Updates/Corrections, my seed offer

[carolyn137]

Posting in this general discussion Froum is about the only way that I can reach participants in my seed offer since I know that few ever look at the seed offer again, but do tend to post when their seeds arrive.

First, on seed packs I keep spelling one variety two different ways and only one way is correct. I've been spelling it Podarok sometimes and Podorok other times.

Podarok is correct and it really is Podarok Fei, which roughly translated means gift from a fairy so I remembered when looking at another thread here where Tania had spoken about it when I asked her a question about another one also named Podarok. And Andrey posted in the same thread that what I had was Podarok although he forgot to write the Fei part on his seed pack to me.

So please correct the labels on your seed packs to Podarok Fei if you requested that variety.

On Monday another 20 to 25 requests go out, and in the middle of the afternoon when I reached for the next letter, I saw a pack of Vince P1 already labeled and taped shut by me which means it had seeds in it.

I opened a few letters with outgoing seeds to see if I shorted someone, and then said what the heck am I doing b'c then I had to use a new envelope and stamps, not a problem really. But a few of you will be getting seeds back not in the stamped enveope that you sent to me.

So if you requested Vince P1 and you didn't get it let me know, it would be only one person. And it's just as likely that I packed two coin envelopes with Vince P1 and all is well.

So this refers only to seeds sent on Monday with that postmark/

It's also become clear to me that folks who requested some from the EXPERIMENTAL group didn't really undertstand that those were possibly not stable and I did add more seeds, b'c more plants have to be put out to see if all are the same and approaching or are at genetic stability. So you don't want to put out just one plant.

I hope that helps.

As for me, I've had it for the day and intend to watch some action from the Australian tennis open tonight.

[tam91]

Thanks for the update.

Watching the tennis here also - who are you rooting for?

[travis]

Just goes to prove you can't watch two people batting a bouncing ball back and forth across 2,808 square feet and keep track of packing seeds at the same time.

Now football, on the other hand ...

[carolyn137]

Originally Posted by travis

Just goes to prove you can't watch two people batting a bouncing ball back and forth across 2,808 square feet and keep track of packing seeds at the same time.

Now football, on the other hand ...

OK Travis, let me tell you like it is.

My large TV is in the front room and that's where the satellite box and the other stuff is. There's a wireless connection to the TV in the back room where I do pack tomato seeds.

So I turn on the TV in the front room to my favoite Sirius music station, wheel out to the back room, turn that TV on and have the music of my choice as I pack seeds.

Live broadcast from the Aussie Open doesn't start until 7 PM Eastern and then usually switches over to ESPN@ 9 PM.

And by about 4-5 PM my shoulders and neck are hurting, I know that would concern you, so I turn off the TV in the back room, fix dinner, go to the LV and listen to the music/read, until the tennis comes on.

Got the picture? No watching tennis while I pack tomato seeds.

Now about football. When I was living in Denver I was a political hack on the side and held two elected offices and that's how I got season tickets to the Brocos for several years. When I moved back East I just couldn't bond with the Patriots or the Bills, so kind of got out of the habit of watching football games, which are far too long anyway.

It's been a pleasure setting you straight on this, it really has.

And to end on a tennis note Tam asked who I was rooting for.

Tam, I just want to see some good tennis, but if pushed I'd like to see Nadal get over his psychological problems with Djokovic, see Tsonga or Murray get to the finals, maybe even del Potro, but Djokovic is playing very well indeed.

On the women's side Serena looks great, but so does Kvitova,now here's the tomato association. Despite her screaming I would like to see Victoria Azarenka win b'c she's from Belarus, Andrey is from Belarus and he and I have been talking about her a lot for several years now. If the name Andrey doesn't ring a bell for you think Orange Minsk.

Still with us Travis?

[tam91]

I've always loved Federer, but I really like Nadal too. And Tsonga and Murray, sure. Don't know why, but I've just never gotten excited by Djokovic (although of course he's an excellent player).

I don't follow the women as much, can't say I care for Serena. But I do remember you talking about Andrey, so I'm happy to cross my fingers for Victoria. And I'll hopefully be trying Orange Minsk this year.

[ddsack]

On the women's side Serena looks great, but so does Kvitova,now here's the tomato association. Despite her screaming I would like to see Victoria Azarenka win b'c she's from Belarus

I've cut down on watching the women's because of the screams, I just find it so irritating. I always cheer for whoever is quieter! I don't mind a low grunt of effort, but it's gotten way out of hand!

[travis]

Low grunts of effort vs screaming <

[tam91]

I hate the screaming in general also. One of the best comments I ever heard was from some British journalist or somthing. Referring to a match between two such women she said "From outside the stadium, it sounds like a cross between a brothel and a wildlife park".

[carolyn137]

Back to tomatoes.

My progress in getting seeds out to folks is going much slower than I ever anticipated and it's not that I'm not sitting at my tomato seed packing table for hours and hours every day. But I'm not going to go into all the reasons.

I've been doing one non-US one for every 10 US one but I've decded, after I looked at the non-US ones, that almost all are in much colder zones and won't be starting seed for at least a month and in several cases several months.

The main exception would be perhaps British Columbia in Canada.

So I'm going to do what I haven't done before and that's to riffle through the US envelopes and pick out the ones from the deep south first, b'c they still can sow seeds and mature plants this summer and be able to give feedback when I put up that late summer/early Fall performance/seeds true Thread.

I also have several persons to send seed to who have nothing to do with this seed offer, and those are mainly, but not exclusively, owners of seed companies where I've known the owners well and for a long time in most cases, as well as others not associated with this seed offer to whom I always exchange seeds with. I can also pick out the envelopes of several of those seed company owners as well, and I mean those who are also in warmer climates.

