using a 5 gallon container at the beggining of each row I place 2 poles in middle of pot to the outsides and at every 5-6 pot two more poles.Then from bottom of plant up at the first good leaders out from the first plant all the way to the end of the row a horizontal treated sisal twine tied off at each pole with the plastic twist ties.This horizontal twine will occur every foot to one and half foot up to the top of the 8 ft.bamboo which forms a ladder type structure.This allows me to place the leaders to the twine with the clips where I want them plus adjusting them as they grow.Spreaders inbetween the poles are used for strengh thus creating the ladder affect.At the tops of the poles at each end of my 30-40 foot rows I tie them back to prevent collapse and sagging to the pool enclosure.This system allows me to train the plants for optimum spacing and air flow/sun absorption and harvet/pruning.This also allows me to remove any unwanted weak plants that shows any disease symtoms which you should remove, bag and get rid of before the spread sets in.The twine also lets me tighten it up at the plastic ties when needed and in the morning when the flowers are dry from the dew you can shake the poles for optimum pollinization.The treated sisal can be reused,the clips reused,the ties reused,the bamboo poles after each season are sprayed with bleach and coated with linsseed oil and have been reused for the last 6 yrs with no real degeneration.

This system sounds pretty neat. Do you have pictures??

[kurt]

Have from last year but you cannot see anything because they are all filled in.Will send new in about a week when I put this seasons up.Right now I am at only about two foot in height.Still sorting out the varietys and growth sequences.I will keep you posted.

[Too Tall Toms]

That sounds good kurt. Thanks.