Variety recommendations - central VA

jcmorse33 · September 10, 2007

Ok, after getting my first honest to goodness chance to sample a wide variety of OP varieties this last saturday at the Monticello Heritage Harvest Festival the list of varieties I was thinking of trying received some serious revision. Unfortunately the list also grew in length... and since I only have room for 6 indeterminate varieties in the ground (unless I totally crowd them) I need to trim it back a little. Important criteria for me are, taste, productivity (limited number), and ability to survive my central VA climate (hot and humid, variable rain patterns, a nearby swamp from which all things funk emerge on a regular basis... I swear there a fungi varieties with legs around here).

The varieties I tasted that left me thinking "Oh my gosh, so that's what the fuss is about! I have got to grow something like this..." were:
1. Brandywine - OMG... didn't think I had space to waste on something described as a "shy producer" but... 9.5 / 10. I have never had a tomato that tasted that good before. This firmly pushed the Pruden's Purple and Kellog's Breakfast I grew this year down to 7.5, because if they were 8's this was a 10 and I need to save the 10 just in case I find something better. Its my first year with heirlooms after all.
2. Yellow Oxheart - smooooth... fruity... 9-ish / 10.
3. German Red Strawberry - rich and sweet with a little tartness mixed in 9-ish / 10.
4. Black Cherry - almost grape like. 9/10
5. Snow White Cherry - a "lighter" flavor than the Black Cherry but still very very good. 8.9/10 (just because I though BC was a hair better)
6. Orange Oxheart - similar to yellow oxheart, but hard for me to rate it since I bought it from a farmer's stand rather than sampling it at the tasting alongside. At least an 8.5 I think. I ate it like an apple, raw with nothing else, which I have *never* done with a tomato before.
7. Persimmon - also sweet and rich, perhaps a little fruity only more tang and / or tartness than GRS or the two oxhearts. 8.5 / 10.
8. Marianne's Peace - very good, probably a 8.5, but not better than BW.

Others that were "very good" to me but which I would have a hard time ranking as I focussed on ranking my favorites:
Black Sea Man (prefered it over the Cherokee Purple they had there...)
Green Zebra (prefered it over the Aunt Ruby's German Green they had... just seemed to have more flavor)
Manyel - citrusy, sweet. Just not up with the 8.5+ crowd.

Taste aspects that I don't like...
Sour or overwhelmingly tarte... Purple Calabash for me is a spitter...
Tomatoes that are watery and hard... I don't like it when there is a discernible "crunch" even when the fruit is sliced, and if there is juice I want to taste it, not just feel it (for me this eliminates Celebrity along with most modern hybrids).

My thoughts thus far as to what I want to grow next year, keeping the list to 6 varieties (since clear cutting the trees is not an option)...

1 Brandywine (Sudduth's strain) - a definite... just because...
1 Orange Oxheart - it seems to be described as a productive variety so this is a definite
1 German Red Strawberry - a definite
1 Yellow Oxheart OR Aunt Gertie's Gold OR Lucky Cross OR Lillian's Yellow Heirloom - yellow oxheart was incredible but seems to be described as an average producer that is suseptible to disease (which puts it at risk in my yard), so if I can find something just as good or better that is hardier and better producing...
1* Aker's West Virginia OR Andrew Rahart's Jumbo Red - I'm looking for a full flavored red beefsteak that I like (Big beef, Jetstar, and Super Bush just don't measure up to the flavors I've encountered now) that produces well.
1* Carbon OR Black from Tula - to round out the color / flavor crowd of large slicers

* denotes spots that could alternatively be given to varities said to be similar to brandywine in flavor to help give me something that has that special something with better production and consistency, ala Stump of the World

Oh yeah, I do have one large pot on my deck which will go to Black Cherry too. I may have room for smaller plants such as dwarf varieties or determinates in front of the indeterminates, but only if I can convince my wife to let me put in another raised bed. (We can always clear another spot for the future swing set, right?

)

--Justin

amideutch · September 10, 2007

Justin, A few to keep in the back of your mind.
1. Kosovo
2. Neves Azorean Red
3. New Big Dwarf
4. Sun Gold (A hybrid, but you got to try it once)
Ami

gardenpaws_VA · September 10, 2007

Akers W VA does well for me west of DC, at least when there's some rain, and it has both taste and productivity.

If I were you, I'd put Black Cherry in the ground, not in a pot - it's a big old sprawler, almost as tall as Sungold.

jcmorse33 · September 11, 2007

Regarding sungold and black cherry, I had pretty good luck with Sungold in a 17 gallon pot this year on the back deck. I figure black cherry should do alright that way as well.

I did consider NAR as well as Aker's WV and Andrew Rahart's but thought I would probably get more fruit (though not necessarily more total fruit weight) from the second two because their fruit are slightly smaller. I could be wrong about this though having no experience with any of these... ?

gardenpaws_VA · September 11, 2007

Ah - my containerized tomatoes are almost always in containers which are technically too small - like 3-5 gal?

jcmorse33 · September 12, 2007

I had fairly good luck with Super Bush and Husky Gold in the 5 gallon self watering Misco pots found at Walmart... of course the water reservoir was nowhere near large enough and they really needed to be watered 3x per day at the height of summer / fruit production which I couldn't do so I lost *alot* of fruit to blossom end rot. Enough that I don't plan on using them for tomatoes next year.

I think its more about the water supply than the amount of growing medium though. A 5 gallon container with a sufficiently large water reservoir to go all day could probably grow any sort of tomato you wanted.

