Forum area for discussing hybridizing tomatoes in technical terms and information pertinent to trait/variety specific long-term (1+ years) growout projects.
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#1 |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 568
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I'm interested in the ripening inhibitor genes rin and nor. Any experience out there? Same with the high pigment genes hp1 or hp2. I had hp2 dg this year, and as a homozygote it was pretty grim - maybe it was the backgound? I'll be interested in any learnings from TV growers. thanks
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#2 |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: WI, USA Zone4
Posts: 1,887
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You might find something of interest in these reports:
http://tgc.ifas.ufl.edu/onlinevo.htm PS: use the search engine and type in rin,nor,hp1,hp2,etc. I would email one of the members for answers to your questions |
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#3 | |
Moderator Emeritus
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Upstate NY, zone 4b/5a
Posts: 21,169
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OK, so it ripened up as small ovals with the most beautiful coloration I've ever seen. Swirls of red/orange/pink/gold describe the exterior coloration. However, I found out what it was when I harvested the first few fruits b'c they were hard as rocks, stayed that way and I needed an axe , almost, to break one open to get the seeds out. Forget about eating it. Someone at the time told me that it had rin or nor, that before I knew that much about those genes. I listed it in the SSE YEarbook hoping that someone could get that coloration into something that could be eaten but not one person requested the seeds. I still have them somewhere in a vial and right now can't even tell you how old those seeds are, but if this variety interests you please let me know and if I can find the seeds I can send some to you and you can try to germinate them. My best record in waking up old tomato seeds is 20 yo seeds and I know these aren't that old, maybe 15 yo? ![]() Somewhere I also have something that's supposed to have the high crimson gene, or one of them, supposed to have a gold band that runs through the center of the petals. If the genes you mention are related to the high crimson gene, you'd know, I can look for that one as well if you want me to. Something in the back of my wee brain tells me that the High Crimson one was initially bred in Canada.
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Carolyn |
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#4 |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 568
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Carolyn - I'd love to give it a try. If you can find the seed, I'll try and germinate this spring. I agree this could be an interesting parent in crosses.
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#5 | |
Moderator Emeritus
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Upstate NY, zone 4b/5a
Posts: 21,169
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Mark, I was at the Tomordori site so decided to look it up which sent me to Ventmarin, but the picture shown for what I know as Dourne d Hivre, they spell it Hiver, is not what I grew and they say nothing about it at all as to long keeping, etc. So I went back to some of my older SSE YEarbooks and found my listing for it which goes like this: Dourne d'Hivre, 75-85 days, large indet, reg leaf, 2-3 oz ovals, rock hard with gorgeous coloration of a red, salmon, yellow, pink blend, no taste, somebody please cross it to save the colors and add taste. From Norbert Parreira of France. I did a huge trade with him in 1992 and got many varieties that are now tomato household names. I tried to contact him many times after that to ask a few questions and got no answer, ever.
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Carolyn |
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#6 |
Moderator Emeritus
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Upstate NY, zone 4b/5a
Posts: 21,169
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I found it!!!!
And am I ever glad b'c since I last posted I've been somewhat obsessed with finding it to tell you the truth. And as I visualized it I was right. The seeds were in a plastic screw cap scintillation vial which I used for all of my saved seeds until about 1995 and it had a white tape label with the variety written in black ink. The seeds look good and I'll e-mail you about it. Since the variety called Dourne D'Hiver at Ventmarin is definitely NOT what I have as Dourne d'Hiver but the name itself, hiver, means winter in French, makes a lot more sense in terms of rin or nor than does the red OP at Ventmarin. And Ventmarin isn't always correct, but I do find it to be a wonderful resource site. So I'll either PM you or e-mail you b'c we need to talk a bit about when to start trying to germinate these seeds, which are from 1993. I listed the variety in the YEarbook for 1994 and got not one request so what's in the vial is what I got in 1993 by smashing open quite a few fruits and a rough count suggests about 100 seeds. My own record is waking up 22 yo seed, so we'll see what happens when you do it, and not all 22 yo seed is wakeable uppable. I still remember reading about the documented record on waking up old tomato seed and that occurred when the precursor to the USDA stations was at Cheyenne Wyoming and the germplasm was moved to Ames, IA. When they tested the tomato seed in Ames they were able to wake up one variety where the seed was 50 yo and those seeds had been stored in WY just in a file cabinet at ambient temps.
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Carolyn |
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#7 |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 568
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It's worth a try Carolyn. I'm all ears on germination hints.
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#8 | |
Moderator Emeritus
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Upstate NY, zone 4b/5a
Posts: 21,169
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While I was looking for Dourne d' Hiver I also ran across my High Crimson seeds, the one released in Canada in 1963 as the first high pigment variety as I recall. I don't know if that would be any use to you at all. It's ogc/ogc as you probably know and I think the hp1 and hp2 genes came later and are different.
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Carolyn |
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#9 |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 568
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I've have several crimson lines this year, mostly from Randy. None with hp genes though.
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#10 |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Poland
Posts: 251
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Was this cross succesfull?
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#11 |
Moderator Emeritus
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Upstate NY, zone 4b/5a
Posts: 21,169
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No one took me up on my SSE listing for it, so no crosses there.
I sent the seeds to Mark and a few germinated but it took a long time, as I had expected b'c of the seed age, so they were put out late. too late for ripe fruits to form, not even close, so no crosses there either/ Carolyn
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Carolyn |
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#12 |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: May 2013
Location: glendora ca
Posts: 2,560
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Sounds interesting i cant wait to see what comes of these two varieties.
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“Enter by the narrow gate; for wide is the gate and broad is the way that leads to destruction, and there are many who go in by it. Because narrow is the gate and difficult is the way which leads to life, and there are few who find it." |
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#13 | |
Moderator Emeritus
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Upstate NY, zone 4b/5a
Posts: 21,169
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Tania doesn't list it, a Google search sent me to Tomodori which directs you elsewhere: http://tomodori.com/tomatoes.php?VAR...urne+D%27Hiver Luc Fichet has passed away and Ventmarin is a data base and no seeds are sold. I have no ideawho might have inherited Fichet's tomato collection, perhaps one of out French Tville members might know. I didn't search more, so I have to wonder if seeds for it are still available.........somewhere. Carolyn
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Carolyn |
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#14 | |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: May 2013
Location: glendora ca
Posts: 2,560
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__________________
“Enter by the narrow gate; for wide is the gate and broad is the way that leads to destruction, and there are many who go in by it. Because narrow is the gate and difficult is the way which leads to life, and there are few who find it." |
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#15 | |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Spain
Posts: 416
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