Lastly, there are a few varieties that I no longer have enough seed to fill requests so will have to go to alternates listed, but in many cases some folks indicated no alternates at all, but there's nothing I can do about that. It also means that in some cases I will not have enough seed to fill some SSE requests that come in depending on which varieties are requested.

But as I've said several times, I get no feedback from my SSE listings other than seeing if someone relists a variety and even that has steadily been going down for those of my friends who also SSE list.

So I'm reassessing what I might SSE list in the future.

Which means I'm depending on the partipants of my seed offer to partipate in the germination thread I'll put up in a bit as well as the later thread in early Fall for assessing true seed and performance.

I'll continue to update where I'm at with requests when it becomes necessary.

Thanks, and now back to bed.

[JLJ_]

Originally Posted by carolyn137

. . . as I've said several times, I get no feedback from my SSE listings other than seeing if someone relists a variety and even that has steadily been going down for those of my friends who also SSE list . . . Which means I'm depending on the participants of my seed offer to participate in the germination thread I'll put up in a bit as well as the later thread in early Fall for assessing true seed and performance.

You have mentioned variation in germination success -- which would always be expected -- but I wonder if some germination tips from you in your offer would improve results. Undoubtedly some who receive your seed offers have much experience with very old seeds, quite a few I suspect are like me, who have had pretty good success starting new and middle aged seeds, but who are very interested in your suggestions, and a fair number may not have a lot of experience starting seeds at all.

I was about to post a question for you in your 2012 seed offer thread concerning your recommendations for starting old seeds but thought that this might be a better place -- especially as, as I understand it, there is no reason that "difficult seed" procedures would not also optimize results with new seeds.

Not that everyone would use such procedures -- and there is value, of course, in knowing which seeds germinate well using a "throw them at the ground and stand back" approach, or some other -- but only value to you if you know what approach was used.

Anyway, what I was going to ask was . . . in your 2011 offer, and several other places, you outline your suggestions for improving the odds when starting difficult seeds -- I combined your comments from several threads to create the summarized instruction below and wondered if it accurately represents your view.

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To Start Old, Rare, or Low-Germination-Rate Tomato Seeds

Double or triple sow to be sure you get enough plants and sow a total of no less than 6-8 seeds.

Prepare a labeled container for each variety (I use new small Dixie cups), with water containing a pinch of blue stuff, MG or Peters or the like, or a few drops of liquid seaweed or fish emulsion. Add the seeds, stirring to be sure the seeds sink, and soak for 18 hours before planting.

After sowing the seed I continue to water when necessary with a dilute solution of one of the above products mentioned.

Depending on variables, other than seed age, that I can't define, I've had to wait many times more than a month and often a couple of months before I saw any germination, and sometimes no germination at all.

Seed germination is known to involve the nitrate ion, which is why the added MG or Peters or the liquid seaweed or fish emulsions, all of which have higher nitrate concentrations. Many years ago I used to use K nitrate (some know it as saltpetre) but the products I used above seemed to be a bit better, at least with much older tomato seeds.

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Points not included because I couldn't find anywhere you had directly addressed them.

At what temperature range do you keep the sowed, unsprouted seedlings? Does this change after sprouting?

Some suggest short term soaking in bleach solution, then rinsing, to weaken the seed coat to hasten germination and to reduce chances of decay before germination. Does that seem wise to you, and if so, what strength solution and what soak duration would you use?

What do you use for a planting medium? Is it best to have this moistened and ready before putting the seeds in to soak?

[carolyn137]

First, there are no old seeds in my 2012 seed offer. I mentioned that there were in previous ones and suggested that if someone was interested in a challenge that they could look at the ones in my 2011 offer, which go back to 2003 and contact me in the summer about what they might want to fool around with to see how germination goes with them.

THe oldest seeds in my 2012 offer are the three from 2007, Danko, Tsar=Kolokol and Anna Maria's Heart and I don't consider 5 yo seeds old. On each pack of those I wrote to double sow and sent enough seeds and to also consider soaking o/n before double sowing the seed.

As to what I personally do with much older seeds, I have posted what I do, but it isn't relevant with this seed offer as I see it.

I always use artificial mix, my faves aren't necessarily what others use, but I prefer Fafard or Pro Mix or Jiffy Mix, treat the seeds as I've already posted and sow the seeds and keep them at ambient room temp.

In the past I've tried cold tea, microwaving, saltpetre, gibberellic acid and on and on, always doing controls to see if there was a difference and I always had lots of really old seed around to play with since I've not discarded any saved seeds since 1991.

But it's this 2012 seed offer we're concerned with and the oldest seeds are just those three from 2007 and I've wriiten on each pack of those my suggestion to maybe soak first and then double sow and have sent enough seeds to do so.

All three of those 2007 ones are hearts and I'm not the only one who has found that heart varieties seem to lose seed viability quicker than do non-hearts. If they weren't hearts I wouldn't have even suggested the o/n soak and mentioned on the seed pack doouble sowing, but I know from previous seed offers that there can be a huge range of results from different folks with the same seeds, and there's really nothing I can do about it; it happens.

Does that help?

[JLJ_]

Carolyn, I wouldn't dream of suggesting that the seeds in your offer were old -- or anything else but a blessing upon all who receive them.

It is so kind of you to put out the effort to gather the seeds, wrestle with Word over the seed offer preparation (even though it hides your files until it makes you contemplate January journeys to the creek), answer quantities of emails about your offer, then carefully process hundreds of little coin envelopes to distribute your seed . . . and to achieve all of that in spite of dual feline supervision is an astonishing accomplishment.

Appreciatively,
JLJ