September 10, 2007	#1
jcmorse33 Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Central Virginia Posts: 242	Variety recommendations - central VA Ok, after getting my first honest to goodness chance to sample a wide variety of OP varieties this last saturday at the Monticello Heritage Harvest Festival the list of varieties I was thinking of trying received some serious revision. Unfortunately the list also grew in length... and since I only have room for 6 indeterminate varieties in the ground (unless I totally crowd them) I need to trim it back a little. Important criteria for me are, taste, productivity (limited number), and ability to survive my central VA climate (hot and humid, variable rain patterns, a nearby swamp from which all things funk emerge on a regular basis... I swear there a fungi varieties with legs around here). The varieties I tasted that left me thinking "Oh my gosh, so that's what the fuss is about! I have got to grow something like this..." were: 1. Brandywine - OMG... didn't think I had space to waste on something described as a "shy producer" but... 9.5 / 10. I have never had a tomato that tasted that good before. This firmly pushed the Pruden's Purple and Kellog's Breakfast I grew this year down to 7.5, because if they were 8's this was a 10 and I need to save the 10 just in case I find something better. Its my first year with heirlooms after all. 2. Yellow Oxheart - smooooth... fruity... 9-ish / 10. 3. German Red Strawberry - rich and sweet with a little tartness mixed in 9-ish / 10. 4. Black Cherry - almost grape like. 9/10 5. Snow White Cherry - a "lighter" flavor than the Black Cherry but still very very good. 8.9/10 (just because I though BC was a hair better) 6. Orange Oxheart - similar to yellow oxheart, but hard for me to rate it since I bought it from a farmer's stand rather than sampling it at the tasting alongside. At least an 8.5 I think. I ate it like an apple, raw with nothing else, which I have never done with a tomato before. 7. Persimmon - also sweet and rich, perhaps a little fruity only more tang and / or tartness than GRS or the two oxhearts. 8.5 / 10. 8. Marianne's Peace - very good, probably a 8.5, but not better than BW. Others that were "very good" to me but which I would have a hard time ranking as I focussed on ranking my favorites: Black Sea Man (prefered it over the Cherokee Purple they had there...) Green Zebra (prefered it over the Aunt Ruby's German Green they had... just seemed to have more flavor) Manyel - citrusy, sweet. Just not up with the 8.5+ crowd. Taste aspects that I don't like... Sour or overwhelmingly tarte... Purple Calabash for me is a spitter... Tomatoes that are watery and hard... I don't like it when there is a discernible "crunch" even when the fruit is sliced, and if there is juice I want to taste it, not just feel it (for me this eliminates Celebrity along with most modern hybrids). My thoughts thus far as to what I want to grow next year, keeping the list to 6 varieties (since clear cutting the trees is not an option)... 1 Brandywine (Sudduth's strain) - a definite... just because... 1 Orange Oxheart - it seems to be described as a productive variety so this is a definite 1 German Red Strawberry - a definite 1 Yellow Oxheart OR Aunt Gertie's Gold OR Lucky Cross OR Lillian's Yellow Heirloom - yellow oxheart was incredible but seems to be described as an average producer that is suseptible to disease (which puts it at risk in my yard), so if I can find something just as good or better that is hardier and better producing... 1* Aker's West Virginia OR Andrew Rahart's Jumbo Red - I'm looking for a full flavored red beefsteak that I like (Big beef, Jetstar, and Super Bush just don't measure up to the flavors I've encountered now) that produces well. 1* Carbon OR Black from Tula - to round out the color / flavor crowd of large slicers * denotes spots that could alternatively be given to varities said to be similar to brandywine in flavor to help give me something that has that special something with better production and consistency, ala Stump of the World Oh yeah, I do have one large pot on my deck which will go to Black Cherry too. I may have room for smaller plants such as dwarf varieties or determinates in front of the indeterminates, but only if I can convince my wife to let me put in another raised bed. (We can always clear another spot for the future swing set, right? ) --Justin

September 10, 2007	#2
amideutch Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Germany 49°26"N 07°36"E Posts: 5,041	Justin, A few to keep in the back of your mind. 1. Kosovo 2. Neves Azorean Red 3. New Big Dwarf 4. Sun Gold (A hybrid, but you got to try it once) Ami __________________ Life's journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out, shouting ‘...Holy Crap .....What a ride!'

September 10, 2007	#3
gardenpaws_VA Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Northern Virginia, USA - zone 7+ Posts: 161	Akers W VA does well for me west of DC, at least when there's some rain, and it has both taste and productivity. If I were you, I'd put Black Cherry in the ground, not in a pot - it's a big old sprawler, almost as tall as Sungold.

September 11, 2007	#4
jcmorse33 Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Central Virginia Posts: 242	Regarding sungold and black cherry, I had pretty good luck with Sungold in a 17 gallon pot this year on the back deck. I figure black cherry should do alright that way as well. I did consider NAR as well as Aker's WV and Andrew Rahart's but thought I would probably get more fruit (though not necessarily more total fruit weight) from the second two because their fruit are slightly smaller. I could be wrong about this though having no experience with any of these... ?

September 12, 2007	#6
jcmorse33 Tomatovillian™ Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Central Virginia Posts: 242	I had fairly good luck with Super Bush and Husky Gold in the 5 gallon self watering Misco pots found at Walmart... of course the water reservoir was nowhere near large enough and they really needed to be watered 3x per day at the height of summer / fruit production which I couldn't do so I lost alot of fruit to blossom end rot. Enough that I don't plan on using them for tomatoes next year. I think its more about the water supply than the amount of growing medium though. A 5 gallon container with a sufficiently large water reservoir to go all day could probably grow any sort of tomato you wanted.