Big zac

[coloken]

I have two big zacs started in small pots. One has 3 stems. I dont know if from one seed or seeds were stuck together. The other has 3 stems and one is defiantly PL. Others are defiantly RL. I wonder if throw back?. Any one know the source of big zac? The PL is twice the size of the others and is tempting to grow out.
Kenny

[travis]

I remember back when Big Zac was all the rage, when seeds were 50 cents each, when it was impossible to get correct F1 seeds, when a commercial vendor was distributing wrong seeds, when Bully was sending out F2 "Sad Sac" seeds (LOL), and when Totally Tomatoes finally got the right F1 seeds back in the market (supposedly), on and on. This is the first time in over a year I've even seen mention of Big Zac, and I'm waiting for Carolyn137 to give us her list of open pollinated varieties that will compete with BZ for monster size fruit (smile).

[carolyn137]

Originally Posted by travis

I remember back when Big Zac was all the rage, when seeds were 50 cents each, when it was impossible to get correct F1 seeds, when a commercial vendor was distributing wrong seeds, when Bully was sending out F2 "Sad Sac" seeds (LOL), and when Totally Tomatoes finally got the right F1 seeds back in the market (supposedly), on and on. This is the first time in over a year I've even seen mention of Big Zac, and I'm waiting for Carolyn137 to give us her list of open pollinated varieties that will compete with BZ for monster size fruit (smile).

Well you can jsut wait, maybe forever Travis, on any list that I'm going to put forward of OP varieties that match and exceed the promises of Big Zac.( smile)

Lord knows there are enough threads here at Tville and elsewhere about Big Zac. And I remember all that you've mentioned Travis, but you forgot the appearance of Minnie Zaccariah ( sp) at GW which was quite a thread as I remember it; she was asked to make an appearance and did. When you've got the old TT owned by Wayne Hilton saying to rogue out this and that and the seeds were supposed be F1 seeds that's a serious problem

Kenny, where are your seeds from that are giving you PL foliage and multiple stems. Doesn't sound good at all.

[travis]

In all the hundreds of seeds I started this year, I only got one that was truly fuzed, two stems that couldn't be separated, and seemed to be a true twin. I did get one other sprout that had 4 perfect cotyledons, and appeared to be trying to look twin, but it had a single stem. I also have one plant that has a fasciated stem that forks into two equal and identical stems, but one stem became fully determinate after five blossom clusters, and the other stem bore no flowers at all. Bottom line, if you start enough seeds from enough diverse open pollinated varieties, you're liable to see just about anything, I guess.

[coloken]

First, I am not bitten by advertising of any thing. I try BZ just like I have tried many others.
Second, I have no idea where I got the seed last year. I moved since. It was such a dismal failure last year I gave it a second chance.
When I move it, I will see if it is really multiple stems. If it is, and one is PL, will the tomatoes be different?
And last: if some thing has been talked about many times before and should be dropped...how about banning talk about medicare and rain and a dozen others things that have been talked to death.

[BigdaddyJ]

I have been growin BZ for years. I got the seeds directly from Minnie. She saved me some seed from a 5.25 pound BZ tomato and encouraged me to grow them out and save seed year to year. I have done that. I have never gotten a PL. Nor a twin of any kind. They have been breeding as true as any OP I have ever grown. The only other variety that rivals it in size is Burpee's Porterhouse and I have tried many of the "Super Big" varieties on Carolyn's list but not all of them. This has been my experience for about 10 to 12 years now since I got Minnie's seeds.

[carolyn137]

Originally Posted by coloken

First, I am not bitten by advertising of any thing. I try BZ just like I have tried many others.
Second, I have no idea where I got the seed last year. I moved since. It was such a dismal failure last year I gave it a second chance.
When I move it, I will see if it is really multiple stems. If it is, and one is PL, will the tomatoes be different?
And last: if some thing has been talked about many times before and should be dropped...how about banning talk about medicare and rain and a dozen others things that have been talked to death.

Kenny, all I was trying to say is that most folks grow Big Zac only b'c it's been advertised as giving very large fruits and Minnie herself won several of the NJ contests with it which is why Wayne Hilton pursued her to allow him to sell Big Zac F1 seeds.

No one said the subject should be dropped. Travis said he hadn't seen any thread about BZ in a long time and nor have I and I presume many others.

So please, do understand that no one was saying to you it shouldn't be discussed, just saying that it hasn't been discussed in a long time, and finally, absolutely no one suggested dropping the subject as you can see by a review of the posts above.

So lets go on from here without looking back, which does no good. And since you're growing BZ as you would any other tomato variety, as you said above, I hope you share with is what you think about the taste in particular since you've indicated you aren't especially growing it for fruit size.

With that PL in there it does sound like your seed source could have been a trade of some kind and possibly crossed seeds, but not original F1 seeds that TT is now offering.

So let us know what you get from the plants.

[barkeater]

Zac is back! I'm growing it again this year to see if I can duplicate the great tomatoes I got in '06 and '07. They were perfect, big, round, delicious beefsteaks with hardly a crack. I can look it up as one year I weighed everything and I probably got 5-6 two to three pounders off my one plant. Then we had the cold dark wet years of '08 and '09 and Big Zac didn't like that.

