Forum area for discussing hybridizing tomatoes in technical terms and information pertinent to trait/variety specific long-term (1+ years) growout projects.
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#1 |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Pasadena, CA
Posts: 33
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I remember someone on this forum or another one had a formula to estimate the weight of the F1 cross based on the weight of the parents. Does someone know what I am talking about? It was like the square root of the addition of the weights divided by something. haha
I wanted to test on data from my 1st F1 hybrid last year, Fiaschetto di Manduria x Cherokee Chocolate. Fiaschetto is usually about 15-20 grams and Cherokee Chocolate is about 283 grams. The hybrid was measured to be 73 grams. |
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#2 |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: England
Posts: 512
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Lol, unfortunately I have no formula involving square roots and such. In my experience it is intermediate between the two parents but closer to the smaller parent, which is pretty much what you describe in yours. With so many genes affecting fruit size and weight I doubt there could be a formula that would be accurate in all cases, but if there is I would love to hear it!
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#3 |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Cache Valley, N/E of The Great Salt Lake
Posts: 1,244
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Depends on the combining ability of the parents... Might be better, might be worse.
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#4 |
Moderator Emeritus
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Upstate NY, zone 4b/5a
Posts: 21,169
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All I know, which isn't much, is that in a cross small fruit size is dominant to large fruit size and I have no idea which genes are involved.
But when I look at the human kids born from a tall dad and a short mom, what I usually see, if they have enough kids to be able to draw some conclusions, ahem, is that shorter kids are in the majority. The reverse works as well. Yes, I've grown Fiaschetto and Cherokee Chocolate but I'm not one who deliberately crosses varieties. When I was much younger growing many hundreds of plants and varieties each year, I can't think of anyone who did it, say, as a hobby, that is, not for money. ![]() Carolyn
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Carolyn |
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#5 |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: minnesota
Posts: 175
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I read it here also. I can't find where it was but I do have it in my notes. The square root of a x b = f1 size. 3-4 ounces x 8-12 ounces, square root of 24-48=5-7 ounces. Some smart person here deserves the credit.
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#6 |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Pasadena, CA
Posts: 33
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Thanks Minnesota Mato! I think that was it!
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#7 | ||
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Pasadena, CA
Posts: 33
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#8 |
Tomatovillian™
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Evansville, IN
Posts: 2,984
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This method of estimating the projected fruit size (actually weight) of an F1 hybrid using its parental inputs's weights comes from Keith Mueller, a student of Dr. Randy Gardner at NCSU. Whether the method was used by Dr. Gardner or others at NCSU, I do not know.
I have used the formula with many of my own custom crosses and gotten fairly on point results, but not consistently ... possibly due to growing conditions year to year relative to soil moisture, ambient heat, rainfall, plant spacing, fertilizer regimens, etc. The one time the formula hit it on the nose was Green Giant x Yellow Submarine. Other times not as accurate, for what it's worth. |
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