Scientific American Article

[Solanum315]

https://www.scientificamerican.com/a...loom-tomatoes/

Apologies if this has been previously posted. I was surprised to see so many seeming inaccuracies such as the assertion that fungal diseases cause cracking and a few others. I’m not big on seeing conspiracies everywhere but seems the author is shilling for big agra...

[jtjmartin]

Thanks for posting. The article is definitely slanted.

I now see that I was just imagining spitting out the store-bought-tomatoes my wife puts in my salads during the winter. They must actually taste BETTER than the heirlooms I dream about all winter. (sarcasm)

Of course, I never really get to taste many heirlooms since my plants only produce two tomatoes per season. (sarcasm)

"There will be a contingent of people," he says, "who will believe these are poor imitations of the originals." Belief will have nothing to do with it. If they taste as good as heirlooms - I welcome the increased disease resistance. If they taste like the usual supermarket crap they will be poor imitations of the originals!

OTOH, it does seem that domestication of anything by man creates good and bad. My golden retriever is less able to survive by himself and needs a vet more than a wolf . . . but my wife and I wouldn't let a wolf sleep in our bed!

Jeff

[shatbox]

"Genetics work will also point the way to sturdier, more flavorful tomatoes—albeit hybrid varieties whose seeds cannot be passed down from generation to generation but must be purchased anew by growers each season"

Yeah, he's missing the point. The people who celebrate tomatoes don't care about the things he writes about. Heirlooms are not always appropriate for commercial growers anyway.

[PaulF]

Out is clear this cat has never been in a garden (maybe never even seen one) let alone raised a tomato in his life. Imagine a Brooklyn free lance writer telling us all about tomatoes and expecting us to believe a word he says. And then bring forth the words of a geneticist to explain why heirlooms are no better than store-bought cardboard.

As the article is ten years old, even the research is outdated and the information is a rehash of old ideas...like the disease resistance story. Two or three days extra healthy growth means something to a commercial grower, but is barely noticed by a home gardener...that's who indulges in heirlooms (OPs). Some market growers raise heirlooms for Farmer's Markets and to sell to restaurants, but know how to make the most of their crops. Cultural practices are way more important than disease reduction by a few days anyway.

In a short, short essay with no new information and outdated ideas I take this for what it is worth...zero. Grow a garden for ten or fifteen years and then get back to me. I may listen then. Taste test seventy-five different varieties and then explain to me that they are all the same. I may listen then. Come to my garden and see what you think you are talking about. You may change your story.

[KarenO]

as you say, an old article full of old ideas.
Now the big boys are all trying to find markers in OP and heirlooms for flavour and disease resistance to replicate in their proprietary F1’s because that’s where the money is and consumers are demanding more flavour. Since the resurgence of interest in diversity and heirlooms from consumers and gardeners they need those qualities deliberately bred out of them in the past in favour of perfect symmetry and even ripening. The marketing will insist that lab created varieties are superior to the OP tomatoes that these news hybrids are created from and Perhaps they are for commercial growers needs (although that’s perhaps debatable) but for a gardener like me,
I like these awful OP and heirloom tomatoes quite a lot
I think there’s room for both and I think superiority is entirely in the eye (and tastebuds) of the beholder. There’s Always some sort of contest with regard to tomatoes
Important to remember that the driving force is not the plants or flavour or tomatoes at all. for any business or corporate interest there is only one singular purpose and that is to make Money.

KarenO

[Goodloe]

Originally Posted by KarenO

as you say, an old article full of old ideas.
Now the big boys are all trying to find markers in OP and heirlooms for flavour and disease resistance to replicate in their proprietary F1’s because that’s where the money is and consumers are demanding more flavour. Since the resurgence of interest in diversity and heirlooms from consumers and gardeners they need those qualities deliberately bred out of them in the past in favour of perfect symmetry and even ripening. The marketing will insist that lab created varieties are superior to the OP tomatoes that these news hybrids are created from and Perhaps they are for commercial growers needs (although that’s perhaps debatable) but for a gardener like me,
I like these awful OP and heirloom tomatoes quite a lot
I think there’s room for both and I think superiority is entirely in the eye (and tastebuds) of the beholder. There’s Always some sort of contest with regard to tomatoes
Important to remember that the driving force is not the plants or flavour or tomatoes at all. for any business or corporate interest there is only one singular purpose and that is to make Money.

KarenO

Good, thoughtful post; the "profit motive" eventually destroys that from which it seeks to make a profit....

[Worth1]

Chalking it up all up to ignorance.
Be it purposeful or not.

[maxjohnson]

Last two weeks I gave away 17lbs of heirloom tomatoes to coworker because I couldn't eat it all by myself. Just now I had to put another 20lbs in a box to bring to work tomorrow because I'm taking off the weekend and can't eat it all. I think that's a decent surplus for a dozen or so plants from my backyard.

Maybe off topic, but I think it's related. When I was still living in Florida while on the freeway I literally see the bus with the immigrants they're hauling in to do the pickings. I don't know how pervasive it is anymore, but in the past they get sprayed on while picking.

[Solanum315]

Now that I my tomatoes are starting to ripen and I transition away from grocery store tomatoes for a few months, I am reminded again of how poorly commercial varieties compare to what you can grow in your garden. There is nothing that prevents an unstabilized hybrid from tasting as good as an OP. I am sure those who are doing growouts in the dwarf project can attest to this. However, my understanding is that the uniform ripening gene is more responsible than anything else for the lack of taste in commercial varieties.

See attached picture. A Korean commercial variety that I have since stabilized. It is firm and productive but as you can tell, it ripens from the blossom end up. In terms of flavor, it holds it's own when compared to any OP I have grown.