[coloken]

Sorry if my sore toe showed. (Yes, I do have one , The right big one.)The first two responces had nothing to do wih the reason I posted about BZ, but were just comments on past history. which I hope is dead and gone.
Maybe BZ can stand on its own merits with out all the BS. We will see.
The PL may be a stray seed, but to have two pots both with idenical 3 stems seems strange. Soon I will remove them to the garden and bisect the roots to make sure.

[lubadub]

Big Zac may not be discussed here but then again this is not where most of the giant tomato growers hang out. Most if not all tomato growers in the Great Pumpkin Commonwealth, big pumpkin growers, grow either Big Zac or some variant of Big Zac, Big Zac F1 up to F6. The largest tomato grown with Big Zac seed was 2 years ago and was 7+ pounds. Another tomato over 7 pounds was grown last year using Delicious seed. This was grown by Phil and Jane Hunt in Canada. The BZ offshoot 7+ was grown by Nick Harp in Ohio. These tomatoes were weighed at supervised weighoffs and their pictures are on line for those interested. Big Zac is still out there and being grown by those going for big. Phil Hunt getting a 7+ tomato out of Delicious was a surprise to many. Lots of people received and will be growing seeds from Phil Hunt's giant this year. Stay tuned.

Marv

[carolyn137]

Originally Posted by lubadub

Big Zac may not be discussed here but then again this is not where most of the giant tomato growers hang out. Most if not all tomato growers in the Great Pumpkin Commonwealth, big pumpkin growers, grow either Big Zac or some variant of Big Zac, Big Zac F1 up to F6. The largest tomato grown with Big Zac seed was 2 years ago and was 7+ pounds. Another tomato over 7 pounds was grown last year using Delicious seed. This was grown by Phil and Jane Hunt in Canada. The BZ offshoot 7+ was grown by Nick Harp in Ohio. These tomatoes were weighed at supervised weighoffs and their pictures are on line for those interested. Big Zac is still out there and being grown by those going for big. Phil Hunt getting a 7+ tomato out of Delicious was a surprise to many. Lots of people received and will be growing seeds from Phil Hunt's giant this year. Stay tuned.

Marv

Yes Marv, BZ has been discussed here before, but not in the detail that you go into in your book or your threads/posts at other message sites, especially of the newest developments, some of which you related above.

Am I correct in assuming from your threads/posts elsewhere that most folks interested in growing tomatoes for large size primarily would have by now found those specific sites or would it be helpful if you linked to the main ones so folks who don't know about them can also participate there if growing large tomatoes is their major interest?

I said to myself, self, when did Marv ever post here before, so checked and in 5 years you've made 11 posts. You can do better than that, ahem, b'c it isn't all about growing large tomatoes you know.

Glad to see you here and I think I still owe you some black tulip bulbs, or something like that but I can't remember why.

[lubadub]

Thanks Carolyn. You may find it hard to believe, but for some, it is all, if not mostly, about growing big tomatoes. And some big tomatoes do have a great taste. And one of those big tomatoes with a great taste is Big Zac. I have often wondered if you have ever actually bitten into one? If not, I will send you one after you send me those black tulips. LOL Marv

[travis]

So, it seems from what Marv is saying that Big Zac should be bred into one of the Dwarf Project lines. That might expand the giant tomato opportunities to those people who only can grow in patio containers.

[carolyn137]

Originally Posted by lubadub

Thanks Carolyn. You may find it hard to believe, but for some, it is all, if not mostly, about growing big tomatoes. And some big tomatoes do have a great taste. And one of those big tomatoes with a great taste is Big Zac. I have often wondered if you have ever actually bitten into one? If not, I will send you one after you send me those black tulips. LOL Marv

Here's the way I see it Marv.

I don't see you participating much at the general message sites that many of us do, so you may have actually thought that most or all folks want to grow large tomatoes, but you would be wrong. You can handle it.

But almost always there are individual threads asking for feedback on which varieties folks recommend for trying to grow the big ones.

For sure many large fruited varieties have great taste, no question about it. And taste is both personal and perceptual and there's actually a human genetic component involved, so folks will taste fruits of the same variety differently, let alone all the other variables that factor into taste.

No, I've never tasted a Big Zac fruit but have followed the feedback at several sites since Wayne Hilton started offering it at TT which he sold to Jung's a few years back I have a pretty good idea of the fruit size most folks get and what they think of the taste.

Now we have a problem here. I'd love to send you those black tulip bulbs but the tulips weren't black. So I guess I'm out of luck in having you send me ONE BZ fruit, but of course if you want to relent based on the help I once gave you re "D", ahem, you could send me some seeds for those 7 # ones.

[carolyn137]

Originally Posted by travis

So, it seems from what Marv is saying that Big Zac should be bred into one of the Dwarf Project lines. That might expand the giant tomato opportunities to those people who only can grow in patio containers.

Did Marv say that?

Marv, did you say or imply that?

Well why not use it in the Dwarf Project along with some of the other large fruited ones they've been using?