Sabre Ukrainian

[jsamaha]

Anyone have any personal experience growing Sabre Ukrainian tomato? Most of my tomato varieties have plenty of of open blooms, but this guy seems to be lagging behind. The flowers seem slow to open. Thanks for the info!

[carolyn137]

Originally Posted by jsamaha

Anyone have any personal experience growing Sabre Ukrainian tomato? Most of my tomato varieties have plenty of of open blooms, but this guy seems to be lagging behind. The flowers seem slow to open. Thanks for the info!

I've not grow it but I know one person here at Tville who has and will perhaps be able to answer you.

I was going to offer to link you to Tania's T base about this variety but that wouldn't tell you about a lag in slow blossoms, but it is a late variety. I was going to also offer to share with you what those who list it in the SSE YEarbook say about it but that won't answer your question either.

I don't know of any information anywhere that says this variety is Ukrainian in origin. Could you please say more about that? What information I know says that Glenn Drowns at Sandhill Preservation originally got this variety from Don Branscomb of CA in 1985 but where he got it from is not known.

[jsamaha]

The only information I can share with you can be read at Amishland seeds where i made the purchase. The variety was listed as SABRE UKRAINIAN, and she does mention that it is a bit slow but ends up being prolific. I was interested to see what other people had experienced. Thanks for the response.

[nctomatoman]

Oh oh....Amishland historical creativity strikes again, perhaps? I got Sabre in one of my very first SSE trades. Just Sabre. No Ukrainian.

[Suze]

Originally Posted by nctomatoman

Oh oh....Amishland historical creativity strikes again, perhaps? I got Sabre in one of my very first SSE trades. Just Sabre. No Ukrainian.

What she shows on the site is an elongated red paster, nothing like the Sabre I've grown and like.

[jsamaha]

Well, I guess I'll know soon enough..... or I'll just rip it up and make room for something more predictable. Space is limited to twelve or so plants, so everyone counts! Thanks for the responses!

[carolyn137]

Originally Posted by jsamaha

Well, I guess I'll know soon enough..... or I'll just rip it up and make room for something more predictable. Space is limited to twelve or so plants, so everyone counts! Thanks for the responses!

http://tatianastomatobase.com/wiki/Sabre

Above is what Sabre should be and Tatiana is from the former USSR and knows her tomatoes very well. She does not list a Ukrainian Sabre.

There is a long red paste type in the current SSE YEarbook called Ukrainian Poet, offered initially in 2002 by SSE itself.

The information at Amishland is not to be trusted and that's what nctomatoman is alluding to. Long descriptions, rare, hard to get, adjective after adjective over the top hype, and on and on, just to indicate that something is special, which in many cases is not true. But she renames so many varieties it's hard to tell what something once was.

At the site currently are the varieties Amish Potato Leaf and Todd County Amish and when I read those descriptive backgrounds I gulped b'c I was the one who introduced both varieties, as sent to me by Doug from MN who also posts here. By introduce I mean listing them in the SSE YEarbook. Doug and I decided on the variety names together.

Perhaps now you realize why Amishland is not listed in the seed sources in that Forum here at Tville.

[nctomatoman]

Not to mention having to pay 4 dollars or more for "8 hand selected organic seeds" of whatever. As in whatever that means, or whyever they are that costly!

[Andrey_BY]

I believe Sabre is a Russian CV called Sabelka which can be translated as Small Sabre in English. The fruit has got a relly long height (up to 20 cm) and elongated paste shape with a pointed end. I grew it 3 years ago. it is quite prolific, but not juicy as I like. Bred by Russian commercial vendor Gisok.

Why Ukrainian? I think it is because Amishland girl has some friends from Ukraine and they can buy most of Russian CVs in Ukrainian seed shops like here we do in Belarus.

Sabelka

[carolyn137]

Andrey, Don Branscomb had it in 1985. Would Sabelka, being a CV, have been available prior to that time?

[RonnyWil]

I purchased some from Amishland year before last and of the 30 varieties I grew that year, they were the only ones that never germinated.

[Andrey_BY]

Carolyn, Sabelka is not what Sabre (Don Branscomb's) is but what jsamaha was asking us about being named Sabre Ukrainian. Sabelka is quite young variety from late 90s/early 2000s I believe.

[carolyn137]

Originally Posted by Andrey_BY

Carolyn, Sabelka is not what Sabre (Don Branscomb's) is but what jsamaha was asking us about being named Sabre Ukrainian. Sabelka is quite young variety from late 90s/early 2000s I believe.

So, what Lisa is offering at Amishland is really a commercial variety called Sabelka, which is a long red paste type, but she calls it Sabre Ukrainian, and what others know as just Sabre, sourced to Don Branscomb in 1985, is a large pink fruited variety.

This is what Lisa said about Sabelka:

(-Pointy shape- I grew out this great all purpose heirloom tomato from a few seeds I received in a seed trade from a lady's Grandmother who lives in the Ukraine (formerly in Russia). Very compact )

So apparently she changed Sabelka, a commercial variety, into an heirloom variety as I see it.

Andrey, I don't want to make you feel bad, b'c I know when you sent seeds to Lisa you didn't know enough about her to be more cautious, but when I reread the stuff she said about Orange-1, which you had sent to me and others I couldn't help being upset. And yes, Orange-1 is available elsewhere.

When I read the descriptions of all that she lists from the former USSR, now the CIS, I have to wonder what they might really be b'c as we say here in the US, perhaps the names have been changed to protect the innocent.

And that comment also applies to many others she lists and that includes the two of mine I mentioned above; Todd County Amish and Amish Potato Leaf.

Well I remember when she listed Green Grape as Eenie Weenie Greenie, or something like that, and Cherokee Purple as Native American.

it just makes me mad, really, that she does what she does with names and histories and also prices, but what can any of us do about it. We've tried in the past. She was invited to GW several years ago, appeared and fully admitted she makes changes and is over the top with histories, some not true, and said she did it for PR ( public relation) purposes so that her varieties appeared to be unique.

There are those who would say who cares about proper identification and histories as long as the variety tastes great. And that's being said about Amazon Chocolate. I wonder what Amazon Chocolate really is. I know, I know, I'm probably too concerned with varieties being described correctly but that's just the way I am and I know that there are many others here who feel the same way as I do, and you're one of them Andrey, as is Tania, so thanks for all the information that you both share with us concerning many varieties that come from your part of the world.

[Duh_Vinci]

Originally Posted by carolyn137

.... And that's being said about Amazon Chocolate. I wonder what Amazon Chocolate really is. ...

Carolyn,

This year, a friend of mine shared few seeds of Amazon Chocolate with me: RL he bought from Lisa, and PL leaf he received from someone else.

Never grown either one, so one of each plants are in the ground. So what is the real name should be of Lisa's version of Amazon you'd think?

Regards,
D

[carolyn137]

Originally Posted by Duh_Vinci

Carolyn,

This year, a friend of mine shared few seeds of Amazon Chocolate with me: RL he bought from Lisa, and PL leaf he received from someone else.

Never grown either one, so one of each plants are in the ground. So what is the real name should be of Lisa's version of Amazon you'd think?

Regards,
D

If you go to Tania's data base she clearly says that Amazon Chocolate is not genetically stable based on both fruit size and shape as well as leaf form.

You're asking me what Amazon Chocolate might have been? I don't have a clue, quite frankly.